Dam.......... i cannot believe that this car is in a high school auto shop!! When i was in auto last year.... me and my friends would mess around with cars just for the fun of it, Hopefully no good for nothing punks touch this car......and hopefully it can be restored and used for show purposes like the blue one, AND get the specifications on the engine, turbo, intercooler, computer setup so that we can install the same set up on our 2.8 fieros .....ohh and BTW, Good job hyperv6 !!!! keep us posted! -Roy
------------------ I own an original yellow 1988 Pontiac Fiero GT, (wingless, currently purple) and very proud....Truly is.....Driving Exitement! Matching numbers GT #17889 of 26,402 made in 1988
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09:57 PM
RAREW66 Member
Posts: 1119 From: Davenport, IA USA Registered: Jun 2001
The car has a rollbar that was bolted in six places to the floor and to rear firewall.
The area that matches the odometer above the tach had an LED bar in it. I would assume that it was shift lights.
The front fuel cell is typical of all the Super Duty Cars Pontiac built. It had a manually contolled remote fuel pump that just pumped fuel down the the primary center tank. I also speculate that they used this front tank to balance the car out for handling.
A close up of the seat embroidery:
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10:33 PM
RAREW66 Member
Posts: 1119 From: Davenport, IA USA Registered: Jun 2001
A close up of the grill shows the inlets for brake cooling ducts and ducts that were pointed at the radiator. A second road light is in the grill that I did not notice on the blue car.
I really like the appearance of the one piece ground effects on the car.
The wheels are 16 inch, 8 wide in the rear and 7 wide in the front. The car had stock brakes in the front and upgraded caliper in the rear. An adjustable proportioning valve was used. The center caps were in the file cabinet in the instructors office.
Last but not least, the pictures of the car being donated to the school in 1989. The light bars on the roof were removed prior to delivery.
It appears that the school has been working on the car since I saw it. It is definately cleaner.
------------------ Fred Bartemeyer Chairman Heartland Fieros http://www.heartlandfieros.com 86 GT 4spd 26k miles 87 GT 5spd. Blue 37k miles 88 Silver T-Top Formula 275,000 miles 87 GT 5 spd Annette's Sunshine Driver 88 GT 5 spd Annette's Daily Driver
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10:44 PM
hyperv6 Member
Posts: 6099 From: Clinton, OH, USA Registered: Mar 2003
Thanks Fred, I was hoping you would jump in on this. I knew you would have better pictures than I had on the detail. I will save them in my file.
As for the cars, they were only built as a marketing tool for PPG, Auto Style/C&F Technology and Pontiac to show case what could be done with the new emerging plastics and space frames. Also Auto Style/C&F wanted to show their ability to build short rum cars and show cars along with supplying MFG with parts for production cars. C&F did provided parts for the 1978 Indy Pace car Corvettes and their copies.
As for the trunk these were not production cars and were only ment for race track use, not to look pretty or carry golf clubs. The trunks were neater originaly but full. They had to mount the electronics in the trunk due to under hood temps that killed them in short order.
As for the intake The other scoops were taken up by the intercooler and cooling ducts. They need them all and the under body ducts to keep it cool. I was quoted in 1985 that the oil temp would go over 300 degrees if the car was not kept moving. Road traffic made it difficult to street drive since you had to stop more often. They were more concerned what it looked like outside, they did not show the engine or trunk often. The cars were most always displayed with the trunks shut.
I know other turbos run hot but not this hot. I don't know why this car has such heat problems vs a Miller Woods turbo set up.
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11:03 PM
hyperv6 Member
Posts: 6099 From: Clinton, OH, USA Registered: Mar 2003
I can tell you why it got hoter under that car. There are no side decklid vents. They are both covered so no heat can escape. You dont' even know how much those side vents let out heat. It has nowhere to go when sitting still. When moving it can exit from under the car.
Really hate to see a piece of history like this end up in a high-school auto shop. I guess it could have been worse and went to the crusher or got cut up by the school. From the looks of it, it has survived in 3 times better shape than anything that would have gotten donated to my high school auto shop.
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05:14 AM
hyperv6 Member
Posts: 6099 From: Clinton, OH, USA Registered: Mar 2003
It did have side vents. The driver side had a fan pushing air into the intercooler while the right side did let out air.
The large opening in the deck lit was also a vent [really a grill from a Chrysler Lebaron] more than mde up for the lost vent on the left side.
They had provisions to also directed air under the car up and out the top even more so than the factory car.
