Well. . .I drove my car for the first time since its new mods. Just around the parking lot of course. Being that I'm the ultimate critic, Pete wants me to fine tune what he's done. I guess the driver has to like the new changes (I don't like a throttle cable out of adjustment). But I love the sound of it. Sounds like a boat glubbing away in the water! Nice lumpy idle. It's gonna be fun driving in the city now - the car doesn't hide its power any more. Before it was quiet and took off like a jet...now it just sounds powerful before it even goes anywhere. This summer is going to be fun - that is as long as the cops don't get me for excessive noise.
After drooling over turbos for the last 6 months, I would like to start by getting one. I have been looking at the 5.9L Cummings turbo and it looks about as promising as the 6.5L, but I think its a little more compact. The engine it is used on redlines at 3500 rpm, which I belive is the same as the 6.5 right? Had you looked into this turbo PBJ? Its a Holset.
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11:13 PM
May 15th, 2004
PBJ Member
Posts: 4167 From: London, On., Canada Registered: Jan 2001
No I have not looked into that turbo. My main reason for the 6.5 turbo's was the availability of them since I work at a GM dealership. If I were to buy one I would have it custom built or a Sy/Ty turbo.
Sorry, not much help.
Pete
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10:11 PM
May 16th, 2004
STRATOHACKER Member
Posts: 820 From: Columbus, OH U.S.A Registered: Jun 2003
After drooling over turbos for the last 6 months, I would like to start by getting one. I have been looking at the 5.9L Cummings turbo and it looks about as promising as the 6.5L, but I think its a little more compact. The engine it is used on redlines at 3500 rpm, which I belive is the same as the 6.5 right? Had you looked into this turbo PBJ? Its a Holset.
I've looked into the turbo. Holset turbos have some of the best efficiencies out there. I looked at the compressor map and it'll run great on the 4.9 at around 7psi. I'll did this about a year ago, I'll dig up the map if I can find it. In fact that was the exact turbo I had in my hand while doing this very project a little over a year ago.
Here's the old archived thread. Unfortunately med school halted this project right in its tracks. The Holset turbo was the one I choose. From what I remember it was literally promising almost 80% efficiency at 4,500-5,000 RPM's pushing half a bar of pressure or something like that. I really have to dig up my old maps and tables and stuff to really give you the facts from the number crunching I did. I still plan on doing this eventually, working here and there on a short break. But I don't have the time to really dedicate to it to give you guys solid progress reports. Can you blame me for putting my time to school and girls first . But more seriously, feel free to pick my brain about the Holset, I'm on and off the boards. I'll start another thread (since my old one is archived) if I get a good chunk of time to do anything with this.
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02:05 PM
PFF
System Bot
FieroGTT Member
Posts: 489 From: Hard Hittin' New Britain, CT Registered: Oct 2002
Some new updates, first of all a time slip, 12.51 @ 107.87
I also have a new water/alcohol injection system. We have only run it with water at this time. Comes on at 3 psi and is sprayed between the intercooler and Throttle plate using a nitous fogger type nozzle.
The waste gate controler is one of the only non GM item on the car (chrysler) and it is going to be smashed as soon as I find its replacement I want the turbo to run at a consistant 5 psi where as this one loves to run the car at 6-8 depending on its mood which makes it a bit harder to tune.
Pete
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02:25 PM
Aug 3rd, 2004
PBJ Member
Posts: 4167 From: London, On., Canada Registered: Jan 2001
Tonight the fiero got a new transmission, (thanks to Hugh for the one available to us). Beck was drag racing the night Jscott1 dropped off his choptop fiero for a 4.9 conversion and ended up taking out 3rd gear at the track. The new transmissions main feature for us is a Phantom Grip limited slip unit. Now we just have to get back to the track, that will be friday and/or saturday weather permitting.
Pete
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10:41 PM
blakeinspace Member
Posts: 5923 From: Fort Worth, Texas Registered: Dec 2001
I have a few more questions to boost my confidence before starting this. Can you use the cadillac ECM? Does it have restrictions, or is it just plain incompatible since its from a non turbo car? What are the ECM options?
