My favorite is the whipple because it is more efficient and doesn't heat the air as much. They have a kit for the ls4 and I think they do for the ls series. You should check them out. I always think of Mr Whipple and "don't squeeze the charmin" when I read about their superchargers. I agree, low boost is more than adequate on your engine. Hell, no boost is more than adequate for your engine. I'm going to try 15lbs for my dyno pull and a run down the strip. After that, 5-8lbs is what I'll run. Just some suggestions for you to consider. Ultimately you have to go the way YOU want.

Troy
You hit the nail on the head with your comment.
I totally agree w/ you.

About your health....
I am very sorry
I will keep you n your family in my prayers.

quote Originally posted by dratts: My favorite is the whipple because it is more efficient and doesn't heat the air as much. They have a kit for the ls4 and I think they do for the ls series. You should check them out. I always think of Mr Whipple and "don't squeeze the charmin" when I read about their superchargers. I agree, low boost is more than adequate on your engine. Hell, no boost is more than adequate for your engine. I'm going to try 15lbs for my dyno pull and a run down the strip. After that, 5-8lbs is what I'll run. Just some suggestions for you to consider. Ultimately you have to go the way YOU want.

Whipple, I like it. It looks like it would work better than the Magna or bell for the LS fiero configuration. Thanks! Now this is what this forum should be all about.

Cool, I agree. We all should try to be constructive, plus it's fun and it doesn't cost anything. I wouldn't have been offended if you didn't agree with me on the supercharger, we all have our own tastes, but it makes me feel good that I might have helped.

quote Originally posted by madcurl: Do you remember this thread from long ago. I made a copy of it. Re: Lambo "like" fiero ! « Reply #42 on: June 27, 2007, 10:07:03 AM »

I have to say No. I barely remember two days ago and you are asking about 2007? It does sound impulsive stalker like but I will amuse you and say bring it on if you wish.

It's interesting that Party No. 1 is missing from the discussions once he was called out by several people.

quote Originally posted by troyboy: The heart is strong it's those pesky arteries. I already have one stint in the " widow maker " from 3 years ago. This time they tried to stint this new blockage but failed, I go to see another doc tommorrow for a game plan. I tell my wife I can hear them playing the song from the 6 million dollar man " we can rebuild him.........". Thanks for asking and you know we are never done building our cars, just ask Archie I'm driving him crazy with the R&D for the supercharger for the LS7.

What the hell are you doing, eating cans of lard??!!

Seriously my man, take care and get that stuff cleaned up!

.

quote Originally posted by DL10: It's not my Fault........it's my Choice to leave the V-6 in the Predator. I have one Fiero with a V-8 I don't need another one. And there was never a deal to back out of......We did talk about me maybe selling you the GBCT but no one wanted to see the GBCT turned into your latest vision.

So you didn't want to turn the GBCT turn into "my vision" yet you approached a person whose car's are ALL TWEAKED.



The fact that the GBCT is basically the same a #011 (minus vents/engine/trans) you have two car that are almost the same, yet you think I was going to treat the GBCT like it's some type of VIRGIN that shouldn't be tapped.





Silly reasoning on your part to assume that I would want to have two nearly identical cars in my garage and not wanting to tweak the other. Interesting that you mentioned "latest vision" yet the reality is, "GBCT" has changed and is now used as a work bench.

I’m interested in how you feel about Archies Miura build or his GT40t projects. Do they measure up to the great chop top work he does or are they of lesser value because they are based on the spirit of a production vehicle? PS wish my "chicken wire" looked that good!

Put the shovel down Curly......if you dig to much deeper the hole will turn into your grave

quote Originally posted by madcurl: I'll tell what I'll "Never get" is this; (Some) replica owners religiously believe that a Ferrari or lamborghini badge contains magical powers that can transform a poorly designed replica into the real thing and the result will blind everybody that looks upon it.

I don't think that's the case.

As I mentioned, the Mera isn't exactly the most accurate representation of the 308, although it does a good job with the original medium it is built upon. However, many Mera owners swapped out the MERA badges for 308 GTS replica badges. I don't think they did that originally out of any sort of "blinding" individuals or obtaining "magical powers." They did that to identify the car to what it's inspiration is. If I drove a Mera/Mera-based 308 replica, I wouldn't have any reservations on slapping 308 GTS badges all over it where they would be on the real thing.

Although I think the current Mera crowd seems rather displeased at the now lacking amount of original Mera badges that are available to them, since so many were lost when Ferrari insignia was swapped to them.

Curly where have you been - out of town or something - missed you and you still missed what I posted last but I knew you would.

"Replicates Unite"

quote Originally posted by troyboy: I want to see how hard I can push the f40, and if it can't hold I have a backup plan from over seas. For now we are talking to Magna and Bell. I only plan on running 6 to 7 psi

IIRC your stunning Fiero aleady has 760 HP. If you add boost you will be in the 900-1000 HP range or perhaps more. IMO this will severely place high stress on the frame, suspension and drivetrain of your modified Fiero. I would additionally be concerned on how you will put the power to the ground. I guess with enough mods anything is possible but a good amount of re-engineering is probably in order. BTW, hope that your health is restored soon. Feel better soon as many in the Fiero community really want to see your creation at the shows in 2012. That car of yours would really be a show stopper at Fieros/GM's at Carlisle next June.

