Let me start out by saying that I'm a complete newb at this whole body work and sanding thing. I'm turning to you guys for guidance on how I can properly sand and primer my car to get it ready for painting. I'm willing to learn even if it means a few of you drive down here and hit me in the head with a brick(as long as the Formula is painted!). Pretty much this is the deal, here's what my car looks like(terrible): Click the pics for much larger resolutions.




What kind of materials am I going to need to start out with? As you see, the paint is pretty much shot so I find this as a possible learning experience to figure out how to do it myself.

Thoughts? Questions? Guidance? Needed Materials? Complaints? Let's make this an awesome paint prep thread for the ages(and newbs)!

Edit to add that I will gladly document any and all steps meticulously for posterity.

[This message has been edited by N3M3S1S (edited 03-17-2011).]

Step one, test your paint!! take a rag with some acetone on it and rub, if its a nice base clear it wont rub off if its enamel it will melt and get gooey! this is important! it will determine how and what your going to paint it with again or how far your going to be sanding it to cover up the old stuff!
Step two, the sanding, if its just peeling clear without any damage u can get away with sanding the whole thing down with 240 grit paper on a da sander, I like to do a one over again with 320 to get some of the sanding marks out.
hold the sander ALMOST flat like one degree or less, hold light pressure on the sander or it will jump around on you and not go random depending the sander. if u have a nice 12,000 rpm da palm sander random orbital u can hold it flat on the flat spots and let the paper do the work u wont need to push hard.

Building primer is your buddy it doubles as a spray on mud and primer wich in turn will fill in alot of the nasty spots so u dont need to go mudd happy pm 86soon3.4 and ask him the stuff we used on his fiero when I painted it, it was pretty cheap stuff but worked verry well, I think he got it at nappa.

The painting.... well when your that far lets see some pics of the car in detail with light and shadows so we can see all the sanding and work you have done so we can give ya the thumbs up before paint!


this is the high build primer


look at the hood hinge in this pic, to paint it bolt the hood on wrong one bolt up so u can get at front of hood and at back of bumper top
also the door panel is hung above rear wheels so its in line with the side of the car for matching the metalics




these are pics to show u its possible to get a nice smooth paint job in a two car garage no problem, just take your time, it took me hours to paint this car, your biggest enemy is yourself wanting to rush, dont!! it takes time!!

[This message has been edited by jetsnvettes2000 (edited 03-17-2011).]

Those are some great tips, thank you! I'm not worried about "time being an enemy" for this one. I have no problem sanding, driving it to work, sanding, driving it to work, etc. It can't possibly look worse than it does now(in person it's really rather awful). I'm willing to spend as much time as needed to get it just right.

Stay the hell away from laquer paints. What size compressor are you going to run? Do you have water traps on it? I normally have a airline used JUST for painting as oils from air tools will get in the line and will cause fish eye. Are you going with a base clear or something more tricky? A good paint job is 90% prep work......Tcpglobial is the best bang for your buck.
http://www.tcpglobal.com/

quote Originally posted by 87antuzzi: Stay the hell away from laquer paints. What size compressor are you going to run? Do you have water traps on it? I normally have a airline used JUST for painting as oils from air tools will get in the line and will cause fish eye. Are you going with a base clear or something more tricky? A good paint job is 90% prep work......Tcpglobial is the best bang for your buck. http://www.tcpglobal.com/

His idea of paint is thinner and matches

Good place for supplies with top-notch customer service: http://www.autobodytoolmart.com Use their 800 number to order, and they ship fast.

quote Originally posted by jetsnvettes2000:

Loving this color. Have any more pictures of the finished work?

quote Originally posted by 87antuzzi: Stay the hell away from laquer paints. What size compressor are you going to run? Do you have water traps on it? I normally have a airline used JUST for painting as oils from air tools will get in the line and will cause fish eye. Are you going with a base clear or something more tricky? A good paint job is 90% prep work......Tcpglobial is the best bang for your buck. http://www.tcpglobal.com/

Whatever my dad has hiding in his garage. It was from our Family Farm and is a big ol' beast I know that much, so I'm sure it won't be a problem. And yeah, I'm more worried about the prep work than I am the paint job right now. We'll cross that bridge when we get there.

[This message has been edited by N3M3S1S (edited 03-18-2011).]

First step is to wash your car with Dawn dish soap. Wash it 3 times. You want to make sure its is clean! After that is done, wipe rhe whole car down with wax and grease remover. Do that twice. After that is done, you are ready to start sanding. I use 220 on a DA Sander and I sand it down to the factory primer. Doing that is my personal preference. You want to make sure that any peeling paint or clear is completely removed. Now you are ready for primer. 3 coats of primer then wet sand smooth with 400 or 600 grit paper. DO NOT use your bare hands to sand the primer or you will leave dips and grooves from your fingers. Use a sanding sponge with your sand paper wrapped around it. After is it smooth you are ready for paint and clear.

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Click here for all your Fiberglass part needs

quote Originally posted by 8-P: Loving this color. Have any more pictures of the finished work?

Here are some pics of the finished paint.