I think it may be the location of the Turbo being so low on top of the tranny and with the intercooler on top of it? It's only a guess. Either way it had more vents than a stock GT
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07:23 AM
Black-Azz-GT Member
Posts: 2326 From: Florida Keys Registered: Oct 2003
------------------ -Chris - Custom Gun Metal 86 GT 3.4 5spd 3.4 SOLD & 4.9 being installed "It's too low, too rough, too loud, drinks gas, it's totally impractical, but damn good lookin. In other words, It's almost perfect!" Build up tread or MODS w/ Pics
Dang... I just can't get over seeing another one of these. I was attracted to the blue one the first time I saw it at the FOCOA Nat'ls in Michigan in '93... and even moreso at the 20th event last year. Thanks both of you for sharing all this with us!
....you know, if someone were to get a mold of that GTP fastback clip, there would then be an actual fastback that would utilize the stock notchie tail lamps. Maybe if you were to massage the design a little bit so it would use the quarter windows in the production fastbacks, and I could easily see folks lining up for them (me first ).
P.S. DAMN.....it just hit me....you could name it the GTP fastback (yeah, I know....an obvious name)
[This message has been edited by TI_3VOM (edited 07-23-2004).]
....you know, if someone were to get a mold of that GTP fastback clip, there would then be an actual fastback that would utilize the stock notchie tail lamps. Maybe if you were to massage the design a little bit so it would use the quarter windows in the production fastbacks, and I could easily see folks lining up for them (me first ).
P.S. DAMN.....it just hit me....you could name it the GTP fastback (yeah, I know....an obvious name)
Well... if all you're looking for is a fastback that utilizes notchie taillights, PISA already has something for you http://pisafierohq.com/body_panels/gtfx_conversion/ - but I too would still rather have the GTP fastback
At the 1997 Michigan Fiero fest there was a Silver GTP.. I remember being quite intrigued by the intake manifold , what happened to that car? I have pics around here somewhere..
Jim Davenport
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04:42 PM
hyperv6 Member
Posts: 6099 From: Clinton, OH, USA Registered: Mar 2003
Please post pictures of the car from 1997. Only 2 are accounted for at this point the blue and Red. The yellow that Ron located in Michigan is again lost? I would assume they are gone or if were lucky sitting in need of repair.
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09:23 PM
Jul 24th, 2004
Toddster Member
Posts: 20871 From: Roswell, Georgia Registered: May 2001
Nice find, but I'm not sure I would refer to it as the "original" or "first" GTP.
Back in '85 Pontiac had a show car that was all black and had what was essentially a DGP Stage II wide body kit on it that had the designation "GTP" etched on the notchy quarter windows. I've got pictures of it stored away somewhere, I'll have to dig them out.
So is there any way that you can buy or take the fiero away from this school? NO offence to the school but it probably is not safe there. This thing should be in a muesum or in someone's garage.
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06:04 PM
PFF
System Bot
FieroGTRwideboby Member
Posts: 591 From: Socal (Pasadena) Registered: Jun 2004
Nice find, but I'm not sure I would refer to it as the "original" or "first" GTP.
Back in '85 Pontiac had a show car that was all black and had what was essentially a DGP Stage II wide body kit on it that had the designation "GTP" etched on the notchy quarter windows. I've got pictures of it stored away somewhere, I'll have to dig them out.
Otherwise... very cool!
This car was built in 1983-84 I know of no other GTP older? That is why I refer to this car as the original. I know it was at least a year old when I sat in it back in August of 1985. He told me it was the first built in late 1983.
As in safe I have stressed to the instructor how important this is. He is going to speak to the administrator I spoke to and see if they can have a written document to only donate to a museum and not distroy the car. I plan to follow up on this.
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09:41 PM
Aug 5th, 2004
Fierobsessed Member
Posts: 4782 From: Las Vegas, NV Registered: Dec 2001
I like the body design on these cars, Heck I was fortunate enough to hop a ride in the blue one, Good ole SD4 with a 4.10-4 speed. I think that front end would have been a popular one if it was factory. Its kind of a mix between all the different fascias in a way.
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12:34 AM
Krhyme Member
Posts: 216 From: Kalamazoo, MI Registered: Jun 2004
Nothing against the GT but I always liked the front and the back of this car better than the 86 1/2-88 GT. Just my preferance for the smaller tail light I guess. It was more 348 like. But god is the rear deck heavy with all the glass and bondo they grafted on.
This thread is awesome! FYI? Fastbacks began in 86 the 86.5 only designated the changeover to 5 speed....?
From the appearance of this car it seems to have had plenty of use. I wonder about the "genius" whos design loaded the trunk with stuff which should be in the engine compartment? While I like the historical significance of this Fiero; the layout of the engine controls and air intake through the trunk is poor.
