quote Originally posted by Don Kraus: Shawn,looks like you can hand it out but can't take it,pretty childish.The reason I posted that was because you asked in the other thread if I blew it up yet.I was just replying to your statement from the thread of an update on my car.The rest of your statements don't make sense.I don't know why you are so bitter. Madcurl,I'll get some pictures of the brakes and mounts for you. Don

GAWD your a moron.

1) Your the one dishing it out

2) I NEVER ASKED JACK about your toilet anyhow. LOOK AT THE THREAD !!! D.H. was asking.

3) Dont play stupid in front of everyone here. Your cover has been blown since someone squealed on you about badmouthing me across the entire midwest.

Take your senile insults back to Wisconsin.

quote Originally posted by PURPLE REIGN: GAWD your a moron. 1) Your the one dishing it out 2) I NEVER ASKED JACK about your toilet anyhow. LOOK AT THE THREAD !!! D.H. was asking. 3) Dont play stupid in front of everyone here. Your cover has been blown since someone squealed on you about badmouthing me across the entire midwest. Take your senile insults back to Wisconsin.

Wow whats with the hostility! come on this is a community! lets not bicker and argue! Now you two hug and make up or I will shoot a bunny in the head with a desert eagle! DO IT! Or the bunny goes boom!

quote Originally posted by IMSA GT: HOPEFULLY, this thread does not turn into a war over the motor issue....

Too late.

A Don Kraus build up is always entertaining because of his attention to detail. If I were a drag racer I would just do what he does.

quote Originally posted by PURPLE REIGN: GAWD your a moron. 1) Your the one dishing it out 2) I NEVER ASKED JACK about your toilet anyhow. LOOK AT THE THREAD !!! D.H. was asking. 3) Dont play stupid in front of everyone here. Your cover has been blown since someone squealed on you about badmouthing me across the entire midwest. Take your senile insults back to Wisconsin.

Are you kidding?

quote Originally posted by PURPLE REIGN:Probably blown up already....................................

You were the third poster in that thread. Not to be an a$$ or anything but you started it dude.

Don love the thread keep up the good work! looking forward to the end result

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ARCHIES JUNK IS FASTER THAN SHAUNNA'S JUNK

PLEASE----PLEASE--DON'T SHOOT THE BUNNY.

quote Originally posted by LT188GT: PLEASE----PLEASE--DON'T SHOOT THE BUNNY.

Wouldst shooting the bunny not be funny? Or would it leave you feeling just plain old crummy?
These are important questions of life but, alas, I cannot answer them for I am a mere dummy.

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" Although all answers are replys, not all replys are answers."

quote Originally posted by FIEROPHREK: You were the third poster in that thread. Not to be an a$$ or anything but you started it dude. Don love the thread keep up the good work! looking forward to the end result

People on PFF have no sense of humor.... what a joke.

quote Originally posted by Don Kraus: Madcurl,I'll get some pictures of the brakes and mounts for you. Don While your at it, whats the weight on the Wilwood Dynolight brakes vs. old style?

quote Originally posted by Racing_Master: Wow whats with the hostility! come on this is a community! lets not bicker and argue! Now you two hug and make up or I will shoot a bunny in the head with a desert eagle! DO IT! Or the bunny goes boom!

Watch out for that bunny...It's got fangs!!!!! And look at all the bones!!!!

this is going to be an awesome car .thanks for doing this thread .just wanted to add a little to the solid mount discussion : more than a few turbo cars have had to go with rubber mounts because of solid mounts causing high knock readings .i used rubber mounts on my car , but solid (AL) cradle mounts .

quote Originally posted by Racing_Master: Wow whats with the hostility! come on this is a community! lets not bicker and argue! Now you two hug and make up or I will shoot a bunny in the head with a desert eagle! DO IT! Or the bunny goes boom!

Didn't somebody get a lot of money for that stunt ?

[This message has been edited by MinnGreenGT (edited 06-11-2008).]

