I was thinking about doing the 3.8 sc swap untill i heard this sound clip. my question is do they actually sound like this. not only at high rpms, but at low rpms too. it sounds pretty throaty! http://www.gopc.com/F355/Engine/0to70mph.wav
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08:27 PM
PFF
System Bot
furious_fiero Member
Posts: 3028 From: Surrey,BC,CANADA Registered: Mar 2002
I think nothing matches the ferrari sound.. but the DOHC does sound nice, I'm sure someone will post a clip of theres or movies. I've seen them around not sure which threads though.
i have a movie of a Lumina with a DOHC on a dyno and you could listen to both and make up you own mind... I think the clip IS a DOHC.. but I have no where to host it, so if someone does.. ..? let me know and I'll send it to you to post.
------------------ 3.4 DOHC Turbo swap in progress
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10:13 PM
ryan.hess Member
Posts: 20784 From: Orlando, FL Registered: Dec 2002
yes, that's DKOV's wav clip from his website... It's a 3.4DOHC with glasspacks (don't quote me on this). Someone call him to this thread to straighten the details out
quote
Stevegibbs: And no a 3.4 dohc doesnt' sound like that cause thats what a Ferrari sounds like. Not a GM 3.4. Would you like to play again?? YES NO
Uhh... listen a little more closely. It's got the 60* rasp. Ever heard a F355? Sounds more like a screaming 4 cylinder on steroids. I've got a 14 second video clip (been posted before) of one if you'd like to see/hear. Take a listen to his 34tdc vids listed at http://www.gopc.com/F355/Engine/
[This message has been edited by ryan.hess (edited 02-06-2004).]
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10:22 PM
OutlawFiero Member
Posts: 262 From: San Diego,CA,USA Registered: Sep 2002
Yes that's Scott's 3.4 TDC ie DKOV motorsports. It is about 275 to 300 hp. And that is without a Turbo. People continually bash the 3.4 for thinking it is slow compared to the V8's, but as West Coast Fiero's 3.4 TDC turbo has proven this is one of the fastest combination's around. Wait until DKOV finishes his Turbo install and he will be pushing 450 hp. About 75 more than Chris West's, and his car has been known to beat skyline's. I bet in the near future 3.4 TDC Turbo's will be more and more common, and they will be putting up some low et's. In the 11's, seriously. I know my car will, or it will be sold.
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10:49 PM
PFF
System Bot
DKOV Member
Posts: 1564 From: Portland, OR, USA Registered: Mar 2001
i have a movie of a Lumina with a DOHC on a dyno and you could listen to both and make up you own mind... I think the clip IS a DOHC.. but I have no where to host it, so if someone does.. ..? let me know and I'll send it to you to post.
I do... send it to me
As for all this talk about it NOT being a 3.4L DOHC... C'Mon guys. You've GOT to be kidding me.
Are you really that sure it's NOT a 3.4L TDC/DOHC motor? Are you willing to put your "ear" and reputations on the line? Are you really prepared to call me a liar?
So I post vids and sounds of my car and there are people that are prepared to say that it is a Ferrari motor they are hearing?
This is just so funny... I have to laugh.
No ill will or feelings here... just humor. Really. Nobody take this as an attack, but don't be silly.
These are 3.4L TDC/DOHC motors and they ARE sweet.
It's just that you folks with 2.5s, 2.8s, 3.8s, even you V8s are living your lives below 5000 rpms... Sounds like this only come at 7000 or more
It's the very reason why a Twin Dual Cam Ferrari, yes a 3.5 L V8 (pretty small if you think about it) revving around 7500 sounds very similar to a Twin Dual Cam 3.4L revving at about 7500.
In fact, it's strange just how similar these motors REALLY are in design. They have 5 valves that are a little smaller than the 4 valves in the 3.4L TDC, both have four cams and both offer high revs and the song that comes with that.
MY car had been "enlarged" and now features 3.5L displacement, the SAME as a Ferrari motor, with 2 less cylinders.