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04:01 PM
PBJ Member
Posts: 4167 From: London, On., Canada Registered: Jan 2001
I have a few more questions to boost my confidence before starting this. Can you use the cadillac ECM? Does it have restrictions, or is it just plain incompatible since its from a non turbo car? What are the ECM options?
We went with the 730 ecm before the engine was even turbocharged. 3 years ago when I put in the 4.9 the caddy ecm was not completely hacked like it is now. Also the 730 ecm uses a knock sensor which is ALMOST a must on a higher compression ratio turbo charged engine. To switch from caddy ecm to 730 ecm is very simple and Rockcrawl "owns" the PROM info that we are running, so I would see him to obtain a copy. As you may also know I am running an add-on boost timing retard module (MSD 6BTM) The problem with the 730 ecm is it will not control an electonic shift transmission. I do believe you can run a turbo on a 4.9 with a caddy ecm with a timing retard module as long as you are cautious with the timing which will then lead to less performance than the ragged edge that a knock sensor could give.
Pete
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04:45 PM
Philphine Member
Posts: 6136 From: louisville,ky. usa Registered: Feb 2000
i like these. is there a "how too" i missed or would you be willing to do one? even a simple explaination or sourse if they're a junkyard type find? thanks.
also for anyone in general, i'd love to have a front vent with the same louver size as the stock gt rear side vents, or something that would match these vents pictured or the ones kahines makes similar to skitimes to make all the vents match. just throwing that out there.
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04:47 PM
collinwestphal Member
Posts: 698 From: Waukesha, WI, USA Registered: Jun 2003
I have been very happy with our MSD unit. We purchased it off Ebay and was NIB. I would imagine the unit you are talking about would work well too. The 4.9 does not need much boost to greatly effect the hp. I would run 3 or 4 psi and be happy. We did not have a problem with knock untill over 5 psi stock, or now 8 psi.
As for the trunk vents, It is alot easier than it looks. We cut up a set of matching engine vents and cut two holes in the correct place. There was very little skill involved, which is a good thing because I am not a body man. They are apoxy'ed in place.
Pete
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10:29 PM
PFF
System Bot
Oct 2nd, 2004
Will Member
Posts: 14252 From: Where you least expect me Registered: Jun 2000
would you need the timing retard module if you never went over 3-4 psi? from what I have read, at low boost they really don't do much. at 8 psi I'm sure its necessary. btw, what would be your best (maybe conservative) guess at your hp and torque. and I understand your engine is no longer stock.
what is involved in switching from the caddy ecm to 730?
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07:55 PM
PBJ Member
Posts: 4167 From: London, On., Canada Registered: Jan 2001
Yes you will need a timming retard module for boost. Even 3 or 4 psi. If you have a standard trans it will just require some wiring changes along with the matching ecm and PROM. Email me if you need specifics. If you have an electronic shift trans the 730 will not work. Our engine is fairly close to stock other than Porting, Camshaft, and roller rockers. It will be on the dyno this weekend. Est hp with 3/4 psi boost on completely stock 250 rwhp, but will have a long power band.
Pete
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10:36 PM
Oct 10th, 2004
PBJ Member
Posts: 4167 From: London, On., Canada Registered: Jan 2001
I will post a pic of the dyno run just incase someone finds this thread later on down the road. Looks like some improvements can be made. Dyno thread is here https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/046354.html
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12:10 PM
Oct 24th, 2004
1fastcaddy Member
Posts: 618 From: Hays, Kansas Registered: Oct 2004
Any new NEWS??? I Am do a 4.5l TBI conversion and have been thinking seriously about turbo, eing a former 1990 Eagle Talon TSi owner, now a 85gt and 88 seville I am planning on doing a complete wiring swap from head to toe using all caddy equipment and want to go ahead and use the stock ecu if possible. PBJ and HerGT, you have been and inspiration to me!!!!!!!!!
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Soon To Be 1turbocaddy!!! Ever heard of a 12 sec caddy??
