After all that impressive work, you're selling the car on ebay?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=2493557936&category=6419

Awsome work! I'd give you another "+" if I could.

After seeing the car in San Angelo along with revins I didn't even bother opening my decklid. They are both clean looking installs.

quote Originally posted by Deabionni: After all that impressive work, you're selling the car on ebay? http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=2493557936&categ ory=6419 Awsome work! I'd give you another "+" if I could.

Everything always has a price tag around here. I built this car to learn the OBDII passkey 3+ system, Electronic Throttle Control, and try the paddle shifter transmission out. I like the paddle shifter feature. I still dont like where I put the buttons, but I feel it is better than the steering wheel. I am really going to try the T handle shifter in the days ahead. Maybe even voice command would be better? Then you would have to leave the tunes turned down.

I have a LS1 on a 4T65eHD transmission today. I want to change direction with that and install the Comp G paddle shifter transmission on that now. I will have to get the help of HP Tuners getting the code for the paddle shifter into the LS1 PCM since no vette or GTO is coming out with this feature. My best hope is that the 2005 Grand Prix that is coming out with the 5.3 V8 will have the Comp G package and paddle shifter feature in it. Then I can buy a wrecked 05 and move all that to the Fiero very easy. You have to know OBDII and CAN (Controller Area Network) in order to work with the 04's and 05 stuff.

Loyde

quote Originally posted by FastFieros: I like the paddle shifter feature. I still dont like where I put the buttons, but I feel it is better than the steering wheel. I am really going to try the T handle shifter in the days ahead. Maybe even voice command would be better? Then you would have to leave the tunes turned down. Loyde

Hey Loyde, I'm glad I got to see this car in person as well. I kept thinking it was my car, I guess just wishfull thinking.

As for the shifter button locations, here's a thought, why don't you get a conventional manuall transmission 5 speed shifter, (or however many speeds the 4T65eHD has) and modify that with microswitches and a little software to operate the paddle shift function. That way the mind doesn't have to be retrained. I've never seen this done, even on OEM, so you might have a one of a kind really cool setup. The auto transmission is the one thing stopping me from wanting a high horsepower engine for my Fiero.

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1988 GT (Firebird Interior),1988 Fastback (4.9 Chop-top #1 of 1), 1984 Indy...Firebird Interior Installation Website

Loyde,
I think we forgot to re-program something oh well later this winter ...

As far as a spot for the switches...what about a old high beam/low beam switch on the floor?( like older cars had) or do you need 3 switches?

How about three small shifters like the old Grand Nationals<? had? only shorter like 3 or 4 "???

Oh and MAN those ser 3 motors are almost as fast as the old ser 2' s !! j/k had fun finding that out! do you know what our speed was?

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98 3800SC, Getrag 5sp. only one in Austin Texas !

quote Originally posted by revin: Loyde, I think we forgot to re-program something oh well later this winter ... As far as a spot for the switches...what about a old high beam/low beam switch on the floor?( like older cars had) or do you need 3 switches? How about three small shifters like the old Grand Nationals<? had? only shorter like 3 or 4 "??? Oh and MAN those ser 3 motors are almost as fast as the old ser 2' s !! j/k had fun finding that out! do you know what our speed was?

I had my laptop with me. It would have really taken longer to get the LTFT and STFT's correct to really have a proper tune. The scanner requires 15 minute drive times to get the histograms to load the charts with the correct info. Then I have to decide where the changes are made.

I would say the low speed roll ons I had you by a little, but the faster rollon's we seem'ed fairly equal. I saw 120mph, but thats all the speedo goes to... I have been 130 with the OBDII scanner running. Its reads the PCM, so I can log it also.

Dont you have a VS cam in your engine?

I thought of a floor board up/Down button, still not what I am looking for. I drive with the left foot brake method most of the time.

Loyde

quote Originally posted by FastFieros: I had my laptop with me. It would have really taken longer to get the LTFT and STFT's correct to really have a proper tune. The scanner requires 15 minute drive times to get the histograms to load the charts with the correct info. Then I have to decide where the changes are made. I would say the low speed roll ons I had you by a little, but the faster rollon's we seem'ed fairly equal. I saw 120mph, but thats all the speedo goes to... I have been 130 with the OBDII scanner running. Its reads the PCM, so I can log it also. Dont you have a VS cam in your engine? I thought of a floor board up/Down button, still not what I am looking for. I drive with the left foot brake method most of the time. Loyde

no just a 3.4 pulley, maybe it is the NO AC?

