So I had a few hours free on Thursday, and gutted my dash/console completely out of the car. I am custom installing a later Corvette dash (97-04) and it's looking gorgeous! There are a few issues that I can see as I'm working this out:

1. Obviously, it's too deep...no problem, I've lobbed almost a foot of the back off and now have it prefit to the dash area.
2. Mounts. I'm custom making brackets to attach to underside of the dash (epoxy + screw) that screw it into the factory mount locations
3. Gauge cluster. Ideally I'd like to get the C5 gauges working in the car...anyone have any tips/advice?
4. Console/Rear console. Believe it or not, the C5 parts look like they're going to work as well. I'll need to make a slender box cover for the computers on the back wall that I'll just carpet with the rear tray. Of course, it's a little too wide through the center (just barely), so I'm thinking that I should take this opportunity to put in new carpets (over the old after a thorough cleaning).
5. Radio/AC Controls, etc: I'll fit them up to the new areas in the dash, which means a custom cage to hold them. I think I may mount the AC Controls in the ashtray area of the C5 Console (has a lid to cover them).
6. Vents: I'll have to mate the 2 subassemblies together somehow...not looking forward to this, but it shouldn't be to hard really)
7. Steering column : It's really long now with the shortened dash area. Anyone have any tips on what shorter columns might work so that I can shove the steering wheel back a little towards the windshield (this would make entry/exit easier also)
8. Pictures I'll take some...what's the best way to get them hosted?

quote Originally posted by pacethis: So I had a few hours free on Thursday, and gutted my dash/console completely out of the car. I am custom installing a later Corvette dash (97-04) and it's looking gorgeous! There are a few issues that I can see as I'm working this out: 8. Pictures I'll take some...what's the best way to get them hosted?

I've been waiting for someone to do this. This should be very nice!!

You can host your pics right here by clicking on the Pennock's Image Poster at the bottom of every page.

quote Originally posted by pacethis: 8. Pictures I'll take some...what's the best way to get them hosted?

myfiero.com <--- By far the easiest & quickest way

Found a c5 dash pic on google images...

[This message has been edited by Cheever3000 (edited 02-25-2007).]

Oh I sooo want to see this!!

quote Originally posted by 8Ball: Oh I sooo want to see this!!

I second (and third) that

quote Originally posted by Mickey_Moose: I second (and third) that

I'll try to get some build pics up tomorrow night or Tuesday...must study for now as I have an Anatomy lab test on Human Bones tomorrow...

Of course, the first pics will be build pics full of dust, dirt, and incompletion

I hope to have the bulk of the project done by the end of the week.

So, anyone good with wiring care to take on the project of a custom wiring harness for the gauge cluster? If so, there would be a free C5 gauge cluster in it for you

I'm working on this one kit it's comeimg out this sunmmer so look for it

quote Originally posted by pacethis: So, anyone good with wiring care to take on the project of a custom wiring harness for the gauge cluster? If so, there would be a free C5 gauge cluster in it for you

This has me interested... I've done several harnesses for the firebird. The C5 is probably similar but I'm guessing. I have no idea how the C5 cluster works. I would need the factory service manual for the C5 of the appropriate year.

...hmmm, just occured to me. Before you get into the project, you might want to have a close look at the wiring diagrams for the gauges. I know for a fact on the Firebird ones, they will NOT work with the Fiero from 1999+. The 98 fuel gauge will not work (the rest will). From 99 on they are ECM controlled - this could be very similar to the Vette ones.

What year did the gauges come from - I can look around and see if I can dig up a wiring diagram for them and let you know.

Tim

quote Originally posted by Mickey_Moose: . I know for a fact on the Firebird ones, they will NOT work with the Fiero from 1999+. The 98 fuel gauge will not work (the rest will). From 99 on they are ECM controlled - this could be very similar to the Vette ones. Tim

Tim is right. If the C5 is anything like the 99+ firebird it's going to be very difficult to get them to work. It won't be plug and play without a computer to translate the analog senders into some kind of digital format. That is way beyond my abilities to design something like that. You might be able to adapt a C4 cluster to fit in that dash, (which is much more likely to have analog inputs)

quote Originally posted by jscott1: Tim is right. If the C5 is anything like the 99+ firebird it's going to be very difficult to get them to work. It won't be plug and play without a computer to translate the analog senders into some kind of digital format. That is way beyond my abilities to design something like that. You might be able to adapt a C4 cluster to fit in that dash, (which is much more likely to have analog inputs)

I guess I'll have to play around wtih them and see. If the C5 gauges don't work, I'll adapt aftermarket gauges into the area using the C5 gauge trim. One way or another, it'll be done. These gauges were released in 97 and didn't have major changes until 05.

