I had some help today with some fellow Cleveland Fiero members and yanked this out. We then kept right on moving and got the Fiero 2.8 ready to drop tomorrow. I am trying to get it ready for spring and have many mod's to make but 3 months to toy around. Any helpfull hints would be great. Don Z the V.P. of Cleveland Fieros is on the right and in the car/engine pic and I am wiht him on left in the piture of us together. My brother In-Law drove 30 miles to drop off his engine hoist so we could get a move on so I thank him also. Mel stopped and was a perfect tool man and interior taker aparter. Thanks Everyone for a good days work. RIck Borecky President Cleveland Fieros www.clevelandfieros.com
[This message has been edited by Rborecky (edited 02-05-2005).]
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08:25 PM
PFF
System Bot
DotTC Member
Posts: 2345 From: Hamlet, North Carolina Registered: Nov 2003
looks likes many months/years of enjoyment are comin for you
------------------ 1988 Aero 88 coupe.. 2.8l v6.. more mods to come. FieroNews.com - Photo Gallery - Fiero Links I am the signature virus, please put me in your signature so I can spread
Wish I were that far. I've had the car with the 3800sc for three months and it is still in the car and haven't even removed one nut. Febuary is the push month to be ready for the shows. I did get some things done like cleaning the garage and getting my Indy that has been sitting for ten years running today so I feal good about my day too. Whats your plans for mountiing and trans? Rod
Cool beans! Who has the salvage license and bought that car from ADS? I used to work for them (Cols lot) and had a great line on all the good motor cars well before auction time.
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10:38 PM
Rborecky Member
Posts: 675 From: Cleveland,Ohio U.S. Registered: Oct 2003
This one came out of a bone yard. I had a guy there hunt it down for me and he is selling all the left over parts. We used the lift there which was great. Were going to fabricate the mounts and I'm using the Heavy Duty trans on it. It is going to be slow process so as to do it right. I want to dress it up a bit. I laugh at the folks who refuse to believe this thing will run in the 11's and 12's in the 1/4 and refuse to believe a stock motor with minor mod's can go this fast. I guess Old School {which I am} refuse to see times have changed. I still have a hard time thinking about my childhood days of 13,s being great in street cars. Heck this thing can go faster than a new Vette and that is not pretty when they spend that much money. Rick B
[This message has been edited by Rborecky (edited 02-05-2005).]
jeeze that looks goofy! the car is all beat up, dirty, missing wheels, then the pic of the engine shows this nice clean motor. sounds like your having fun! good luck with the swap!
------------------ The unfortunate history of my GT
"I say it's a fallacy that kids need 12 years of school! 3 months is plenty! Look at me. I'm smart! I don't need 11 1/2 more years of school! It's a complete waste of my time!" -Calvin "How on earth did you get all the way to the bus stop with both feet through one pant leg?" -Hobbes "I fell down lots" -Calvin
That was the same car my first 3800 swap came from. What did you pay and how many miles?
Make sure you use the inner cv shafts from the 4t60e-hd. Then you can use the outer part of the half shaft from the manual fiero. fits like a glove... My 96 3800 runs 12.8 with 3.25 pulley, headers, borla exhaust, custom pcm flash. new mods 2.8 pulley, 1.9 rockers, 160 stat, NOS.. I hoping for 11s this year. Good luck with the swap it's going to be fun...
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09:38 AM
Rborecky Member
Posts: 675 From: Cleveland,Ohio U.S. Registered: Oct 2003
Now thats the information I am looking for. I was wondering which shafts were best. I was told of a few different shafts but while I have the Riviera shafts here I'm good with the one. Anymore good info would be great. Thanks,,Rick B
This one came out of a bone yard. I had a guy there hunt it down for me and he is selling all the left over parts. We used the lift there which was great. Were going to fabricate the mounts and I'm using the Heavy Duty trans on it. It is going to be slow process so as to do it right. I want to dress it up a bit. I laugh at the folks who refuse to believe this thing will run in the 11's and 12's in the 1/4 and refuse to believe a stock motor with minor mod's can go this fast. I guess Old School {which I am} refuse to see times have changed. I still have a hard time thinking about my childhood days of 13,s being great in street cars. Heck this thing can go faster than a new Vette and that is not pretty when they spend that much money. Rick B
My dad had a hard time believe that motor would be as quick as it is you'll love it, brings whole new life to the car I know my dad was like must be nice, when I was your age I always dreamt of dinking around with blowers and what not.
