How much harder is an LQ1 to break down and rebuild compared to a standard cam-in block motor, like say an L67.......I'm considering starting my project with the engine before I get the car, but, I want to break It all down so I can teach my kids about engines (Just like my step dad did to me with my first 350)
-T
If you want really confuse someone start them off with an LQ1... It's crazy. Not really that difficult to understand but I personally would start off with a simpler design to show them. My mechanic has a built L67 sitting in his garage and he constantly reminds me how much easier it was to squeeze 300hp from it than rebuilding this thing we're working on. Theres a lot of moving parts, and several stupid GM designs that make you cringe. But nothing will make me regret choosing the LQ1 over the L67, its an awesome motor and much more exotic. You can always throw a blower like the Eaton M62 that's for sale on 60degreev6.com and make easy numbers. The LQ1 flows better than an L67 and I believe will make higher if not equal numbers under boost. I am not going that route yet, NA for right now.
So in just, I hope you go with the LQ1, its been loads of fun to rebuild. A lot harder than a cam block (timing bites) I'd do it again in a heartbeat. I just wonder if using the complicated design to teach your kids is the best thing to do, that would be on your part to decide.
Thank you for the kind words by the way.
quote
Originaly posted by Pavo Roddy
Hi all,
Paul, that engine looks fantastic!! Cleand up beeeeeyoutifully!
Todays the big day. I sent the heads to a machine shop and had mike put the whole thing back together while I was at school for the week. I jumped by yesterday to pick up a part from the garage...the motor stoped me in my tracks, its almost 100% back together and it looks... MEAN!
Todays the big day. Fuel lines and exhuast hopefully it will be running this weekend.
[This message has been edited by Emc209i (edited 01-20-2007).]
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10:37 AM
Jan 22nd, 2007
pavo_roddy Member
Posts: 4351 From: State with a city named Gotham Registered: Apr 2004
Exhaust was the breaking point, there weren't any shops open that could weld the crossover pipe, so we called it a weekend. My mechanic is going to flat bed it over to a guy who's really proclaimed in the area this week. So we shall see. Other than that, engine is in the car and ready to roll. We turned it over without fuel and it's a pretty agressive sounding engine.
We also tested for shorts and the system appears to be 100% electrically stable! So that was the highlight I think. I still have to finish the coolent temperature curcuit and cap the cruise circuit.
I saw your name over at the Kit car sight, what you over there for? Check your Pm's.
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07:21 PM
Jan 27th, 2007
pavo_roddy Member
Posts: 4351 From: State with a city named Gotham Registered: Apr 2004
Just got back from there. Taking a break and helping my dad put a set of brake pads on the stealth.
We're headed back over there soon to try to get all the coolent hoses hooked back up and solid fuel lines run across the engine bay. There was a serious clearence issue so we had to cut the dogbone braket off of the trunk wall.
I talked to two different guys this morning about exhaust Y-pipe. One guy has a very good attidude about it and is eager to do it. The other is the best exhaust maker in town, but he wasn't very enthusiastic about the job. I'm having to make a big decision about who I want to do the job (experience vs. easier to work with).
I'll snap a picture for you (ger gotta get some batteries), I'll try my best to get one! Thanks for the bump and interest Eric!
-Paul
[This message has been edited by Emc209i (edited 01-27-2007).]
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01:13 PM
motoracer838 Member
Posts: 3751 From: Edgewater Co. USofA Registered: Jan 2006
Originally posted by Emc209i: I talked to two different guys this morning about exhaust Y-pipe. One guy has a very good attidude about it and is eager to do it. The other is the best exhaust maker in town, but he wasn't very enthusiastic about the job. I'm having to make a big decision about who I want to do the job (experience vs. easier to work with).
I'll snap a picture for you (ger gotta get some batteries), I'll try my best to get one! Thanks for the bump and interest Eric!
-Paul
Paul, I did exaust work for about ten years before moving on to other things. if the one guy is as experienced as he's supposed to be the job should be a piece of cake. If your getting any kind of attitude from him about the job, STAY AWAY!!!
That's excellent advice Joe, thank you! Couldn't get the camera working by the time I left the house. It works now and I have an appointment with a certain Fiero again tomorrow.
The exhaust Y pipe will be the last thing done if at all possible. We are aiming for next Saturday.