Apparently, from what I am hearing, the 3.4L TDC/DOHC motor might just be the best kept secret in the automotive world. Ridiculed by those that don't know better and believed by those that have no reference. It's sad though... I think everyone should have one
Incidentally, those vids were all taken after I blew the synchros in 1st and 2nd gears so I'm only running about 4500 rpms in them. Even so, you can hear just how much MORE the motor has. I'll post some new ones once I get the Turbo completed. THEN you'll hear some SERIOUS revs!!! I build the motor to take 9500 prms this time around, although I'll never use it.
Let's hear some other folk's 3.4L TDCs and DOHCs. That way, it's not just about ME and my word.
Best,
DKOV -
EDIT - Forgot to mention that I had a REAL F355 Muffler on the car too
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[This message has been edited by DKOV (edited 02-06-2004).]
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11:05 PM
DKOV Member
Posts: 1564 From: Portland, OR, USA Registered: Mar 2001
And no a 3.4 dohc doesnt' sound like that cause thats what a Ferrari sounds like. Not a GM 3.4. Would you like to play again?? YESNO
I see how that can be confusing... That is my F355 Replica Build Diary, Engine Section, sound and vid files. But actually go and LOOK at the page, it shows my 3.4L TDC motor and it's build up to date. It also explains the similarities in the two motors and why I chose this to go in my F355 Replica.
That's funny...
DKOV -
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11:13 PM
DKOV Member
Posts: 1564 From: Portland, OR, USA Registered: Mar 2001
Dvok thats awesome. about what rpm were you turnin in that clip. as for a stock 3.4, about what rpm do the valves start to float. ive also heard that you have to get a custom chip burnt to get rid of the rev limiter?
I believe some TDCs sound like Ferraris. Mine does once in a while when I'm taking off from a light. Other than that it doesn't have the high pitched howl I was expecting, could just be mine. Actually it sounds more like a V8 under load below 3500 rpms or so.
------------------ Alan Frazier '86 GT-'92 3.4 TDC 5 speed(for sale) '84 2m4 daily driver '88 Silver coupe, auto For Sale
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11:29 PM
iwanna3.4dohc Member
Posts: 524 From: reynoldsburg, ohio, usofa Registered: Aug 2002
I believe some TDCs sound like Ferraris. Mine does once in a while when I'm taking off from a light. Other than that it doesn't have the high pitched howl I was expecting, could just be mine. Actually it sounds more like a V8 under load below 3500 rpms or so.
Are you running a stck or automatic? Anybody else have sound clips
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11:31 PM
NotAFieroAnyLonger Member
Posts: 4413 From: 75762/Texas/USA Registered: Dec 2003
Not all of us stay under 5000 My 3.5 sees 6500 on a regular basis. I love the sound of it but HATE the auto tranny. It sifts so smooth and seemless and SLOW that you can hardly even fell it shift even at 6500RPM. Yes this is good in my Intrigue but the 88 will definatly get a shift kit, LSD and some PCM reprograming to fix the shift points, shifting speed and firmness.
------------------
Rickady88GT QuadCam 3.5 V6
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12:23 AM
Fierobsessed Member
Posts: 4782 From: Las Vegas, NV Registered: Dec 2001
Friend of mine heard me leaving, I got on it a bit. He told me that the sound that my car made was something that he never would have expected to come out of a little Fiero.
Truth is, the 3.4 DOHC sounds just like a 2.8-3.4 at idle and up to 3000 or so, then the sound changes into something almost scary, up to 7000 or so. Im pretty anxious to get another one (with the supercharger!) It will sound like NOTHING youv'e ever heard before.
Listen to it again, doesn't it sound like a stock 2.8 while it launches?
[This message has been edited by Fierobsessed (edited 02-07-2004).]
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12:45 AM
California Kid Member
Posts: 9541 From: Metro Detroit Area, Michigan Registered: Jul 2001
I see how that can be confusing... That is my F355 Replica Build Diary, Engine Section, sound and vid files. But actually go and LOOK at the page, it shows my 3.4L TDC motor and it's build up to date. It also explains the similarities in the two motors and why I chose this to go in my F355 Replica.
Dvok thats awesome. about what rpm were you turnin in that clip. as for a stock 3.4, about what rpm do the valves start to float. ive also heard that you have to get a custom chip burnt to get rid of the rev limiter?