The nice thing about these newer engines is that you can drive the car to the track, run a couple 13.XX passes, and drive it home getting 25 miles to the gallon....it's amazing by old school standards. I can't wait to see the final product.
89,402 I ran it before I bought it and could not believe how nice it sounded. The response was amazing also and the sale was finalized at that point. Here is teh tag and then of the engine after a quick cleaning. Rick B President Cleveland Fieros www.clevelandfieros.com
damn, looks good! Keep it up, and post more pictures of how nice of the days you are having.. damn americans.. LoL We got yet more snow today.. only a little bit though
Here are a few of the wiring. We have dropped the tank and got a 94 LT1 Corvette pump and Fiero strainer but have to get the clips to connect it since they are different. The freezing weather In Cleveland has us dieing from a Torpedo heater that is burning bad kerosene apparently. It has been getting to our eyes and to open the door for a minute makes you need the heater on all the time. I cant wait for the warmer weather. A big thanks goes out to Loyde at Fast Fieros of Dallas www.fastfieros.com as he has come thru on many things even a set of mounts while a set is being made for him so I can get this part done. He is programming my computer and upgraded me to a 97 526K as my earlier 96 is 256K isn't a good Idea. We greatly appreciate it and I will mention you in the news letter up here for a great contact. I am going to send out the brackets for the Alternator to be welded in Aluminum Tuesday. Were moving ahead pretty quickly I think. We made the thermostat housing last night and have moved the MAP sensor to the front of the charger. I pulled the Boost vacuum noise eliminator as I want to hear the blower singing. We are now going to thread the water pump housing for a return heater line and plug the manifold outlet to mention a few things. Rick B President Cleveland Fieros clevelandfieros.com
is that michael jackson wearing those white gloves? oh wait a minute he only ever wore one thats right. honsetly ive never seen anybody wear surgical glove while working on an engine.... ...
good job
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" DRIVE IT LIKE YOU LOVE IT"
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07:20 PM
wkayl Member
Posts: 2912 From: Loveland, Co Registered: Feb 2000
He used them later to give the Engine a exam. Honestly it was the best thing I have ever done. It has saved me many hours of scrubbing and skin loss not to mention the stuff that is not getting into my skin. I want to thank ohio86se or Rick for working on my Gas Tank sensor while it was out. He tinkered around for a bit and it looks like he got it to read true. The real test is once it is in and car is running. Were waiting on the mounts and computer now and I'm painting a few parts. Rick B
just joking about the gloves. im normally an office worker and dont get my hands dirty during my day job so when i get the oportunity to get grease under my nails i go for it.
ive got my flywheel machined and balanced. my bro in law owed me for putting a new tranny into his caddi eldo last week so he got it done for me.
i got my low mount alt setup, dog bone/tensioner setup done without doing any welding. i used the 97 gtp alternator, orig dog bone bracket and the std tensioner.
your welcome im glad to lend a hand
hows is the wiring going?
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" DRIVE IT LIKE YOU LOVE IT"
[This message has been edited by ohio86se (edited 02-25-2005).]
Well we test fit the cradle and mounts the other day. We are doing small things link alternator bracket, painting little things, wiring { Don Zeyers thing } and touched up some minor rust on the fuel tank. Loyde { Fast Fieros of Dallas }was a great help so far. Purple Reign was going to need a few weeks to get a set or mounts off to me and Loyde was nice enough to get the only extra set he had to me and wait for a set to come in from Shawn. Loyde has been a great help and I know I will still need to aggravate him as we move along. You can see we copied Loydes wiring Jig to imitate where the harness goes to the computer. The frame will go out for blasting and I have two people to see about for Paint or Powder coating. I will powder coat if my friends buddy has a large enough set up as it will be free he said but I will not allow that. The engine mount we used up front under the harmonic balancer was not correct for my 86 and possibly fro a 88 so we had to drill the holes on the part that lays in the cradle. Other than this Purple Reins Mounts are a work of art and super. I found a welder by me who has done a excellent job welding the Fiero alternator bracket to the Riviera Tensioner and now I need to get the Dog Bone part and prep it for him to weld. Enough for now and back to Cleveland's snow and bitter cold. The kerosene Torpedo is killing us. Rick B
Very nice job, especially since you are fighting cold and toxic odors.