-Paul
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07:01 PM
pavo_roddy Member
Posts: 4351 From: State with a city named Gotham Registered: Apr 2004
Fired it up tonight! Fuel is cutting off after running for about a second. If anyone has bypassed the theft deterent module, please respond to my thread in the Tech section! Steven, Kohburn, Fiero obsessed, Procarnut.
Here are some pictures...
So very close! I just need to get around the theft system.
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06:52 PM
PFF
System Bot
Jan 30th, 2007
pavo_roddy Member
Posts: 4351 From: State with a city named Gotham Registered: Apr 2004
Sniffle, sniffle, whine, whine.... Well at least you DID get something done! Is this where your at with the install? OH! Congratulations on attemping this too! What's planned for next weekend?
------------------ Me, I sell engines, the cars are for free, I need something to crate the engines in.... Enzo Ferrari....
Today they are called garage's, yesterday, they were stable's! Eric Jacobsen....
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01:31 AM
Erik Member
Posts: 5625 From: Des Moines, Iowa Registered: Jul 2002
Sniffle, sniffle, whine, whine.... Well at least you DID get something done!
Right........ How long has this entire build lasted? hmm.. lets see.. started in December..the uh.. 28th.. so
Its been one month.. ONE MONTH..
Let's see, what have I done in one month? Rebuilt entire motor... Installed new motor... Spliced two harnesses together in three days... Run fuel and coolent lines... Started engine...
I haven't bypassed the VAT system though.... Gee wiz I'm SOOO slow.
Stop whining and get me a 355 interior.
I want black btw.
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11:46 AM
ltlfrari Member
Posts: 5356 From: Wake Forest,NC,USA Registered: Jan 2002
I was thinking that it was you doing all the whining....lol..... HAHA!! My hat's off to you for the GREAT job so far, and in record time too..... . . . . . . . . . . . All though Loyde did do a 10 day install on a 3800 SC once.....
------------------ Me, I sell engines, the cars are for free, I need something to crate the engines in.... Enzo Ferrari....
Today they are called garage's, yesterday, they were stable's! Eric Jacobsen....
Jncomutt: I was going to send you a link to this thread.. lol.
I pray it will be on the road this weekend, but that's been my hope for every weekend. I can only hope this one goes without a hitch.
No I'm taking Statistics at Mint Uptown on Mondays, with Dr. Klipp. Micro Macro is next year (I'm a freshman here).
It would be great to meet you though, maybe as soon as I get my car back! Everytime I meet a Fiero person I don't have my car with me... wierd.
UPDATE ON CAR** I bit the bullet last night and mailed Darth. Hopefully I will get a new Mem-cal and adaptor tomorrow or Saturday, as he's air mailing it here. I pray that will take care of all the problems I'm having and over-ride the VATS among other things. I have decided the guy with ambition will do the Y-pipe, I think I can trust him more, and I think if he does a good job I'll take him some stainless pipe later next year for an entire 2.5 system.
Plans for this weekend include building a dogbone, trailering the car to the exhaust shop, and then plugging in the mem-cal. Then I plan on driving the car... (knock on wood)
Very Nice. It looks like you really put alot of thought and work into this. I like your car and the quality of workmanship. let me know if you need anything.
If this thing is ready by the Charlotte Autofair show, you going to bring it there? I wanna see it...and possibly drive it if you'll let me . I've been seriously considering a 3.4DOHC myself.
Want to hear a funny story. If you've been following the build you know that I had two options for having the Y pipe custom made.
-There was a younger boy who was up for a challenge and had the right attitude, yet he only had maybe 5 years experience. -Then there was another man who had 25 years experience but he wouldn't give me the time of day until I started walking out of his shop.
The younger boy couldn't get to it this weekend, and I've been without a daily driver for almost a month and a week, so I took to the older man. We towed the car over there and put it on a lift. When the guy finds out that I need a Y pipe made he goes bizerk! "I thought you only wanted me to bolt an already made Y-pipe up!!" (proving he hadn't been listening when I was talking to him before). I can't get to that until next week."
My dad watched as I gave him HELL. He tried explaining to me that he would need to use flex piping because the torque of the motor would break his pipes. I argued with him for about ten minutes. He kept acting like I didn't know what I was doing and then said something to the affect that it would take him more than a day to do. So I simply informed him that I had seen amateurs weld faster than that and that what he was saying was bull.
