After shelling out $118 for a set of door decals and windshield glarestrip “PONTIAC” lettering, and after a long, long, FAR TOO LONG period of waiting for them to arrive, they finally did.

Then, the next few weeks got REALLY busy for me, and I didn’t have a chance to apply the decals: until now. Lucky for me (a FREAK for “stock-ness” and historical accuracy,) I took out the single, 24-year-old original decal that came with my Indy and compared it to the reproduction. Much to my aggravation, this is what I saw:



As you can see, the reproduction is NOT a faithful copy of the original, as was promised to me by the owner of the decal company I spoke to prior to ordering. He swore that his decals were taken directly from factory originals and were GM licensed. Instead, you can see that the new decals use a font with slightly thinner lettering. Also, look at the f’s in “OFFICIAL” - - the reproductions are rounded off where the originals aren’t. Also, look at the bottom line of lettering – there are joined letters on the original decal, but separated ones on the reproduction.

Unfortunately for me, I’ve already applied the glarestrip lettering. Measuring and pre-placement for this took FAR too long, partly because I’m too much of a stickler for detail, and partly because of what I only realized once the lettering was applied, and I measured the actual size of the letters:

The “P” is 4 3/8” tall.


The “N” is 4 1/2” tall.


The “C” is 4 9/16” tall.


Yeah, yeah... I know I'm splitting hairs. In this picture, you probably can’t see that anything is off:


However, I KNOW that it’s off. Sure, If the door stickers were right, I could live with it. I’ve been told that the lettering on the original pace cars at Indy wasn’t perfect either. But as it is… NO!

This is a 4,350-mile Indy, and I want it RIGHT.

And, as far as I'm concerned, the door decals SUCK.

I’ve left a message for the proprietor of the decal company – we’ll see if he calls back. I expect some sort of mitigating offer for refund or replacement.

But, if that doesn’t happen:
- Where can I get FAITHFUL reproduction decals (door and glarestrip – my Indy has everything else.)
- Who wants a couple door decals that are ALMOST right at a GREATLY reduced cost?
- Who wants to know the name of this decal company? I’ll definitely post it here if they don’t make SOME effort to make me less angry than I am right now…

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My Indy



The Indy



And I applaud you for your accuracy
As far as the windshield decal I noticed when I put mine on that one side seemed different than the other.


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Factory Stock…
The way God intended it to be.

[This message has been edited by ohioindy (edited 07-15-2008).]

OHIOINDY, why do you have such a big gap between the " May 27 " ?

You were in touch with the right guy in this thread.

https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/070085.html

He would have sent you these.







Kevin

quote Originally posted by FIERO JOHN-WI: OHIOINDY, why do you have such a big gap between the " May 27 " ?

Good question..
That is a pic of Indy #2
and that is way to big of a gap.
I looked at pics of Indy #1 and it doesn't have that gap
I'll have to look at my spares tonight.

I have a guy that makes them for me as well. This is how they come out.



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Indy#64~FieroNews~Boots~Bag s~Wallets~Headliner~Spare Cover~
Visors~Sunshads and T-Top Sunshades~

[This message has been edited by Fiero Thomas (edited 07-15-2008).]

quote Originally posted by Fiero Thomas: I have a guy that makes them for me as well. This is how they come out.

The "F"s are not supposed to have the curve in them.

Kevin

Ha. I like you Davikan. You're the only guy more obsessed wirh stock-ness than me.

Go git 'em!

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88 GT 5-Speed...5K orig
88 GT 5-Speed...16K orig
88 GT Auto...42K orig
88 Formula 5-Speed...87K, silver.
87 GT 5-Speed, Blue...18K orig
87 GT 5-Speed...55K orig

Just a note about letter sizes. In most type fonts, the rounded letters fall above and below the height and base line of the squared letters. e, c, C, G, J, o, O, Q, s, S all round out above and/or below the lines. Due to optical illusion, if they were exactly the same height, they would look smaller. As for the N being smaller, it may be due to having to arc the copy to fit across the windshield.

To check what I've said, go out to any big truck that's lettered, lay a straight edge along the tops or bottoms of squared letters and you'll see rounded portions of letters protruding.

quote Originally posted by davikan:

It's not only that but look at the second line. almost every letter isn't correct.

quote Originally posted by davikan: I’m too much of a stickler for detail,

Oh boy, I just wish my Indy was reliable enough to drive to the corner store without catching fire or breaking down... You would live a longer and happier life if you didn't stress over trivial details.

Those aren't really trivial, especially if they're going on a 4500 mile car. The F's in 'Official' are REALLY off, everything else I really had to look to see the differences.

quote Originally posted by jscott1: Oh boy, I just wish my Indy was reliable enough to drive to the corner store without catching fire or breaking down... You would live a longer and happier life if you didn't stress over trivial details.