Jscott...if you're interested in giving them a try, I'd be happy to send you a C5 cluster with harness and wiring diagrams for the C5. I'm a full time student, full time father, and still try to keep some $$ coming in, so time is limited. The install is going smooth on the dash, so there would be some potential for others needing them.

Pics tomorrow...you guys are going to love this dash!

quote Originally posted by pacethis: Jscott...if you're interested in giving them a try, I'd be happy to send you a C5 cluster with harness and wiring diagrams for the C5. ...

Let's start with the wiring diagrams to see if we are in the ballpark. The Firebird gauges look the same on the outside from 1993-2002, but there was a major redesign internally in 99, so it's possible the early C5 gauges are analog and the later ones digital.

Ok, not likely going to work - you might get the speedo to work, but the rest all look like it they are ECM controlled via serial data line. BTW there is a change in the gauges in 1999 - there is an addition of some push buttons.

Here is the 97 diagram if you are interested (left as a large file so it can be easily read):

[This message has been edited by Mickey_Moose (edited 02-27-2007).]

Yeah it doesn't look good for a mechanical plug and play solution like the Firebird. I didn't even see a tach signal.

If you could get one of the real smart guys like Riceburner98 he might be able to design an interface. Otherwise you probably want to put in aftermarket gauges in the housing like you stated earlier.

Okay guys...here's the first pic. I know she's filthy, dusty, and disrespected...but I think she's going to like her new dash

Tonight I was able to secure dash mounts using custom brackets and epoxy. So far I have 4 mounts on the back wall in the original location. My top cut wasn't perfect...so I'll probably put a small bead of windshield sealant on the back edge to hide it's imperfections. I'll probably have it leather covered eventually, so wasn't overly concerned with perfection here.

I also have almost mated 2 of the vents all the way through now. They are the 2 center ones...there is no place for one on the driver side...and the more I'm thinking about it, I'd rather have the space for storage behind the airbag cover than a cooling duct all the way to the right side of the car. With only 2 vents, dead centered, the volume of airflow should be excellent, and in such a small car, I'd think sufficient.

That looks like a really nice fit! I can't wait to see this finished! I bet it'll look like it was MEANT for the car!

That looks really nice. However in my opinion the center vent only is not going to be satisfactory. I would suggest getting some flexible hose and connecting the vents on the passenger side. Why isn't there enough room to hook up the driver vent?

quote Originally posted by jscott1: That looks really nice. However in my opinion the center vent only is not going to be satisfactory. I would suggest getting some flexible hose and connecting the vents on the passenger side. Why isn't there enough room to hook up the driver vent?

The C5 Driver side vent is in the door panel...so there's simply no place designed in the dash for it. I haven't completely decided on the furthermost passenger side vent...wouldn't you get the same amount of air from 2 vents as from 4? It's pushing the air through at a specific volume per time from the fan, so only difference is 1/2 vents = twice speed of air (if restricted). If it's not restrictive with 2, then no change on speed. Of course, the floor vents are still hooked up, and I'll be modifying the center dash to incorporate the stock windshield vent.

Looking very sharp. There is a cool way to make the gauges work....Put the LS motor in and use the stock computer. Otherwise you're pretty much screwed. But the big V8 would be pretty awesome.

Bob

quote Originally posted by RCR: Looking very sharp. There is a cool way to make the gauges work....Put the LS motor in and use the stock computer. Otherwise you're pretty much screwed. But the big V8 would be pretty awesome. Bob

Yes, normally I'd agree. In fact, I had a Northstar in an 86GT a few years ago. The Ls* motor is a great motor and would be nice, but it's a little tighter of a fit than I prefer. The 3800SC in it right now works pretty well. I'll probably upgrade it to a 3800SC Series 2 this summer and do some minor mods putting me in the same 350/400 power range.

Unless of course someone has made the LS motors fit better than the other 350 motors I've seen, which required pulleys wrapped into the wheel well area...

You may want to check with http://www.dakotadigital.com/ to see if they have a converter that will allow you to use the C5 gauges.

That dash looks great!

Would the Firebird gauges fit in the C5's dash? If so, you could wire it up to the Fiero with little problems; and still have an updated gauge package to match your updated dash.

quote Originally posted by pacethis: The C5 Driver side vent is in the door panel...so there's simply no place designed in the dash for it. I haven't completely decided on the furthermost passenger side vent...wouldn't you get the same amount of air from 2 vents as from 4? It's pushing the air through at a specific volume per time from the fan, so only difference is 1/2 vents = twice speed of air (if restricted). If it's not restrictive with 2, then no change on speed. Of course, the floor vents are still hooked up, and I'll be modifying the center dash to incorporate the stock windshield vent.