Too late, he's already dead

Thanks Fierophrek for clearing that up.
I have no idea where Shawn got the idea I was badmouthing him as I haven't been to any Fiero events in the last two years other than IL.last fall to talk to anyone.I think he better check his source and question that person.The only thing I ever said about Shawn was on the forum,not behind his back,that he talks a lot about how fast his car is but doesn't back it up with times at the strip.I have no reason to badmouth him.

I'll keep the info coming as it progresses.

Don

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Too Far
60' - 1.491 sec
1/4 mi - 11.323 sec
mph - 116.40

quote Originally posted by Don Kraus: Thanks Fierophrek for clearing that up. I have no idea where Shawn got the idea I was badmouthing him as I haven't been to any Fiero events in the last two years other than IL.last fall to talk to anyone.I think he better check his source and question that person.The only thing I ever said about Shawn was on the forum,not behind his back,that he talks a lot about how fast his car is but doesn't back it up with times at the strip.I have no reason to badmouth him. I'll keep the info coming as it progresses. Don

Go ahead, play the innocent " I didnt say anything, I don't know anything " role. You dont have to go to any event to open ones big mouth & slander someone.

Why would an individual from another state with no bias toward anyone make such a claim that your badmouthing somone else.

Come out of the closet Don, and fess up.
p.s. Your going to need some proof of me "claiming how fast my car is."

quote Originally posted by PURPLE REIGN: Blah, Blah, Blah

Hey man, the bunny is dead already!

quote Originally posted by Don Kraus: .The only thing I ever said about Shawn was on the forum,not behind his back,that he talks a lot about how fast his car is but doesn't back it up with times at the strip.I have no reason to badmouth him. Don

I don't really want to get involved in an argument but you really can't claim to be the better man on higher moral ground when you ad a cheap shot like that at the end of your post.

who cares. so who say fierox is now in the 11.3 club!!!!

Don - I hope you start another thread so we can see the progress

I'll keep updating the progress as it comes along.

Don

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Too Far
60' - 1.491 sec
1/4 mi - 11.323 sec
mph - 116.40

Madcurl,here are some pictures of the Dynalite Wilwood brakes and brackets.The Wilwoods weight three pounds with the pads and the factory calipers with pads weight 6 1/2 lbs.The rotors are Daytona 11 inch.This should make this thing stop I hope.




Don

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Too Far
60' - 1.491 sec
1/4 mi - 11.323 sec
mph - 116.40

Don Kraus- That looks like the Wilwood brake upgrade that Rockcrawl sells. Im just curious why you are using the 11 inch rotors instead of the 13 inch corvette rotors that his kit comes with? Also are those 4 piston calipers and why is the caliper not using all of the surface area of the rotor. It looks like the inside 1/4-3/8 of the rotor is not even being used. Just wondering?

Daniel,I'm using 11 inch rotors for two reasons,I want to use 15 inch wheels for drag racing and 12 and 13 inch rotors won't fit.Also the bigger ones are heavier and adds to unsprung weight,every pound of unsprung weight equals 7 pounds of real weight.So if I save two pounds per wheel that equals 14 lbs,times 4 equals 56lbs of real weight.Those are 4 piston rotors and there is room for a deeper rotor but the stopping force is on the outside of the rotor so ther is no need to cover the whole rotor.
Don

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Too Far
60' - 1.491 sec
1/4 mi - 11.323 sec
mph - 116.40

Don- Allright that definitely makes sense. I have the 13 inch Heavy duty on the front of my car and they weigh in at like 21-25 lbs a piece so i can definitely see where you are coming from. Very nice swap and cant wait to see it run. Thanks Daniel

Don, very very very nice looking project. Glad to see someone actually talking the time (and spending the money) to do a very hi-HP build right -- in that the entire car is getting a makeover, not just the engine compartment. Keep up the good work. I do have one question tho, what belt tensioner arm are you using?

-ryan

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power corrupts. absolute power corrupts absolutely.