"I'm a perfectionist" was his reply... "SO AM I" was my retort haha
I went home to get him some hardware and when I came back he looked me in the eye and said "I'll call you when I get finished" to which I sincerely thanked him and informed him that I had to get my car back together so that I could get back and forth from Charlotte without relying on my parents for a ride home ever weekend. He said that his daughter went there as well and that he understood.
So he began at 9 Am when I returned with the parts. My dad just called him and said that he'll work past 2 (closing) to finish it!
Professionals should never loose ambition. It's what pushes us to excel and exceed. And now I admire him for staying past his work hours to complete the job, it makes me think he's dedicated. Just thought I'd share. Always be ready to reach beyond your grasp!
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03:13 PM
ltlfrari Member
Posts: 5356 From: Wake Forest,NC,USA Registered: Jan 2002
I just got back! I could have done a better job welding....
The guy was mad, said he'd charge someone $700 if he ever did that again, started throwing stuff around. Its his own fault, but oh well. I now have a Y pipe so I'm happy
The ECM didn't come though... sucky. Ryan said that it will be delivered on Sunday if not Saturday... but who ships on Sunday? Its coming via the post office. I'm stranded again it appears.
Damn that sucks about the Y-Pipe. Hell, I could have made you one... I agree with the welder that he might have wanted to use a small flex section between the two banks, that makes sense.
I should be getting a replacement quarter panel for my car to fill in its 'hole' on monday, along with my wideband bung so I can weld that in, exciting! BTW, have you heard about the uncc HPA? You should consider joining when you get your car back. There are a lot of neat events planned and a dyno after spring break that is free to club members.
Yes I know about the club, I just haven't gotten to one of the meetings yet. I saw the Mustang video from last years dyno, a cobra I think... I'd really like to meet you when I get back.
Maybe we can delay until next week though, so I can have my car with me haha.
Thats probably Phils cobra if it was red. There is another dyno video for the fall semister with all the cars, but personally I think the best was was the 249/287 fiero that was in it..
PM me when you have your car on campus, i'd like to check it out and be able to realize how ugly mine really is compared to a clean one, lol...
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10:30 PM
SLOWnSTEADY Member
Posts: 1706 From: Hiawatha, IA Registered: Jul 2005
you suck... After seeing this and seeing how CLEAN that motor is, i tore apart my spare engine, and sent the block and front cover out to be boiled. I am no reuilding the "spare" engine and will be dropping it into my '87 which already has a DOHC, but with about 130K miles...
you suck... After seeing this and seeing how CLEAN that motor is, i tore apart my spare engine, and sent the block and front cover out to be boiled. I am no reuilding the "spare" engine and will be dropping it into my '87 which already has a DOHC, but with about 130K miles...
Ahh hahaha roflol... (this seriously made me laugh hard)
Good for you! lol
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11:45 PM
PFF
System Bot
Feb 4th, 2007
SKIDMARK Member
Posts: 1350 From: Chardon, Ohio, USA Registered: Sep 2001
I just got back! I could have done a better job welding....
The guy was mad, said he'd charge someone $700 if he ever did that again, started throwing stuff around. Its his own fault, but oh well. I now have a Y pipe so I'm happy
The ECM didn't come though... sucky. Ryan said that it will be delivered on Sunday if not Saturday... but who ships on Sunday? Its coming via the post office. I'm stranded again it appears.
Pictures please!
It does suck to weld stuff together when it's in the engine bay. That's why most people just mock it up, tack weld it, and then pull it out to finish weld. Sounds like this guy was a jerk anyway. I did custom exhaust for a living for a few years and it's not that tough....just takes some artistic ability and patience. I agree that there should be some kind of expansion joint between the two manifolds but it's not a requirement, just a precaution.
I still need to send my stuff to Ryan and get my chip burned.....just procrastinating I guess.
The joint that came stock for the Fiero is way more than enough to ensure the pipe doesn't break, he was trying to make it complicated so he didn't have to do it.
I understand its hard to do exhaust, heck its "exhausting", my thing was the part about:
"I'm a perfectionist... I've been doing this for 25 years... I'll do the best job in town" And then he gets an attitude when he does a bad job... It doesn't matter any more, that's over with and I have a functional system for now. I wasn't ranting before I was just sharing, my dad was pretty angry with it though. Live and learn.
