Major differences between GT/Formula/SE

The first two I already got answered but was reaing some engine swap stories and was curious about the SE model.

I have been surprised at the lack of cars on Ebay.

The SE (Special Edition) is basically a base Fiero with more options. It had the base Fiero's springs and shocks, which are inferior to the GT and Formula's. On SEs of 1986+, the V6 model had the GT-style aero bumpers, but kept the base coupe's stuff. I'm pretty sure that all 4-cyl SEs had the coupe bumpers.

Edit: forgot to mention... 84 Fieros are bad for engine swaps due to wiring issues.

[This message has been edited by moleman_in_a_FieroGT (edited 08-29-2006).]

I have a 1986 Fiero SE 2.5L with the V6 dual exhaust and the aero body. I have never seen another fiero like mine, is it rare?

quote Originally posted by moleman_in_a_FieroGT: The SE (Special Edition) is basically a base Fiero with more options.

In 84 and 85, this was pretty much true. However, in 85, you could get the V6 in the SE, as well as the GT. In 84 and 85, the SE was the basic "bumperpad" body style. I think it had an upgraded interior, but I'm not completely sure about that.

quote It had the base Fiero's springs and shocks, which are inferior to the GT and Formula's. On SEs of 1986+, the V6 model had the GT-style aero bumpers, but kept the base coupe's stuff. I'm pretty sure that all 4-cyl SEs had the coupe bumpers.

This is not completely true. Most 86 and 87 SE's had basically the same suspension as the GT's. ALL SE's in 86 and 87, both 4 and 6 cylinder, had the aero body styling. I'm not sure what you mean by "kept the base coupe's stuff"...all the 86/87 SE's had the same interior as the GT, the difference being the 85MPH speedometer, as opposed to the 120MPH speedo in the GT. They also had a 4 spoke leather steering wheel, as opposed to the three spoke in the base models, and the three spoke leather wheel in the GT's. The V6 cars got the optional "rally gauges" above the radio pod...I'm not sure if the 4 cylinder cars got this or not. 87 was the last year for the SE. In 88, the Formula was introduced. It was basically a base coupe body, with GT underpinnings and drivetrain installed. It came standard with the rear wing mounted on the deck lid. The option list was smaller on it than on the GT, which made for a cheap way to get GT performance without the GT price.

quote Edit: forgot to mention... 84 Fieros are bad for engine swaps due to wiring issues.

They're not necessarily bad....I know of a few 84's with engine swaps in them. But the 85 and up models are easier to do swaps to, because of the wiring.

quote Originally posted by FIER086: I have a 1986 Fiero SE 2.5L with the V6 dual exhaust and the aero body. I have never seen another fiero like mine, is it rare?

According to the "Fiero Spotter's Guide", in 1986, there were 4,031 4 cylinder SE's built. In the same year, there were 28,274 V6 SE's built. I don't know that I'd call it "rare", as in any added value. But yes, as opposed to the V6 version, you could say it was rare. I knew of one here in my home town that was for sale a while back, but I don't know what ever happened to it. I've seen a couple of others at varios shows around the country...but not many.

[This message has been edited by litespd (edited 08-29-2006).]

quote Originally posted by moleman_in_a_FieroGT: The SE (Special Edition) is basically a base Fiero with more options. It had the base Fiero's springs and shocks, which are inferior to the GT and Formula's. On SEs of 1986+, the V6 model had the GT-style aero bumpers, but kept the base coupe's stuff. I'm pretty sure that all 4-cyl SEs had the coupe bumpers. Edit: forgot to mention... 84 Fieros are bad for engine swaps due to wiring issues.

No, not quite. Litespd covered most, But the SE and Formula also were less expensive to insure because they were not the "GT".
The SE and Formula's were also slightly faster as they weighed slightly less then the GT's of the same year.
Only the 84-85 SE had the bumperpad nose and tail. All 86/87 SE's were on the aerocoupe body.

84 SE's at least came with the same WS6 suspension package as the 85 GT, with the stiffest springs, 14" high tech wheels and P215/60R14 tires. They also had a slightly nicer interior.

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1984 Fiero SE

quote Originally posted by Oreif: The SE and Formula's were also slightly faster as they weighed slightly less then the GT's of the same year.

Except for the 85 GT which was the lightest and fastest stock Fiero period.

I think that we have established that the SE model is the superior car.

I have a 1985 2M6 SE and can tell you there is no differance between the GT or SE if ordered right.

The nose and body FX were the one item I could not get but most other GT items were either standard or avaiable,

I have the GT Drivetrain, Interior, the same WS6 Suspension and other items all in a standard bumper pad nosed car. With only a nose job and FX I could make mine a GT and you would never know with out checking the VIN.

The 1985 2M6 is the lightest V6 but it is not that much lighter that you feel it by the seat of the pants. Remember your only dealing with 140 HP. So yess it was the fastest factory Fiero but don't expect much more than a Regular GT

Heck the dealer I bought mine from put a GT rear deck and wing on mine for only $90 more. They swaped it right off the GT in the showroom. This wa sin 1985 so I like to kid I invented the Fourmula 3 years before GM.

My first car was an 86 SE and I had read somewhere that the SE had fewer spot welds on the fram than the GT's, I think it was a review in a magazine of the time.

quote Originally posted by FieroVin: My first car was an 86 SE and I had read somewhere that the SE had fewer spot welds on the fram than the GT's, I think it was a review in a magazine of the time.

For all intents and purposes, the cars are identical under their skin. The space frames were all assembled on the same production line, so what you read in that magazine was false.

quote Originally posted by Gokart Mozart: Except for the 85 GT which was the lightest and fastest stock Fiero period.