I agree the engine compartment seems to be a little jerry rigged. I wonder if the school would take a newer less rare car in trade? it seems a shame for such a rare car to be in a high school auto shop
------------------ LS1 v8 T-Top 87 GT
http://www.acxunlimited.com/ls1swap.htm
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09:14 PM
PFF
System Bot
doublec4 Member
Posts: 8289 From: Oakville, Ontario, Canada Registered: Jun 2003
I noticed on one of the pictures of the tag, AutoStyle of Grand Rapids was listed. I beleive this company is now out of business or has been bought out. AutoStyle/C&F Stamping was responseable for the IMSA Monzas. Remember them? I worked at a Pontiac dealer on 28th street and remember seeing truck loads of them go by on their way back to Detroit. AutoStyle also did a special version of the Chevrolet Celebrity. I dont remember the name but it was a nice package. I think I sold one when I was at a Chevrolet dealer. I think the company owner was Pat Whal. He was quite active a long time ago in the local SCCA club. C & F Stamping was a big supplier to GM for all the RIM parts when they first started using RIM. Their plant was over on 32nd and Brenton. It is still there and someone is manufacturing something in it, but I could not tell what and who. AutoStyle did some packages like SLP did later. Well this is all I can recall on them. I'll have to ask around about AutoStyle/C&F now that I know they were involved with the Fiero. I went to a community college that had a speciality car donated to it. Montcalm County Community College had a Shelby Mustang donated to it. It was the 500KR. It was one of the first ones off the line in Ionia, MI. You could tell that it was used(beat) by the media. I would drive it in an out of the shop some times and when you reved it above idle the oil pressure dropped to almost 0. They also had a pre 500 rolling chassis there also. I believe they sold it after the time limit was up. Well gotta get to bed. It's late and I can't type or spell correctly.
[This message has been edited by solotwo (edited 08-08-2004).]
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12:23 AM
Aug 14th, 2004
RAREW66 Member
Posts: 1119 From: Davenport, IA USA Registered: Jun 2001
I had a chance to spend some time with the Blue #2 Car at the GM Warehouse on Tuesday. I took pictures of specific items and looked for differences between the #1 Red Car and the #2 car. I found a few.
The grille area did not have the extra road light. I did not notice the ducting for the front brake either.
The side window scoops with the small window that Scott had mentioned earlier.
Continued...............................
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04:01 AM
LoW_KeY Member
Posts: 8081 From: Hastings, MI Registered: Oct 2001
The speedo in the #2 was a 140mph and had the pegasus emblem in it.
The strobe switches and the fire suppression nozzle that was missing from the #1 Red car.
The #2 Blue car has the seat harness still intact.
A better picture of the upgraded rear brake caliper. The picture also show what the center caps looked like and how nice they were when the cars were new.
A better picture of the seperate rear e-brake caliper.
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04:13 AM
RAREW66 Member
Posts: 1119 From: Davenport, IA USA Registered: Jun 2001
Now the engine bay threw me for a loop. NO TURBO. I asked the man in charge of the warehouse and he claims that the car is untouched other than cleaning. I will need to contact the GM guy who is charge of all the Prototypes and see if he has any record of the turbo being removed. I studied the bulkhead between the trunk and the engine bay to look for evidence that there had been some changes. I did not find any repairs of holes that exist on the #1 Red car. The sheetmetal looked exactly as a stock Fiero. The two similarities I did find was that the intake manifold and the massive oil pan were the same as the #1 Turbo car. The car also was equipped with a stock appearing Muncie Four Speed Transmission. Definately cause to ask more questions and do some more research.
The supplemental cooling vent in the deck lid.
The dual batteries and associated equipment were all intact. All of the fire suppression devices were in place in the trunk and engine bay. So it really gets me to wondering if the The #1 Red car was the only car that was equipped with the turbo. It is to my understanding that the Turbo car was the test car and saw most of the changes before the rest of the cars were made.
Fred
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04:36 AM
hyperv6 Member
Posts: 6099 From: Clinton, OH, USA Registered: Mar 2003
Fread the blue one did have a turbo in 1985 what happend I don't know? Great pictures and info.
Doug: the IRM parts may be very close but these parts were made from temporay molds that are no longer around. It is similar to my Peguses Engineering FX, They are the DGP stage 1's copies just with added ribbing. Many stole designs in the 80's on Fiero add on parts. It is very possible IRM copied them.
The company [Autostyle] was most sold off and who know what it is or where it is today [much like Cars and Concepts] They did do a Eurosport in 1986/87 if I recall and it has a odd blocked off grill with better ground FX and spoiler. I think it was a Eurosport Aero? I have a product card some where in my collection of controled mess just not sure where it is. Autostyle also did the parts for the 78 Vette Indy pace cars.
As for the 1986 1/2, the fastback was a mid year deal as was the 5 sp. They even has a seperate sales catolog for the 6000 a and GT since they were not release in the fall.
just what I always wanted 