I guess you are going to need to use the C5 door panels?

Airflow typically doesn't work in a linear fashion, that is if you restrict the opening by 1/2 the velocity will not double. It doesn't work that way because air is compressible and there are losses in the system. Also the heat is coming through the glass, so having the cool air only in the middle will make it feel hotter. I like to have the air blowing directly on me from both sides. But maybe that's just me.

quote Originally posted by Deabionni: Would the Firebird gauges fit in the C5's dash? If so, you could wire it up to the Fiero with little problems; and still have an updated gauge package to match your updated dash.

I was just wondering the same thing...but I was beaten to the post

quote Originally posted by Deabionni: Would the Firebird gauges fit in the C5's dash?

I can't tell from the picture, but I'm willing to bet the sizes are close enough to make it work.

It looks like it'd take some work to make the Firebird cluster fit into the C5 dash. Here's some pics I found on ebay.

Firebird:


Corvette:

Okay the Firebird looks too tall, but what I would do would be to remove the Firebird gauges (the actual gauge motor itself) and mount those behind a gutted out C5 cluster bezel. It might be tricky to get the calibration, but it would at least look cool.

quote Originally posted by jscott1: I guess you are going to need to use the C5 door panels? Airflow typically doesn't work in a linear fashion, that is if you restrict the opening by 1/2 the velocity will not double. It doesn't work that way because air is compressible and there are losses in the system. Also the heat is coming through the glass, so having the cool air only in the middle will make it feel hotter. I like to have the air blowing directly on me from both sides. But maybe that's just me.

No, it wouldn't be terribly difficult to pipe a vent coming out on the left side somewhere...there's just no prebuilt place for it. I stopped by lowe's tonight and got some flexible AC ducting. It should make this much easier to hook up all the rest of the vents I appreciate all the input here!

Still haven't gotten anywhere on the gauges... I think the firebird gauges could be made to fit...but there are other options as well.

Here's a picture of some ~$230 gauges on eBay
http://i3.ebayimg.com/05/i/000/8e/dc/f535_1_b.JPG
http://i17.ebayimg.com/02/i/000/8e/c4/d32a_1_b.JPG

Plenty of options!

It wasn't until I saw the firebird side by side when I realized that design is starting to look dated. The basic 4th gen cluster dates back to '93, and maybe earlier since the 1990 Fiero prototype is sporting one.

It would be the ultimate in cool to get the actual C5 gauges working but short of installing an LSx engine I don't know how you would do it.

quote Originally posted by tampalinc: You may want to check with http://www.dakotadigital.com/ to see if they have a converter that will allow you to use the C5 gauges.

Some of these digital gauges look great as well. Thanks for the link!

The guy at egauges is a nightmare - nice to your face, then sends you the wrong stuff, and refuses to make good. Screwed me out of $50; glad it wasn't more. Shop his website THEN buy your gauges from someone else OR directly from the MANUFACTURER's website . Why go through him ?

Good info, but stay away from buying from him.

[This message has been edited by PaulJK (edited 03-01-2007).]

quote Originally posted by PaulJK: The guy at egauges is a nightmare - nice to your face, then sends you the wrong stuff, and refuses to make good. Screwed me out of $50; glad it wasn't more. Shop his website THEN buy your gauges from someone else OR directly from the MANUFACTURER's website . Why go through him ? Good info, but stay away from buying from him.

Thanks for the heads up I'll definitely not purchase from them. If they can't fix an order, they're not worth dealing with...

Another cluster that may fit, might be a cluster out of a Pontiac Trans Sport minivan. They don't have as many gauges in the cluster, but it would still light up in the Pontiac red and have a more up to date look.

1998 Cluster:


1997 Cluster:


Although, these do pale in comparison with the C5 cluster.

[This message has been edited by Deabionni (edited 03-03-2007).]

Just a bump for updates.

quote Originally posted by Fiero1Fan: Just a bump for updates.

Sadly, none yet. It's been crazy busy here lately...and the car woulnd't start after I got home the other night, so I haven't even put it back in the garage to finish up the final touches on the dash.

I think I need a new starter...hopefully I'll have time to get it running again next week.

josh

What have you found out about getting theC5 cluster to work in a Fiero?

Bump

Okay guys...I had a long winded post made...but lost it when I uploaded the pics and don't have the energy to retype it all...

Basically, I've had a few hours to play, so I put in C5 Corvette Seats (still have to affix to rails), new carpets, and have been using Duplicolor spray dye to change the color of a few interior pieces...still lots of work to do, but it's progress anyhow!

[This message has been edited by pacethis (edited 03-27-2007).]