Custom GM OBD1 & OBD2 Tuning | Engine Conversions | www.gmtuners.com

Hi Ryan,good to hear from you.I'm using the 3.4 overhead cam engine tensioner.I think the tensioner from the 3800SC supercharger will work tho.I just needed to use a half inch spacer to use that tensioner.The belt is real tight on it,I don't know if I like that,even tho I have half the tensioner slake left in it.Its a bear to get on.
The project is taking longer than I like but when you reinvent the wheel,thats the way it is.Everything you do has an effect on something else and you have to address that,order parts or make them,wait for parts.But if you rush it you'll end up doing things over.For me the fun is overcoming some of the challanges.
Your LS4 install has been helpful also,thanks for that.
Don

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Too Far
60' - 1.491 sec
1/4 mi - 11.323 sec
mph - 116.40

Looking good, Don. But we knew you would have to do something spectacular to replace that Aldino!

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The 6th Annual California Coast Run
October 24-26, 2008

quote Originally posted by Don Kraus: Hi Ryan,good to hear from you.I'm using the 3.4 overhead cam engine tensioner.I think the tensioner from the 3800SC supercharger will work tho.I just needed to use a half inch spacer to use that tensioner.The belt is real tight on it,I don't know if I like that,even tho I have half the tensioner slake left in it.Its a bear to get on. The project is taking longer than I like but when you reinvent the wheel,thats the way it is.Everything you do has an effect on something else and you have to address that,order parts or make them,wait for parts.But if you rush it you'll end up doing things over.For me the fun is overcoming some of the challanges. Your LS4 install has been helpful also,thanks for that. Don

Yea I also used the 3.4 DOHC tensioner arm but actually modified it so I could swing it out further to install the belt (you will see where the steel limiter touches the aluminum arm to limit travel, I simply got in there with a die grinder aluminum bit and removed a little bit of material so I could pull on the tensioner arm a little more to give myself more slack to install the belt).

I feel you on the "reinvent the wheel" comment. There are a few things I will do differently when I do the next LS4 swap based on my learning experience with the first one -- not that there's anything wrong with what I originally did for that swap. Just now that it's done and I've thought about it, I've come up with new (and easier) ways to address issues and/or do things differently.

Can't wait to see your project in-person tho. I look forward to that. Good luck!

-ryan

Updates?

I was on vacation last week fishing,so nothing new.But I'll be back at it this week hoping to get it primed and over to the painter.Then I'll put the engine in for good.

Don

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Too Far
60' - 1.491 sec
1/4 mi - 11.323 sec
mph - 116.40

Will it be "racing red" like the other car?
Looks Great so far Don, more about the body!
Did ya catch some big fish?

Do you have pics of the alt mount?
Will you run an exhaust pipe under the oil pan?

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quote Originally posted by madcurl: Updates?

Well, don't make me beg for updates.

Don is one of the few that have gone where others on this forum haven't- in the 11's in the 1/4 mile. Rather than trying to criticise his achievement, post replys should offer something positive. Trouble is that we have too many immature whiners that aways want to say "my Fiero is better than your Fiero' or " my swap cost less than your swap so you don't know what you are doing " and all kinds of other childish stuff. etc. Don has proved that he can build a fast Fiero and if you want to do it stop the bench racing and start building.
Dons 427 project like Archies LS7 is an insane quality swap for sure but they have shown what they can do. If you can do better just provide proof that you can do better and then your post becomes believable.Otheriwise its pure B.S.
Keep those pics coming Don

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87GT - 3800SC Series III engine, 3.4" Pulley, N* TB, LS1 MAF, Flotech Exhaust Autolite 104's Custom CAI 4T65eHD w. custom axles
87GT - 3.4L Turbocharged engine, modified TH125H
" I'M ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "

[This message has been edited by Dennis LaGrua (edited 07-20-2008).]

Rickady,heres a picture of the alternator bracket.I'm using one from a 2000 3800 SC engine.It's real simple,just a piece of angle iron with the holes bored in it to fit to the engine and right to left to line up the belt.Then a piece of flat stock from the engine down to the alternater.I'm not going under the pan with the exhaust,I'm going over the transaxle like the 3800SC.
Madcurl,I'll try to post more often to keep you from withdrawell problems.
Dennis,thanks for your support,just trying to build something the Fiero community can be proud of,don't know yet how fast it will be,but I will find out.I'd like to get to the LS shootout in Memphis Tenn. on Oct 9th to 12th if I can get it broke in by then.
Now that the body work is done things should move faster now.I still have a little wiring to do on the motor and trans,but I can do that while the body is being painted.I'm using stand alone computers for the engine and transaxle.