Stock, the valves won't float until around 8000 but custom springs will fix that. Keep in mind, 7000 - 7500 is probably all I'll ever push. The MSD has pins to rev limit the thing and mine are 7500 in line with the factory settings. I built the motor to take more, not to actually GIVE more
In the high rev clip, that's shifting at about 7K or maybe a touch higher. In the videos, I don't think I crossed 4500. It wont shift if I do. Well, wouldn't... new tranny is in there now
In the Videos, the second one I believe http://www.gopc.com/F355/Engine/34tdc2.mpg , is a rolling start to about 1500 rpms and than stomping the gas and watch how the car goes sideways!!! Even then, I dumped the off throttle at about 5K. Still pretty cool. Still sounds like a v6 too
DKOV -
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04:59 AM
DKOV Member
Posts: 1564 From: Portland, OR, USA Registered: Mar 2001
I believe some TDCs sound like Ferraris. Mine does once in a while when I'm taking off from a light. Other than that it doesn't have the high pitched howl I was expecting, could just be mine. Actually it sounds more like a V8 under load below 3500 rpms or so.
It's that 18 inch ehaust you have under there You need to get the F355 muffler stuffed under the car. That'll help
DKOV -
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05:01 AM
84se-Stock Member
Posts: 430 From: Bridgewater, Nova Scotia Registered: May 2003
DKOV, you've put together one great website. I learned alot about kit cars that I would not have known otherwise. That's definitely getting added to my favorites and getting you the Caleb stamp of approval. +
------------------ Caleb Sarty
Black '84 SE 4 speed with blue gauge conversion and small interior mods...Stock otherwise, but not for long.
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10:30 AM
DKOV Member
Posts: 1564 From: Portland, OR, USA Registered: Mar 2001
Since the last update, I've done very little to my car except motor work. Reason being that I've completed two other turnkey builds for folks, plus working on my Rally Car for this next season and am near completion of yet another kit car build for a member in CA. All that progress and none of it on my project car!!! LOL!!!
Anyway, it'll be nice when it's done.
Thanks for looking
DKOV -
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11:16 AM
84se-Stock Member
Posts: 430 From: Bridgewater, Nova Scotia Registered: May 2003
I have it but Decided not to use it. My kit is a very rare Mirage kit and it will actually take the real F355 rear glass, which is what I decided to use.
The MR2 glass is shaped entirely different and causes you to completely reshape the C-Pillars of the car to accept it. The end result is that it completely ruins the authnticity of the rear end of the car for me. I don't like it.
So... Real F355 window goes in there.
DKOV -
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02:51 AM
Will Member
Posts: 14250 From: Where you least expect me Registered: Jun 2000
It's the very reason why a Twin Dual Cam Ferrari, yes a 3.5 L V8 (pretty small if you think about it) revving around 7500 sounds very similar to a Twin Dual Cam 3.4L revving at about 7500.
EDIT - Forgot to mention that I had a REAL F355 Muffler on the car too
A 6 will NEVER sound like an 8, IMNSHO. I think your car's sound has to do with its muffler. Ferrari puts a LOT of development time into their cars to be sure that they have the "Ferrari sound". You inherited a lot of that when you put the Ferrari muffler on. You also got even fire banks from the 60 degree 6 architecture, which are another element of Ferrari sound.
I've spent the last two years daily driving a 4 cam V8 a foot from my shoulder with no sound insulation in the engine compartment and a 24" basically open exhaust. I know what V8 sounds like. To my ear your engine in the sound clip at the top of this thread sounds like it's only turning about 5500 RPM. You're not the only one. An S2000 at redline sounds like it's only turning 4500 RPM.
At 6,000 RPM, a V8 will produce 400 firing impulses per second, while a 6 cylinder will produce 300 and a 4 cylinder 200. That's where the difference in sound comes from... the difference in the number of cylinders and number of firing impulses per revolution. That's why a 6 will never sound like an 8.