Wrong. The 1985 SE with a V-6 was 11 lbs lighter than the GT. (GM official spec)
The difference being (provided both car have the exact same options) the aero nose, aero rear, and side skirts totaled 11 lbs more.

You can see the weight differences here:
http://home.xnet.com/~paulv/PDFFiles/2006PriceGuideSpecsOnly.pdf

[This message has been edited by Oreif (edited 08-30-2006).]

11 pounds is about right for the 85 SE on paper. Owning this combo the 11 pounds make little differance but it does give braging rights.

Also other than the 1988 suspensions Fiero's are 98% the same under the skin. Only springs and minor mods from year to year were different. There were no seceret extra welds on GT's or any of that kind of changes.

84 had the rear tie rods hooked to the body vs sub frame of the later years and 85 got new front lower control arms to cut the turning circle down. Then we all know the changes for the 88 suspension by now but the space frame remaind much the same.

[This message has been edited by hyperv6 (edited 08-31-2006).]

Like mentioned above, the '86-87 SE has the "aero notchback" body style (identical to the '85 GT), regardless of what drivetrain is in it. Also, the '86-87 4cyl SE had the same dual-exit exhaust as the V6.

The SE body style also has the lowest drag coefficient of all the Fiero body styles. And the SE's generally weigh less than the GT's, because they usually have less add-on options.

I have an 85 SE V6 with a 4 speed. It will beat my dads 88 GT off the line everytime. Rated 5 more HP and a little lighter can make a big difference. Not nearly as stable at higher speeds because of the body on it though.

The 1985 weight was lower because it lacked the aero nose and ground FX that added the extra pounds. It SE weight was less than the fastbacks due to the fx and the fast back rear that added weight over the coupe. The options had little to do with it since most SE's were well optioned. Most only varied by having power window or not other wise most has air, tilt and other options the GT's had . Only the base coupe was purchase without many of the expected options.

Also the 5 HP was not really there per those at GM, it was just the way they rated the engine HP from year to year.. All the V6 engines really were pretty much the same except for different injectors in the 88 and some other very small differances.

quote Originally posted by Fieroseverywhere: I have an 85 SE V6 with a 4 speed. It will beat my dads 88 GT off the line everytime. Rated 5 more HP and a little lighter can make a big difference. Not nearly as stable at higher speeds because of the body on it though.

The 88 GT is the heaviest Fiero. The upgraded suspension and brakes added more weight. So your 85 SE is 170lbs less.
As stated the ratings changed in 1987 due to changes in the SAE standard for emission compliance, so 1987 and 1988 were both rated at 135hp.
The 1985-1987 engine were identical mechanically. The 88's had the exact same rating as the 1987 but had internally balanced crankshafts.
(Injectors had the same flow rates, just the style changed.)

I have an 85 SE with the V6 and i think all the GT options inside, how can i tell if i have the GT suspension as well??
Thanks

quote Originally posted by zmcdonal: I have an 85 SE with the V6 and i think all the GT options inside, how can i tell if i have the GT suspension as well?? Thanks

check for the WS6 suspension code on the RPO sheet under the hood

Does it just say WS6 on the RPO sheet. And is the RPO sheet on the fenderwell in under the hood?

quote Originally posted by zmcdonal: Does it just say WS6 on the RPO sheet. And is the RPO sheet on the fenderwell in under the hood?

Yes. If you have the WS6 suspension it will list it as WS6. SE's came with the Y99 Special Rally suspension package as a standard.
The Y99 was optional on the Sport Coupe and standard on SE's. WS6 was an option on the SE and standard on the GT.
Not sure if it is the same for all years, But the above does apply to the 85/86/87 SE's.

quote Originally posted by hyperv6: 11 pounds is about right for the 85 SE on paper. Owning this combo the 11 pounds make little differance but it dose give braging rights. Also other than the 1988 suspensions Fiero's are 98% the same under the skin. Only springs and minor mods from year to year were different. There were no seceret extra welds on GT's or any of that kind of changes. 84 had the rear tie rods hooked to the body vs sub frame of the later years and 85 got new front lower control arms to cut the turning circle down. Then we all know the changes for the 88 suspension by now but the space frame remaind much the same.

The WS6 suspension was standard on the 84-85 SEs and the 85 GT. My Formula sports that suspension also. My 3 1987 SE's all list the standard suspension' for the 86-87 SEs and that is the Y99 'Rally Suspension'. In 87 according to the 22P, the front springs were (stiffest to softest) JA, HZ, HY, HX, HW. The rear springs in the same order XD, WY, WX, WW. These are shown individually on your RPO sticker as 6__. LF, 7__ RF, 8__LR, 9__RR. My SE's , all with Y99, and all have the HZ springs on the front. One V6 and the 4 cyl have WY rear springs, but the other V6 has XD springs in the rear. Even with 220k on the suspension it has always felt 'heavier' than the others. Anyone who has looked at their suspension can usually verify this as there were tags (tape) attached at the factory to ID them.

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Notchbacks RULE

"Let a man drive a Fiero and he'll own one.
Teach a man to fix a Fiero and he'll own eight....errr...nine."

quote Originally posted by hyperv6: 84 had the rear tie rods hooked to the body vs sub frame of the later years

umm, what?

quote Originally posted by buddycraigg: umm, what?

I don't have a 84 and you may be able to confirm this.

It is my understanding the rear tie rods were tied to the body and not the sub frame on the 84 Fieros.

The 85 and up have the rear tie rods mounted to the subframe. this corrected the problem they has with the 84's getting a rear toe out problem as the body mounts started to have some give.