------------------
" THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Flotech Afterburner Exhaust, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite.
"THE COLUSSUS"
87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H
" ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "

quote Originally posted by madcurl: So, what you're saying is that any mentioning of a (REPLICA) regardless of it's (POOR CONSTRUCTION) made shouldn't be spoken, right?

I don't think that that's what he means......

Many "Non-Fiero" people hate the Fiero because some of them caught on Fire. They lump them together and assert that all Fieros are junk because a few of them had fire issues. We "Fiero People" have been fighting that myth for years.

You're doing the same thing. you are lumping all Replicas or kitcars together because some were poorly built...... you're doing the same thing as the the "Non-Fiero" people have done. You're assuming that because some Replicas or kitcars were poorly designed or built they all are junk.

I've seen many Replicas or kitcars that were built very well & are something to be proud of & I've seen some poorly done ones that I wouldn't be caught dead in.

Condeming all Fieros because some had fire issues, is like condeming all Replicas or kitcars because some were poorly done.

That's what you are doing, you condem all Replicas or kitcars because some have been poorly designed or poorly built.

Archie

BTW, I feel there is a difference between "Replicas" & "Kit Cars".

As in "all Horses are animals but not all animals are Horses".

All Replicas are kit cars but not all kit cars are replicas.

A

quote Originally posted by DL10: Put the shovel down Curly......if you dig to much deeper the hole will turn into your grave

Really, it would appear the other way around. If you count the cost in building a nearly 100% replica the grave that is being dug is the ones seeking to build a kit.

quote Originally posted by No Bull: So let's do some basic math and figure out what some common OEM parts would cost for a 100% accurate looking build: Tail lights - $4000 Windshield - $3500 Side windows - $2000 Rear window - $1000 Side mirrors - $4000 Rims and tires - $8000 Seats - $4000 Interior trim items - $5000 Speedometer - $4000 Grilles - $3000 A quality OEM fiberglass body kit - $10,000 Now you need a custom frame - $6500 Engine and transmission (might as go for a BMW or Mercedes V12) since you want close to OEM - $10,000 Big brake and suspension kit - $6000 Now the little stuff - Brake lines, fuel tank, radiators, badges, nuts and bolts, paint - $15,000 If my math is correct, we are at $86,000 and there are no labor costs figured into this. It would be very easy to go over $100,000 with labor. I hope I'm painting a picture of why the cars must be built within reason. They typically are not 100% accurate so donor parts from other cars can be used. Most of us want to use a $100 Nissan Maxima windshield instead of a $3000 OEM windshield and live with the slight variation that most people won't even notice. Sure it's slightly off but you save $2500 on that part and you can easily locate replacements when it develops a chip or crack. Because of this, the replica is built to accept a $100 windshield vs. the $3000 windshield and he sells more bodies to guys that can afford to build them. My advice... if you have this kind of money to build a 100% accurate replica, buy the real thing. You'll be happier and you'll take a fraction of the loss on your investment. http://kitcarforums.net/smf/index.php?topic=338.0

Do people count the cost when building replicas?

[This message has been edited by madcurl (edited 12-21-2011).]

quote Originally posted by Dennis LaGrua: IIRC your stunning Fiero aleady has 760 HP.

As one of the few people Madcurl seems to respect, thank you Archie for chiming in.

quote Originally posted by madcurl: You must work for Fauxnews...

I sincerely hope that your use of this expression was not purposely aimed at my French Canadian heritage, otherwise this argument has taken a serious detour.

quote Originally posted by Archie: That's what you are doing, you condem all Replicas or kitcars because some have been poorly designed or poorly built. A

Poorly designed from the standpoint of looking at them 25 feet away. There are many replica kits that are nearly identical as the original (from an outward appearance as seen by the ones I posted).

Are we to conclude that because of (a) kit that is greatly off the mark is considered a great looking kit? Or are we to conclude that all kits regardless of how poorly the outward appearance maybe is still-a great job well done?

Curly, I don`t really get into too many of these discussions but I think the point had been missed.
I think, as far as my standpoint has been on this subject, it`s not about building an exact replica.
It`s about building something that represents a supercar.
The Diablo I would like to build comes nowhere near the figures posted in your quote.
You use Corvette tailights
A Honda Accord windshield or a replica windshield from AGP glass that is I think about 450.00
Side windows from AGP that last time I checked were about 150.00 each.
Side mirror shells come with the body kit or use Eclipse mirrors.
Seats from a Fiero with a modified headrest.
Interior trim items are more at probably 2000.00
Vision 240 mph speedometer with a Lambo overlay and an electronic calibrator. About 500.00
For original grilles, that`s probably about right, unless you fabricate yourself.