I might add painted by Jetsnvettes2000.

Steve

Beautiful paint job! Tomorrow I embark upon getting supplies to start my quest! Any product/maker reccomendations? Pretty specific helps, as like I said I'm a newb.

Scott, when you are ready to start, shoot me a PM. I can swing down that way one afternoon with a case of bombers and help ya with whatever you need once I get back

let me know how yours goes... I'm getting ready to paint mine, looks about the same as yours. but I can't decide on a color.

quote Originally posted by N3M3S1S: Beautiful paint job! Tomorrow I embark upon getting supplies to start my quest! Any product/maker reccomendations? Pretty specific helps, as like I said I'm a newb.

Just go to your local auto paint supplier and buy a gallon of wax and grease remover and a roll of 220 grit paper. That will be enough stuff to keep you busy for weeks. As for primer... I use Dupont Nason brand myself but just talk to them and they will make recomendations to you.

I like the yearn to learn! I had the same bug.

One thing I did learn was look the car over VERY carefully for any spots where any oily hands or drips have occurred. Clean and seal/gelcoat over them. When you do spray spray 2 coats of primer. I had a couple of spots where I did not do this on the roof and the paint bubbled. I have tried to patch this several times put to no avail. The only fix now is to go back and re-sand and prep the whole roof when I have the time. But hay, that is the learning part!

If you dont have a DA power sander, it can also be all done by hand. I hand sand cars with 320 by hand, then primer. If you have bad cleacoat as it appears, you HAVE to sand ALL the clear off that panel. The panels that have good paint only need sanded till theyre completely dull. Just before primer, I always go over the entire thing, into every crack and nook with a maroon scotchbrite. Anything left with any gloss on it will not let new paint stick. Nice thing about a Fiero, is you can sand on it all the time, drive it and not worry about rusting.

Patience is something you'll need too or you'll learn it the hard way and paint is a hell of a tutor. I need to re do the underside of my hood even though i though i had it all sanded and stripped down and de greased it seems the po had used some kind of funky under hood dress up cleaning kit. Which i think had a high silicone content and it permeated the plastic. There are also water based colors like auto air colors though they require a slightly different approach to shooting as the dry times are very important especially without a drying booth.

Im hearing new automotive water based colors are VERY expensive, even compared to urathane. Plus what Ive heard from my supplier and some shops trying it, it HAS to have air moving over it to dry, not necessarily heat. One guy Ive talked to said he had to use a blower and walk around the car for at least an hour after he sprayed it or it would not dry. I cant remember the exact amounts, but Sherwin Williams sent me a pricing sheet where some of the colors and clears were something like $300-400 @ gallon.

The best way to prep your car for paint is to burn off the old paint with rubbing alcohol and matches.

quote Originally posted by Hulki U. My-BFF: The best way to prep your car for paint is to burn off the old paint with rubbing alcohol and matches.

Yaaay! I'll go do that now!

Ended up working all weekend, and when I wasn't working I was babysitting. So I didn't get to do the proper shopping I wanted to. =[ Oh well, my birthday is only a week away. Maybe I'll ask for some goodies?

That is a bit pricey i use the auto air colors for airbrush work. I just screw around and I'm only using very small amounts glad you brought that up as i didn't know what the cost per gallon was.

Check out tcpglobial, its cheap paint but can be cut and buffed to look really good. Dare I say it duplicolor has a cheap laqer paint (pukes). I have some HOK custom mixed paint I would let go for 5 or 6 hundred. Its a gallon of gold metallic clear with a black cherry/brandywine kandy with pearl flake. It set me back over 3 times what I paid for the car. However I did not count on the 3k the body shop wanted to spray it (without them doing prep work). Paint can be bought for less than 120 a gallon at damn near any paint shop. But I still say tcp global. Here is HOK base metallics for cheap.http://www.tcpglobal.com/hokpaint/hok-shimrin-metallics.aspx

quote Originally posted by rogergarrison: Im hearing new automotive water based colors are VERY expensive, even compared to urathane. Plus what Ive heard from my supplier and some shops trying it, it HAS to have air moving over it to dry, not necessarily heat. One guy Ive talked to said he had to use a blower and walk around the car for at least an hour after he sprayed it or it would not dry. I cant remember the exact amounts, but Sherwin Williams sent me a pricing sheet where some of the colors and clears were something like $300-400 @ gallon.

Naw its not that bad on price, no more than a good chroma base/clear setup, the stuff you are talking about is the ppg enviro base paint its water born and it has its tricks like any other paint, I learned the hard way with it, a thing to remember with water born paint is to make shure your using distilled water for your reducer, tap water has too much junk in it and can be a hassle. I have been using the diffrent brands of water born paint for years now at work and the best ones ive found so far are the ppg and sikkens paints.
I am testing insulx water born arcylic enamel at work right now for the machines we do, its not all that resistant to thinner but is good stuff for industrial use so far.
Far as the air movment yup thats true I have two big barn fans i blow over the stuff I paint to help dry it, But!! u have to be carful u can make it dry like old pee in a toilet if your not carful and make it skin over and leave the moisture traped underneath so what ive been doing is low fan speed at 5 feet away and it seens to be just the right amount of breeze to make it dry really fast. I dont have a downdraft booth so thats how I have to get it done but my paint reps have been tellin me even if you have a down draft its a good idea to install top fans in the booth to get the air movin better baking alone dosent really help with the water paint. Ive sprayed the sherwin willams stuff when I worked at gulfstream it needs work it lays down like crap and the whites have issues sticking the sharp edges of things like sheetmetal without alot of dust coats.

quote Originally posted by jetsnvettes2000: .......................