Pictures: there is this universal law. When you have a camera in your pocket it isn't a good time. When everyone leaves and you have a moment, you realize you took it out of your pocket earlier in the day and its laying on your dresser. The car is at the shop right now, if it were in the garage I'd be getting plenty of photo's. It was nice to see the car out in the sun today, you can see the engine much better.
The US Postal Service delivers parcels on Sunday when express shipped.... Wow that is so awesome! Go post office! Maybe I will have a running car this week!
Sig test!
------------------
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01:37 AM
Feb 5th, 2007
pavo_roddy Member
Posts: 4351 From: State with a city named Gotham Registered: Apr 2004
I'll elaborate later! So far I've gotten one 64 in a 45 (infraction because the cop was nice, happened on my first drive in the car). And I just got the car home because I shredded the belt when it jumped the pulley. It ate the pulley too. lol My seats must have imprints. I can't imagine this car with a small turbo much less a bigger one!
We spent all of yesterday tying loose knots and tracing down wires. We finally finished the car around 9:30 last night and I decided to drive the car to the store to pick up the last relays we would need to rewire the fan circuit. The clutch had a very different feeling, but as soon as it started to engage I could tell there was a lot of torque behind the wheels. I made it up the hill to the main road and tried to ease the car onto the road and slowly take off but the clutch bit and took off rather fast. I eased it into second and gave it some gas and the car started taking off faster than I wanted it to, so I slowed back down. I turned a corner and came to a straight road and decided to open it up some. The car sounded like the stock 2.8 at idle, but once it hits 3000RPM the belt noise comes in and all four cams start roaring. The car pulled to 3000RPM's like the 2.8 on juice would have..... and then it hit 3000.... and the car roared and pulled like..... well it was amazing! It just kept climbing, and with no power fall off like the 2.8. 4K. 5K. 6K. Off the tachometer.
Physically shaking at the next stop sign I decided to open it up again, the stock exhaust system can't hold the sound in, its amazing. I started pulling at 3000 RPM's again and the engine made its noise and I looked up and realized that in the stream of oncoming traffic there was a Sharrif's Deputy.... So I was pulled doing 64 in a 45. He asked me if I knew that I had an engine oil leak (engine was smoking the paint off) and I explained to him that the motor was new and I was just opening it up to see that it was mechanically sound. Believe it or not he started relating about a crate motor he had installed before and started going on about that....
He did write me a ticket though which I'll try to get out of seeing as how the Speedo isn't working right now. Failure of equipment.
The car really scares me, I seriously had trouble last night sleeping, its more power than I bargained for. I'm going to learn how to re drive the car. With the 2.8 I could open it up and make some noise while not speeding badly, but with this engine as soon as you open it up your flying faster than you had wanted. For instance, last night after the cop, I kicked it with my brother in the car and I scared myself again. This engine takes control of you, lulls you into this far off place as it screams and roars, and by the time your through second gear you realize how loud the engine is and how fast its launched you forward. Its going to take a lot of responsibility to keep tame with this motor.
Did I mention how smooth the motor is, its not even a GM any more in my mind, this car feels like an LT1 but the sound makes you think lotus or something.
The last straw came last night when coming around a corner the PS bypass pulley unscrewed itself and slipped the belt onto the PS bracket. The belt bit into the front cover and powder coated the engine bay with black rubber. Below is what the pulley looks like. The sleeve on the bolt is messed up even more, and so I'll have to wait another week to get the parts from GM direct. I'm almost glad I can't drive the car this week, it will give me some time to think about how much power it now has and how I'm going to have to be careful with it. I was still shaking last night when I wrote the above note. It's a bad ass engine.
[This message has been edited by Emc209i (edited 06-15-2008).]
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03:00 PM
Formula88 Member
Posts: 53788 From: Raleigh NC Registered: Jan 2001
Cleand up beeeeeyoutifully!
and had mike put the whole thing back together while I was at school for the week. I jumped by yesterday to pick up a part from the garage...the motor stoped me in my tracks, its almost 100% back together and it looks... MEAN! 
Check your Pm's.
Is this where your at with the install? OH! Congratulations on attemping this too! What's planned for next weekend?
I agree with the welder that he might have wanted to use a small flex section between the two banks, that makes sense. 
which I'll try to get out of seeing as how the Speedo isn't working right now. Failure of equipment. 