Live longer and happier? You're probably right. But then again, I can drive my Indy to the corner store, and not only does it not catch fire or break down, but I sniff "new car smell" all the way there. It's more addicting than cocaine.

Don't let me get at your Indy. I'd probably obsess about it until it ran like a swiss clock, or I died first obsessing about it - one or the other.

quote Originally posted by RRobinson: Ha. I like you Davikan. You're the only guy more obsessed wirh stock-ness than me. Go git 'em!

Vive la O.C.D. !!!
Someone's gotta preserve the last remaining low-mileage examples of our little car: it might as well be wierdos like us!

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davikan,

I commend you on your good eye, but would it make you feel any better if i told you that my 193 mile original GM windshield banner dimensions exactly the same as yours? Well, it does. The lettering was never "symetrical" on the windshield. Some reproductions corrected this and they look out of place to me.



As far as the door decals, no they are not correct. Paul McKibben sells the accurate reproductions.

Fred

quote Originally posted by RWDPLZ: Those aren't really trivial, especially if they're going on a 4500 mile car. The F's in 'Official' are REALLY off, everything else I really had to look to see the differences.

You shouldn't be putting reproduction decals on a 4500 mile car...that's what the original NOS parts are for.

I bought mine from Paul McKibben and there exact to your orignal. WWW.Fierosails.com

.

[This message has been edited by davikan (edited 07-16-2008).]

davikan-
Had a similar problem when I purchased the red dot matrix tape for my front fascia which needed to be repainted.
I ordered from a seller on ebay who was willing to sell me just enough tape for the fascia, which I appreciated! Well the tape arrived......in a small envelope! The guy folded the tape multilpe times to get it in the envelope! When we tried to apply the decal it cracked an tore at every point it was folded.
I purchased a complete tape set from Phoenix Graphics (they would only sell me the complete set, but at least it is available). It arrived in a small box on a roll, and went on perfectly.
Just what I needed......more frustration while trying to get everything done before the 25th show! L.O.L.!!
Good luck with your door decals.

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84' Indy Pace Car (car #2000)
86' G.T.
87' Coupe
Member: NIFE

I have to agree that those are way too off for my tastes as well. I also bought a set from Paul McKibben and they are as close to the originals as can be.

One other thing to note: notice the 2nd N in INDIANAPOLIS - the bottom has a little 'blip' as well on the NOS (and Paul McKibben's).

...now if only someone made a proper repo of the trunk decal - that being a printed one, not the vinyl cut one...the original is printed on a piece of clear backing.

quote Originally posted by Mickey_Moose: I have to agree that those are way too off for my tastes as well.

Thanks - it's good to know that I'm not just obsessing over things no one else would notice. (Then again, I'm nuts enough to let it bother me even if no one else noticed...)

quote Originally posted by Mickey_Moose: One other thing to note: notice the 2nd N in INDIANAPOLIS - the bottom has a little 'blip' as well on the NOS (and Paul McKibben's).

You're correct - I didn't notice that - good eye! Here's a picture of my single, NOS decal:

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quote Originally posted by davikan: You're correct - I didn't notice that - good eye! Here's a picture of my single, NOS decal:

That was one of the big things to me (along with all the others) when I was looking at buying replacement decals and can vouch for Paul's as being correct (can not comment on others).

edit: while on the topic - if someone could send me a high res scan of the decklid one, I know someone that may be able to print some up. I just don't have access to an original (on or off the car) to scan myself.

[This message has been edited by Mickey_Moose (edited 07-16-2008).]

quote Originally posted by Mickey_Moose: That was one of the big things to me (along with all the others) when I was looking at buying replacement decals and can vouch for Paul's as being correct (can not comment on others). edit: while on the topic - if someone could send me a high res scan of the decklid one, I know someone that may be able to print some up. I just don't have access to an original (on or off the car) to scan myself.

Could you buy one of Paul McKibben's? Or are you looking to make one that is the two color on clear and not the vinyl type he sells?

Besides price, what's the difference between Paul McKibben's decals and shop_rat45's decals?

shop_rat45's look pretty good - or at least they do in the photos posted above by Lambo nut, and he sells them for less. I'd gladly pay extra money to Paul McKibben if his decals are superior in some way. However, if they're not...

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Both my Indys have the curved 'F's.

quote Originally posted by davikan: Hey: wow! I wonder where helpful suggestions like these were when I originally posted ( https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/070085.html ) asking for advice on where to get decals? If you've got a set of mint NOS decals, let me know. I'll send you my address, you'll send me the NOS decals, and I'll put 'em on! Otherwise, I think I'm S.O.L.

Sorry if my comment is less than helpful. If my Indy ever gets good paint on it, I wouldn't give a rats A$$ if the "F"s are curved or straight in the re-popped decals.