and it could feel like you are just hitting the clutch pedal

make it a foot controled shifter like a motorcycle but a rocker pedal, or just go all out and remove the steering wheel put electric assist steering rack in and drive your car with a playstation controler, your almost there nice install by the way im quite jealous

justin

quote Originally posted by FastFieros: I thought of a floor board up/Down button, still not what I am looking for. I drive with the left foot brake method most of the time. Loyde

Loyde, I got to thinking about your paddle shift and I think I have come up with a way you could mount it on the steering wheel and retain the function of the horn. The horn relay sends 12v B+ (thru the coil) and up to the horn buttons. When you hit the horn buttons this signal gets grounded which pulls the relay coil closed to send current to the horns. Well this means that any time the horn buttons are not pushed, you have 12v B+ (low amps) and ground present at the steering wheel. Well, I don't see why one could not utilize this power source to power a weak radio transmitter hooked to your paddle shifter buttons that could activate a module under the dash to send the correct signals to the PCM for upshift and downshift commands. Even if the horn relay circuit did not supply enough current you could always use a battery operated transmitter (there is pleanty of room in the steering wheel). Just brainstorming, something for you to try out if you get a chance.

quote Originally posted by FastFieros: . Get in touch with me on that PCM, and maybe we get a little more out of it. Loyde

I'll do that when I figure out how our new overtime is gonna be spread out at work.
Doug

'Clean install' really doesn't do it justice--it's immaculate. I think you may have tidied up the harness even more since these pics were posted (not that it needed it). When I drooled over it Saturday, I just really had to look hard to find any wiring at all.

Between seeing & hearing your car Loyde, and riding in Revin's, Jane has already began to rag on me about getting a 2nd job to pay for one of those swaps, but I am kinda thankful neither of you were leading the cruise when we came over that rise, and found ourselves in that flock of sheep. I know yall would probably have been driving a "bit' faster than we were. Don't know yet how we missed hitting them, and bet JohnF about sheet when he saw the brake lights.

[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 10-13-2004).]

Thanks again Don...

TTT..

Loyde

Hey Loyde, why dont you switch the valve covers? Me and Amir were sitting here discussing it. On my car it would be a huge b1tch to fill it with oil if i hadnt. I have to much wiring harness up under there by the decklid springs. Just wondering.

Ryan

Well Ryan, here is my explanation to that valve cover oil fill issue.

When you install engines that are 30k or less, you are installing a engine that with all expectation is going to be a efficient running and a normal engine. No oil burning, no oil leaking, just normal. When I raise my decklid, the first thing you see is the supercharger and that trunk side valve cover. I like that area good and clean. If the valve covers are painted with different colors, the valve cover really stands out.

So, you change your oil every 3 months, or 3000 miles. I think to have a nice clean install, I can put up with using a funnel I heated up and designed to make pouring that oil in that firewall side valve cover every 3 months or 3000 miles. I don’t take that oil fill off once a week just to see if it still comes off, so out of site, out of mind. All my installations are very wire “managed” so, I don’t have that problem with a wiring mess above my valve covers.

Loyde

I have a couple of questions, Lloyd. Did the car start out as a stick? If so, why didn't you remove the clutch pedal? (See red circle type thing in pic.) Not kicking you by any means, but seeing how you obviously pay great attention to detail, it would make sense to spend the extra 1/2 hr. Second, is this the 2nd key (passkey?) in the center console? (See blue circle type thing in pic.) Is there a reason why it was installed there? Or was it just a matter of convenience?

Dave

This car has some interesting history.

It started life as a 88 Formula 5 speed. It was owned by Paul Zurich.. Creator of the Fiero-List.org
Paul Vargus then purchased the car and had Archie install a V8, but not a TPI model.
Charles Fabros purchased the car and turned into a SCCA autocross car.
I purchased the car without a engine/trans, but it still had the autocross stuff on it.
I stripped the car back to a stock chassis and suspension, and removed the interior.
The car was sold to Robert Cadwell here in DFW. They installed a 3800SC Series II with a GETRAG. The GETRAG was blown in 3 weeks. They installed a automatic. The automatic was blown in 6 weeks. Robert also installed the GT clip from a wrecked 88 GT 5 speed car.
I purchased the car back with the blown transmission, along with the wrecked 88GT chassis that was stripped for the most part.

Now today it is a automatic for the most part. I did install an automatic radiator, auto shifter, hard lines for automatic. Things that Robert did not and that is one reason the automatic install was not successful for him. The petals are not a half hour or even one hour job to switch if the dash is not removed from the car. There is a harness that lies right across that petal assembly and it is very difficult to push up out of the way to remove and install the auto petal assembly. I could cut the manual petal off, but no real reason to today. I will switch the assembly IF this car stays together as a 3800SC powered car.