There are a couple of other factors involved in the Ferrari sound... Ferrari uses 180 degree crankshafts in their V8's. This makes each bank like an independent 4 cylinder engine, which makes header and intake manifold design simpler. It also means that each exhuast pipe has the sound of one four cylinder coming from it, with the overall car having the sound of two timed four cylinder engines, which is the essence of a V8 with a 180 degree crankshaft, which in turn is the essence of Ferrari V8 sound. Also, Ferraris have pretty small unitary displacements (displacement per cylinder). Their cars used to be named for this... 250 LM has 250 cc's per cylinder (the fact that it has 12 cylinders is understood because it's a Ferrari). This means that the sound produce by each firing impluse is of a higher frequency than what would come from a larger cylinder. For instance the 355 has approximately 435cc's per cylinder, while the 3.4 TDC has approx 560 cc's per cylinder, which is actually closer to my Northstar at 570 cc's.
While it doesn't sound quite like a Ferrari, it does sound GOOD. It reminds me more of my engine on a low RPM day than a Ferrari, though.
------------------ '87 Fiero GT: Low, Sleek, Fast, and Loud '90 Pontiac 6000 SE AWD: None of the Above
Do that again, only mean it this time
[This message has been edited by Will (edited 02-08-2004).]
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10:23 AM
ryan.hess Member
Posts: 20784 From: Orlando, FL Registered: Dec 2002
Originally posted by Will: While it doesn't sound quite like a Ferrari, it does sound GOOD. It reminds me more of my engine on a low RPM day than a Ferrari, though.
Are you implying yours sounds like a Ferrari? (If so, I want sound clips NOW!!) Actually I've seen your video of you vs the mudstain, and your car just sounds like a glasspacked musclecar.... Wonder if there's any way around that...
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11:15 AM
NotAFieroAnyLonger Member
Posts: 4413 From: 75762/Texas/USA Registered: Dec 2003
Are you implying yours sounds like a Ferrari? (If so, I want sound clips NOW!!) Actually I've seen your video of you vs the mudstain, and your car just sounds like a glasspacked musclecar.... Wonder if there's any way around that...
It does sound more like a musclecar (like an LS1 impersonating a Ferrari), but I've got basically straight pipes and supertrapps with no disks on it now. When I get the headers and bump the rev limiter up 1500 RPM or so it ought to sound more like a Ferrari
------------------ '87 Fiero GT: Low, Sleek, Fast, and Loud '90 Pontiac 6000 SE AWD: None of the Above
Do that again, only mean it this time
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12:46 PM
ryan.hess Member
Posts: 20784 From: Orlando, FL Registered: Dec 2002
Originally posted by Will: It does sound more like a musclecar (like an LS1 impersonating a Ferrari), but I've got basically straight pipes and supertrapps with no disks on it now. When I get the headers and bump the rev limiter up 1500 RPM or so it ought to sound more like a Ferrari
Are you getting cams and/or springs from CHRfab? What's your revlimiter at now?
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01:01 PM
dykz34 Member
Posts: 23 From: Maple Grove, MN Registered: Feb 2003
I may not own a Fiero, but I do have the DOHC in my Lumina. You guys actually might be talking about my car earlier in this thread, I'm not too sure how many Lumina dyno videos are floating around. Incase anyone wants to see it, here is my video: http://www.dykz34.com/other/Dave%20dyno%20sm.mov Remember that it's in Quicktime format. The #'s during the video are wrong, the car made 179/173 the first pull, then 177/172 the 2nd pull, and the 3rd one was 175/172. The first pull I took the car to about 6k, the second pull was about to 6.5k, and the 3rd pull was all the way up to 6800. (Mind you it's an auto) FYI: the last pull, when I backed off, the wheels were spinning at 139mph!
Dave PS: The video is 9.6mb.
EDIT: My exhaust is stock piping w/ glasspacks in the video (I've changed it since then though).
[This message has been edited by dykz34 (edited 02-08-2004).]
The original file in this thread was taken from my car before I bought it. Nico put the microphone in the engine bay and recorded it. Its a 91 cutlass DOHC 5 speed. I took another one from inside the car with my single muffler flowmaster setup before I put the car away for the winter.
Yes this is good in my Intrigue but the 88 will definatly get a shift kit, LSD and some PCM reprograming to fix the shift points, shifting speed and firmness.
You need to get the F355 muffler stuffed under the car. That'll help 