Thank God I only use the Autoair water based colors for small airbrush paint jobs. Unless the EPA mandates it for professional shops, I'll stick to my cancer causing, lung destroying, ozone depleting lacquer and urethane paints. They seem to work the best

quote Originally posted by JimmyS: Just go to your local auto paint supplier and buy a gallon of wax and grease remover and a roll of 220 grit paper. That will be enough stuff to keep you busy for weeks. As for primer... I use Dupont Nason brand myself but just talk to them and they will make recomendations to you.

A good wax greese remover is dx-330 ppg it works great remember one wet industrial paper towel one dry folded in 4 to hold the wet in the rag u want to use the dry towel to wipe off the wet or it can lift loose paint making a bigger mess.

I just talked to my SW rep and he tells me theyre not going to even try to sell it till it becomes EPA mandated in prob 5 more years. He says everyone complained about all kinds of various problems with it. He said they can special order it but wont stock any because it has a short shelf life even unopened. With that being said, Im probably never even going to ever try it before i die.

can anyone suggest options for repainting the interior? or fixing small cracks in the dash board? I'd like to get a fresh color scheme going, without having to buy all new parts.

quote Originally posted by tox1cchicken: can anyone suggest options for repainting the interior? or fixing small cracks in the dash board? I'd like to get a fresh color scheme going, without having to buy all new parts.

I've heard good things about the interior paint from the Fiero Store.

the SW paint... they may not have all the colors I'd be looking for, and it seems a bit pricey.. but then again I haven't done much looking.

If it gets the job done right then I guess I'd be willing to pay for it.

///Edit///
if I start sanding down my car, will it cause problems if I am not able to paint it for a while?

[This message has been edited by tox1cchicken (edited 03-21-2011).]

quote Originally posted by tox1cchicken: the SW paint... they may not have all the colors I'd be looking for, and it seems a bit pricey.. but then again I haven't done much looking. If it gets the job done right then I guess I'd be willing to pay for it. ///Edit/// if I start sanding down my car, will it cause problems if I am not able to paint it for a while?

I don't think so. It's not like the car's panels can rust or anything. That's why my plan is to pretty much dedicate myself to one panel at a time and sand/prime it and drive the car around until it's all done and ready for paint.

quote Originally posted by N3M3S1S: I don't think so. It's not like the car's panels can rust or anything. That's why my plan is to pretty much dedicate myself to one panel at a time and sand/prime it and drive the car around until it's all done and ready for paint.

The only problem with this plan is small stone chips/door dings that may happen before you paint. You may very well have to go back and re-prime and smooth some panels.

quote Originally posted by JimmyS: The only problem with this plan is small stone chips/door dings that may happen before you paint. You may very well have to go back and re-prime and smooth some panels.

And that's no problem, it's the price I pay for using it as a daily driver during. No matter what I assure you it will look better that way than it does now. Seeing the paint every day as I walk out to it makes it sad because it's such a gorgeous car. Even the engine is clean and nice(although the valve covers are starting to chip).

I have a Porter Cable 7424XP DA that I used to buff my paint that I can bring up and help you sand over a weekend. Let me know!

Dirt, road oil atmospheric and natural pollutants will also contaminate the primer and may cause unwanted bubbles chips or lack of adhesion without having to strip the panel down and start from scratch. Word of advice get everything ready supply wise to paint then commit. Doing it the panel by panel and driving it is a bit half assed and will more then likely result in disappointing results.

quote Originally posted by zigaroo: I have a Porter Cable 7424XP DA that I used to buff my paint that I can bring up and help you sand over a weekend. Let me know!

Hells yeah, I definitely will! Lol

quote Originally posted by Macs86GT: Dirt, road oil atmospheric and natural pollutants will also contaminate the primer and may cause unwanted bubbles chips or lack of adhesion without having to strip the panel down and start from scratch. Word of advice get everything ready supply wise to paint then commit. Doing it the panel by panel and driving it is a bit half assed and will more then likely result in disappointing results.

Not really so much. Your going to go over it all again with sandpaper and solvent before you shoot it anyway. Ive had cars I spent years on saving people money doing a little at a time when I had some spare time. Plastic cars are even easier...they wont rust. I spent nearly 3 years doing a 30s Lincoln and going in and out of the shop. It still looks brand new 30 years later. My Coronet sat outside all winter in snow and rain with primer before the spring I shot it.

I stand corrected then, though if a daily driven car i would think it best to just get it over and done with prolonged agony vs acute pain.