However, if I had a mint condition low miles Indy, I would keep it as original as possible, I wouldn't put reproduction decals on it, no matter how good they looked. No I don't have NOS decals, but I would bet dollars to donuts that some exist somewhere. I bet at least one member on this forum is hoarding a set in their collection.

[This message has been edited by jscott1 (edited 07-17-2008).]

Guess I should actually take a look at the set behind the seat of the Indy I bought from maryland.

I took a look at the decals I got on Ebay from make-it-sticky. They have the correct "F"s, and the gaps appear correct. His was the lowest-price set around, too. He even threw in the trunk "Indy Fiero" decal. Quite a nice guy. I see he is not selling any more at the moment; but you could send him an email and ask for a set. Hopefully this summer I will get the car painted and apply these decals. Then, look out! Because I will be driving the wheels off it.

quote Originally posted by fierofool: Just a note about letter sizes. In most type fonts, the rounded letters fall above and below the height and base line of the squared letters. e, c, C, G, J, o, O, Q, s, S all round out above and/or below the lines. Due to optical illusion, if they were exactly the same height, they would look smaller. As for the N being smaller, it may be due to having to arc the copy to fit across the windshield. To check what I've said, go out to any big truck that's lettered, lay a straight edge along the tops or bottoms of squared letters and you'll see rounded portions of letters protruding.

Agreed.

However, the door decals are WWAAYYY off, from the original.

Since this thread is about splitting hairs over exact reproduction decals, I thought I would mention that some of the cheaper reproduction door decals are printed black. The originals are a dark charcoal gray. Also, I have noticed on the cheaper decal sets that the thickness of the material used is much thinner. Admitting that I really do not know much about the technical aspects of decal material, I do not know how many mils thick the originals are versus new reproductions and what quality of material was used. The originals are thick enough that you could get a good accumulation of wax around them.

Fred

quote Originally posted by maryjane: Guess I should actually take a look at the set behind the seat of the Indy I bought from maryland.

...Don's got a set of NOS behind the seat. I'm sure for enough bucks he would part with them.

quote Originally posted by FieroFanatic13: Could you buy one of Paul McKibben's? Or are you looking to make one that is the two color on clear and not the vinyl type he sells?

Again, this is me being very picky - I want an exact reproduction, that being the lettering is printed on a clear sheet. I am not total sure, but is the gray a different shade on Indy vs Fiero??



If no one has a NOS that I could borrow/rent - maybe someone can do a rubbing of an original decal (so I can get the shape) I may be able to work with that.

[This message has been edited by Mickey_Moose (edited 07-17-2008).]

quote Originally posted by jscott1: ...Don's got a set of NOS behind the seat. I'm sure for enough bucks he would part with them.

Who's Don, and where do I sign to give him my firstborn for the decals?

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quote Originally posted by davikan: Who's Don, and where do I sign to give him my firstborn for the decals?

Don = Maryjane

...and he has quietly acquired a nice set of Indys. I'm not saying he wants to sell his decals, but my point is that they exist out there and everything has a price.

Edited to add, the red fabric for the seats that was thought not to exist....well a roll of it was found in the back room of some upholstery shop and you could, up to as recent as 2008, buy enough of this to have brand new Indy seats made. I passed because my Indy is way too ratty for brand new seats, but if you keep looking stuff tends to be found.

[This message has been edited by jscott1 (edited 07-17-2008).]

quote Originally posted by jscott1: he has quietly acquired a nice set of Indys.

Yes he has....and if you will notice in one of his earlier posts he states that both of his have the rounded "F". I am beginning to wonder if somewhere in the decal run, Pontiac actually changed up the decals somewhere along the run. This has happened on other runs for products so it is possible.

quote Originally posted by CenTexIndy: Yes he has....and if you will notice in one of his earlier posts he states that both of his have the rounded "F". I am beginning to wonder if somewhere in the decal run, Pontiac actually changed up the decals somewhere along the run. This has happened on other runs for products so it is possible.

Hmmm, interesting theory...

quote Originally posted by jscott1: Sorry if my comment is less than helpful. If my Indy ever gets good paint on it, I wouldn't give a rats A$$ if the "F"s are curved or straight in the re-popped decals.

Sorry - I didn't mean that you weren't being helpful! Please don't take any offense - none was intended.

Any of you who've read any of my posts have probably gotten the idea that I'm a FREAK for keeping my Fieros as stock as possible, and that I'd LOVE to only put authentic, NOS decals on my Indy. But, I'm concerned that they're just not out there anymore, and that if they are, the only ones available are in the "marginal" shape that my one surviving decal is in. I'd not want to use it on my Indy. The actual letters might look good once they're off that ratty backing paper, - but they might not.

I'm also concerned about maryjane's decals (not that I even know that he'd want to part with them...), now that we've learned about the rounded-off F issue. All the pictures of the original Indys that I've seen show those Fs with the upper left corner squared off.

So, I guess this is yet another Fiero "mystery" that could use some research. (?)

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