Don

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Too Far
60' - 1.491 sec
1/4 mi - 11.323 sec
mph - 116.40

quote Originally posted by Don Kraus: Rickady,heres a picture of the alternator bracket.I'm using one from a 2000 3800 SC engine.It's real simple,just a piece of angle iron with the holes bored in it to fit to the engine and right to left to line up the belt.Then a piece of flat stock from the engine down to the alternater.I'm not going under the pan with the exhaust,I'm going over the transaxle like the 3800SC. Madcurl,I'll try to post more often to keep you from withdrawell problems. Dennis,thanks for your support,just trying to build something the Fiero community can be proud of,don't know yet how fast it will be,but I will find out.I'd like to get to the LS shootout in Memphis Tenn. on Oct 9th to 12th if I can get it broke in by then. Now that the body work is done things should move faster now.I still have a little wiring to do on the motor and trans,but I can do that while the body is being painted.I'm using stand alone computers for the engine and transaxle. Don

If you can make it down here for the shootout, let me know! I would love to get some pictures and video of your car heading down the track. Two cars I built should be going, so I will be there aimlessly wandering around.

quote Originally posted by Racing_Master: Well... I believe in solid mounts because of their principal Everyone knows, at least I hope, Energy cannot be created or destroyed, only converted. Energy used to compress the rubber or poly mounts is converted, SO, in essence, you lose some power from the poly or rubber mounts. Solids make it so it has to twist the whole car. Problem is that you cannot (I repeat, CANNOT) place ALL solid mounts on an engine and transmission. The engine will twist the chassis, I dont care how well you build it, it will twist it, and if the trannie mount is also solid, at least on longitudinal, it will break the bellhousing off the transmission. Also if you use solid mounts, I can bet it wont be a good car to ride as a daily driver, rattle your bones out all over the place. Can-Am cars used the engines as part of the frame, actually one of my ideas for a Fiero custom frame is having the engine an integral part. Generally speaking, this will make it so 99% of the force produced in the engine gets to the rear wheels. Though it be a miniscule amount that using solids over rubber gives you (probably a fraction of a HP) every hp counts in racing.

So you want that 0.083 HP even if you've got to deal with your cradle cracking? That's a good choice...
Compliant mounts take a small amount of energy (the compliance of the mount times the distance the powertrain moves on the mount) to compress and then they do not absorb any more energy. However, as you're lifting off the throttle and releasing the load on the mounts, YOU GET THAT ENERGY BACK. Compliant mounts store energy... they don't waste it. Well designed mounts have a low compliance AND only a small amount of motion. The amount of energy stored is tiny.

However, the big boon is that they take the edge off of any shock loading that you apply to the powertrain. It doesn't take much compliance to do this, but it works wonders for component life.

If you're worried about 0.083 HP, there are a HELL of a lot more places where you need to be spending a LOT of money in order to get all the other tenths of ponies that are hiding out around your car. To go to solid mounts in the name of power optimization without ALSO optimizing everything else to the same degree is just ridiculous.
How do I know you haven't optimized everything else to the same degree? You're not running 10's.

quote Originally posted by Don Kraus: Rickady,heres a picture of the alternator bracket.I'm using one from a 2000 3800 SC engine.It's real simple,just a piece of angle iron with the holes bored in it to fit to the engine and right to left to line up the belt.Then a piece of flat stock from the engine down to the alternater.I'm not going under the pan with the exhaust,I'm going over the transaxle like the 3800SC.

Thank you. That alt is different than the stock LS4. It looks easier to mount. I am not sure if I can just change over to an alt like that?
I like what you have done.

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That looks like a properly mounted 99+ 3800 alternator.