On gloves, I use them too. I get the nitril gloves from Harbor Freight (on sale) which hold up better than the surgical ones. They are about double the price but don't snag/tear.
Good luck on your great swap.
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03:27 PM
Feb 27th, 2005
3.8 SC Member
Posts: 577 From: On the Great Lakes-Ohio Registered: Dec 2003
Well we went junk yard hunting yesterday Don Z and I and we ran around to a few yards for a few hours to only leave empty handed. I remembered a yard close to home who I know carries Fieros and at one time had about 13 on the lot. We were bummed as it was really sloppy due to thaw and rain plus engine fluids all over. We went straight for the Fieros and the last one we found had the 87 automatic cable and lever for the 4t60E HD we needed since it is in reverse of the Fieros. We were pretty happy and sloppily trekked back. We had look thru the motor and seen no Supercharged ones to get the right side Tensioner and pulley from a 98 GTP and the Aluminum Dog bone we have been trying to get. Well some pulleys piled up caught my attention so we slid over and couldn't find any there. We were about done and slightly bummed at 5 hours with only the cable but I thought that was good enough on our hunt. I decided to see if there were any motors in the other building where we were and talked to a guy who said nothing like what we needed but still looked on the computer. He bummed us out by saying there was one in the other building stripped of parts and the blower. We didn't see it so we got a print out and went back where we were. DAMNED if it wasn't hidden. We had them pull it out and BINGO Frigin oh we hid the jack pot as all parts the parts we needed and hunted down all day were on it. I walked out for $40.00 and want to thank Myron at Pearl Road Auto Wrecking In Old Brooklyn for all the help he has given me over the years and especially yesterday. I trimmed the pulley/tensioner bracket down which normally holds the Coil pack but this one is lower than my Riviera was so I don't have to cut the hinge. I will work the aluminum Dog Bone after the engine is in to size it properly. I washed the engine compartment out today and worked a few things besides my duties around the house today. I need to get a bit more harness wire for a few loose ends and I hope to get on the exhaust next week possibly. I got my Flowmaster 80 in the mail yesterday after ordering it less than 20 hours earlier from Summit Racing, now that's service. I also got a nice set of exhaust shields for at Pearl rd Auto Wrecking to boot. All in all a good day and even got the gas tank back up after putting the 94 Corvette LT1 pump in Thanks again to Loyde who I called to make sure I was getting the correct parts while he was at a meet. That guy is way to helpful and nice. Rick B
pulleys and one welded up already. Dog bone goes on it later. Nice Red thermostat housing after welding adn paint Proper trans cable and bracket before we weld a angle iron to get it up and over wher it belongs Engine compartment after a cleaner.
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06:35 PM
FastFieros Member
Posts: 2698 From: Dallas Texas USA Registered: Nov 2000
Heck Loyde if it wasn't for your web page and pictures also I would be lost. http://www.fastfieros.com Sometimes I catch things and others after you explain it I then see it on the page and with it in my hand everything makes sense. All I need at the moments is what hubs and axles to use for the 4T60E HD ??????? I have heard way to many things. The axles distance/length look to be equal on both side with maybe one side being a inch longer. Any help here would be great as we are getting close and I would like to have them on hand. Thanks again. Rick B
Excellent! Do you think we can get the garage warm enough to put some paint down, in the engine comparment? I found the angle iron, I will be over tomorrow. Now, go insiide the house and warm yourself up.
Heck Loyde if it wasn't for your web page and pictures also I would be lost. http://www.fastfieros.com Sometimes I catch things and others after you explain it I then see it on the page and with it in my hand everything makes sense. All I need at the moments is what hubs and axles to use for the 4T60E HD ??????? I have heard way to many things. The axles area distance length's look to be equal on both side with maybe one side being a inch longer. ANy help here would be great as we are getting close and I would like to have them on hand. Thanks again. Rick B
Lets see if I can remeber right on how I did it. You need both axles off the donor car and a manuel Fiero axle for the PASS side axle setup. For the DRV side all you need is a stock Fiero DRV side auto axle.