My long term FastFieros project plan is a 88 Formula with all the mod’s I seek for a nice show car. It will be LS1 powered with a 4T65eHD transmission. Hopefully by then I figure out how to make the FR9 Comp G transmission work on the LS1 PCM. Or, maybe Pontiacs 2005 5.3 power V8 will have the Comp G package with the FR9 transmission, then I wont have to work that hard in design. This 88 Formula/GT may or may not stay together with the Series III install. I have another complete Series II with automatic transmission powertrain to install in something, and make that available for sale.

Here is the problem with the passkey 3+ switch.

As you see, the Grand Prix switch is really large. It has to be used because it has the Power Master Mode setup contacts in it. The BCM knows when the key is inserted, the key is turned to ACC/RAP, the key is turned to run, the key is turned to crank, all these positions setup the PCM to know what is going on during the start cycle. The reason is ONE TOUCH starting. The 03 trucks even have it. It is documented very lightly for some reason. The key is turned to the start position and you can let go the key instantaneously and the engine will continue to start until the engine is running. The key does not have to be in the crank position the continuous time. If there is a engine problem and you have a no-start, the DTC is set for no-start and a time out occurs at 10 seconds crank time.

So, I had to find some place to put that huge switch and the ash tray area fit. I mod’ed the hole for the key to be inserted and turned with no problems.

I hope that helps in understanding the construction and direction of this install.

Loyde

Back on eBay if any interest....

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2498001584&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMESE%3AIT

There is also a 88 Formula listed that is show car ready...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2497355970&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMESE%3AIT

Thanks for looking,,,

Loyde

That's a really nice car.....I don't have 13K yet though.....I do have a couple grand saved though. How much do you usually charge to put in an engine like that?

Series II installs are documented here > http://www.fastfieros.com/turnkey_solutions/3800_supercharged_engine_install.htm

Series III installs are $1000 more. Alot of additional wires and the BCM has to be online. The engines are about $500 more, but the engines mileage are in the 5k to 15k range today still. I even have one engine with only 10 miles. This is with the ETC on automatic installs. No ETC on manual installs. Add $500 more if the paddle shifter transmission and features are wanted.

Thanks for checking,

Loyde

Hi all,

Why are there three buttons??? One for up, one for down, the other for??

quote Originally posted by pavo_roddy: Hi all, Why are there three buttons??? One for up, one for down, the other for??

To answer your question about the buttons. The center one is an open option. The buttons were the ICCU control buttons. The ICCU was never installed since I got the 2004 Grand Prix PCM support from HP Tuners. I now today also have 2004 PCM support from DHP's PowrTuner.

I also have sold this car. I just installed a ZZP Stage 2 IC and a set of Stage 2 heads. I have been updating the interior items as well.

Couple of pics so far...

Thanks for checking

Loyde

Hi all,

What exactly does the air filter placed in the oil fill hole do.......lol, that sounds confusing to me....

Will you let us know when you get the comp g package working with the ls1 if that is the goal......?

The air filter in the oil cap is a breather point. The 3800SC builds alot of bottom end pressure and will show signs of oil leaks as early as 8k miles around the valve covers and oil pans. If you put this breather in, it will lessen the pressure build up alot. ZZP sells unit for $45. Mine is $12 and drill a 1/2 hole..

Time to update and say goodbye to the 88 GT 3800SC Series III car today.

Bill S from Colorado Springs flew in today and drove off in the car. Bill actually purchased the car in Janurary, but decided the engine needed some more ponies, and he wanted the updates that I had planned, but then I decided to sell the car. Well, I got to do the following for Bill...

ZZP Stage 2 InterCooler
3.0 pulley
ZZP Stage 2 heads
SLP Roller Rockers in 1.85
Port intake
Port output in Gen 5 SC
Intense GEN II LSD
Get the starting circuit to work on only one key
Change brake petal to automatic setup
Get speedo working with the ETC
Install a trunk bottom

Here are the pics

I put about 2500 miles on this powertrain. I only got to put about 200 miles on the new mods, and it sure was a fun car with the IC and rockers. I really wish I had got to do a XPZ cam.

I have to thank DHP's Charles Beyer for finally getting the 2004 PCM hacking support. The Powrtuner is capable of transmission tuning that HP Tuners cannot do. This 04 package needed alot of transmissison tuning to get the torque management out of it.

Thanks to all that liked the install. I am getting to do another one for a guy in Greece. I hope to start it in 2 weeks. I have really got to get this LS1 project done hopefully first.

Loyde
http://www.fastfieros.com

[This message has been edited by FastFieros (edited 03-11-2005).]