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11:08 PM
Howard_Sacks Member
Posts: 1871 From: Cherry Hill, NJ Registered: Apr 2001
You sure it's the controler and not manifold design? I'd get a large regular wastegate(like a Tial 46mm) with a 5# spring, mount it nicely, throw the controller out the window and call it a day.
quote
Originally posted by PBJ:
The waste gate controler is one of the only non GM item on the car (chrysler) and it is going to be smashed as soon as I find its replacement I want the turbo to run at a consistant 5 psi where as this one loves to run the car at 6-8 depending on its mood which makes it a bit harder to tune.
Pete
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11:24 PM
Nov 1st, 2004
PBJ Member
Posts: 4167 From: London, On., Canada Registered: Jan 2001
Did you ever get that efficiency/compressor map for the holset hx35/hy35/h1c? Ive been looking all around the net for one... found some max flow parameters, about 50 lbs/min if I remember for the hx30, and thats about what I want to run on my 4.5L at the redline... gonna go see what my friend has in his dad's junkyard....
PS. try and PM me too I may not be able to see that youve responded, thanks a bunch!, Brian
Here's the old archived thread. Unfortunately med school halted this project right in its tracks. The Holset turbo was the one I choose. From what I remember it was literally promising almost 80% efficiency at 4,500-5,000 RPM's pushing half a bar of pressure or something like that. I really have to dig up my old maps and tables and stuff to really give you the facts from the number crunching I did. I still plan on doing this eventually, working here and there on a short break. But I don't have the time to really dedicate to it to give you guys solid progress reports. Can you blame me for putting my time to school and girls first . But more seriously, feel free to pick my brain about the Holset, I'm on and off the boards. I'll start another thread (since my old one is archived) if I get a good chunk of time to do anything with this.
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02:01 AM
PBJ Member
Posts: 4167 From: London, On., Canada Registered: Jan 2001
I have not found a turbo map either for the 6.5 turbo. This winter I plan on changing the turbo to a specific build turbo for this engine/boost level and desired hp. This one will be based on a T4. The 6.5 turbo does work but does not want to stay at the low boost level I want, which is not completely the turbos fault, but the 6.5 turbo is specific built and designed to run close to 20 psi pressure, also I want to reduce lag time. Not that you notice lag when you have a low end torque engine to begin with.
Before this thread drops away to archives. The complete modifed 4.9 engine, exhaust system with turbo including tail pipe, wiring, ecm and PROM are still forsale. I have an offer from someone (they know who they are) but no money yet
Feel free to make an offer. It is test-driveable still for a few more weeks, then the engine will be removed and stored.
Pete
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01:07 PM
PFF
System Bot
Kento Member
Posts: 4218 From: Beautifull Winston Salem NC Registered: Jun 2003
Before this thread drops away to archives. The complete modifed 4.9 engine, exhaust system with turbo including tail pipe, wiring, ecm and PROM are still forsale. I have an offer from someone (they know who they are) but no money yet
Feel free to make an offer. It is test-driveable still for a few more weeks, then the engine will be removed and stored.
Pete
Dont sell it, Just get a Citation or better yet a Metro and toss it in there!
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02:04 PM
Jul 9th, 2005
Philphine Member
Posts: 6136 From: louisville,ky. usa Registered: Feb 2000
Last I heard PBJ was working on a turbo Northstar to replace the 4.9L. It will be interesting to see how the smaller ( 4.6L) but better breathing Northstar engine performs when compared to the 4.9L.
Yes the engine is sold and delivered to the new PFF owner. He may reveal himself to you, I don't know if he is building a secret machine. It will be hard for the next engine to live up with the flawless mechanical record of our 4.9.
Pete
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11:46 PM
Jul 10th, 2005
Rhino88gt Member
Posts: 718 From: Maumelle, AR Registered: Jun 2003
I am the new owner of this motor and I will be starting the install this week. I plan on taking it to Osage Beach this year so hopefully anyone from the midwest who ever wanted to see this motor will be able to.
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12:48 PM
jscott1 Member
Posts: 21676 From: Houston, TX , USA Registered: Dec 2001
But I love the sound of it. Sounds like a boat glubbing away in the water! Nice lumpy idle. It's gonna be fun driving in the city now - the car doesn't hide its power any more. Before it was quiet and took off like a jet...now it just sounds powerful before it even goes anywhere. This summer is going to be fun - that is as long as the cops don't get me for excessive noise. 