The DRV side axle for the swap will be plug and play with a Fiero DRV side auto axle. There will be nothing hard about this side but installing it.
The PASS side is a little more of a pain but nothing that difficult. First take the outer hub off the manuel Fiero axle and place it and its insides to the side. Then take the PASS side donor axle and remove the inner tri-pot and all its insides. Next take the DRV side donor axle and remove the outer hub and all its insides. Mount the Fiero outer hub on the DRV side donor axle and mount the PASS side innner tri-pot on the same axle. This should give you a complete axle to fit the PASS side of the swap.
This all sounds very confusing and it actaully is cause I have done it and it just took me 20 mins to go thru it in my head to make sure it was right. Be sure to have plenty of rags and also several pair of gloves around becasue it is very messy. The best way to get the retainer rings off are with a pair of slip ring pliers and some paitents. This should get you the axle setup you need to work with your swap, it is the one I used with my 88. Depending on the mounts used and the year cradle used, not forsure if length will be an issue.
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10:21 PM
FastFieros Member
Posts: 2698 From: Dallas Texas USA Registered: Nov 2000
Loyde I came up with a 4T60 HD when I searched the trans ident tag. Unless I messed up somewhere Hmmm. I will call you in a bit. The set up came from a 1996 Riviera if that helps.
Rick I opted for the series 1 mount set up as I won't have to cut and angle the dog bone. My Dog Bone is the big poly one and I didnt want to heat it up welding. I had bought it awhile back and wanted to use it. I think even Loyde likes the 1 better. Was there a reason you did it or was it to get away form the Fiero Alternator? Looks good and some Duct tape works pretty good hahahaha.
There's one problem with what you explained Steven.... Rick is using a 4T60e and not a 4T65eHD transmission.
Rick, you will have to call on this one. I will have to ask some questions about what axles you have on hand to work with.
Loyde
AWWWWWWWWW-I missed the sign on the side of the car that stated it was an 96 3800 SC. Damn all that thinking for nothing, maybe someone else can use the information then. Well with the 4T60E, it should kame it even easier to get the axles needed. I remeber reading about the correct ones but didnt let it soak in being I wasnt using that trans. I think I read it in the archives and on RockCrawls website though.
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06:38 PM
ohio86se Member
Posts: 1308 From: akron, ohio, summit Registered: Mar 2002
rick b, i didnt want t go with the fiero bracket and i wanted to avoid doing any alum weldind. plus i think that the newer style alternator run cooler...no other reason. im also going to utilize the water port in the intake and the water pump for my heater hoses. i wont be messing with the thermostat housing refab.
the tensioner used for the accessories belt i bought at autozone and is just bolted to to the dog bone bracket after i milled the bracket down. this way if for some reason i need to replace the tensioner i can do it easily.ill need to fab a brace for the top of the alternator to attach back to the engine. it will be a static mount without any adlustment. after all ive heard that fiero alt bracket has a tendancy to crack and hence cause the belt to become loose.
thanks for the link...but im going with the four speed.
tell don z. that if he needs to borrow the flex plate to get his flywheel balanced let me know. i can bring it to the next meeting
keep up the good work.
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" DRIVE IT LIKE YOU LOVE IT"
[This message has been edited by ohio86se (edited 02-28-2005).]
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07:11 PM
Mar 6th, 2005
3.8 SC Member
Posts: 577 From: On the Great Lakes-Ohio Registered: Dec 2003
Here are a few of Dons itty bitty schematics on the wall. They were so big he got tangled up looking from left to right hahahaha. I painted the engine compartment, drained old antifreeze, made the alternator bracket lower piece, got the Air/Fuel ratio and Boost gauge in and tubes and wires run, Fit the computer behind the console, put trans bracket on and water pump outlet in to mention a few things. I am taking my time as not to rush them besides I refinish rifle stock in the evening and work a 40 hour a week job plus 2 little ones to take care of. Heck we spend a better part of each Saturday in the parts store of junk yards. This is a fun project since we are in no hurry and it is supposed to drop down to 26 degrees tonight and not go above 35 for a few days so no Fieros are going on the road yet. Rick B
I know my dad was like must be nice, when I was your age I always dreamt of dinking around with blowers and what not.