Archie has the right idea, and honestly Archie you have constructed what I believe to be one of the definitive examples of this concept you have laid out - the Miura replica you built a while back.

Indeed, I have to say if there has been anything that I have been utterly impressed by that has came out of your shop it is that Miura "replica." That car was quite worthy of being a very good "demo" car to show what can be done with a properly built replica. If anything, I would also say it is a rather good example of a completely custom "Fiero" at the height of the customization spectrum.

There are some things to point out though. Indeed, it's base is a Pontiac Fiero. Does that make it bad? Of course not. I also understand, as was pointed out towards the end of the build thread, there are some minor variances on the outside that do not make it exactly the same as a Miura. Does that make it a bad car? Absolutely not. It's going to fool a tremendous amount of individuals - likely even Lambo enthusiasts that know what a Miura is. If you park it next to a real one will you see minor differences? Probably. What is the chance of that happening? Likely miniscule.

However, based on the current argument presented by the thread, it is a replica that is attempting to replicate the actual car and thus should be near exact to be deemed "correct." The car has proved though that this does not have to be the case when constructing a replica, be it based on a Fiero or otherwise.

Liberties can be taken for the sake of constructability to have a driveable car. The argument then becomes where do you draw the line on what liberties can be taken. I remember reading an article in "Kit Car" back in the late 90's that said one of the great things about a Lambo replica is it doesn't matter if you "put 100 spoke gold rims on your car, because in the end it's your car." I like to approach kit cars and replicas the same way. There is for sure a line that can be drawn as to what liberties can be taken, but you shouldn't let this line influence a great deal as to the poor or good qualities of a kit/replica build.

quote Originally posted by Bloozberry: I sincerely hope that your use of this expression was not purposely aimed at my French Canadian heritage, otherwise this argument has taken a serious detour.

I don't think so Blooz. People often refer to FOX News as "FauxNews," but that would be getting into a political debate that has nothing to do with cars so let's stay away from that argument and speak on the topic at hand.

quote Originally posted by steve308: I’m interested in how you feel about Archies Miura build or his GT40t projects. Do they measure up to the great chop top work he does or are they of lesser value because they are based on the spirit of a production vehicle? PS wish my "chicken wire" looked that good!

My comments are clearly presented on the "Miura" thread. That said, IMHO the Miura build is perhaps the best built kits ever made. The quality is second to none and is demonstrated throughout the build. In fact the Muira build is better than the original Muira built by Lamborghini. In this case, the replica wins hands down in:

1. Suspension.
2. Engine/trans.
3. Insurance.
4. Interior, and last but not least
5. Use of a Fiero as a base to build the car.

When you factor in the cost of the real McCoy, limited production, and it's inherited problems, obviously the kit wins all around. The real Miura isn't practical to drive except to trailer the car to Pebble Beach and to gloat to others with unlimited funds. If I had the car I would gladly drive the the Concord D Elegance, park it and wait for hob-nobs to show up and then say, "Hello, now get out my way. I'm headed to AutoZone for a k&n air filter,"- hehe.



As for the GT40 I've only been in 1-completed kit and it was a nice kit and it wasn't poorly built.

quote Originally posted by madcurl: Are we to conclude that because of (a) kit that is greatly off the mark is considered a great looking kit? Or are we to conclude that all kits regardless of how poorly the outward appearance maybe is still-a great job well done?

I defy you to quote anybody on this thread who subscribes to this fabricated point of view.

The issue being debated here is your view that you must act as some spokesperson for all that is tasteful, authentic, creative, or intelligent within your own narrow definition of these subjective topics, and denounce all that isn't. Tell me, is a fake engine cover hiding a 2.8L engine any less intelligent than trying to fool people by hiding a Chevette/Citation suspension behind 20" wheels? Does a car that shares the windshield and tail lights as the only visible parts of a stock Fiero deserve to be badged a Fiero? Because you say so?

Edited for clarity.

[This message has been edited by Bloozberry (edited 12-21-2011).]

Curly's always right no matter what you say he will twist it to seem like he is in the right - so I'm sure he will chime in any second or wait a few days and post why he is the right one. This will just go on and on and on and on and on.

quote Originally posted by madcurl: My comments are clearly presented on the "Miura" thread. That said, IMHO the Miura build is perhaps the best built kits ever made. The quality is second to none and is demonstrated throughout the build. In fact the Muira build is better than the original Muira built by Lamborghini. In this case, the replica wins hands down in: 1. Suspension. 2. Engine/trans. 3. Insurance. 4. Interior, and last but not least 5. Use of a Fiero as a base to build the car. When you factor in the cost of the real McCoy, limited production, and it's inherited problems, obviously the kit wins all around. The real Miura isn't practical to drive except to trailer the car to Pebble Beach and to gloat to others with unlimited funds. If I had the car I would gladly drive the the Concord D Elegance, park it and wait for hob-nobs to show up and then say, "Hello, now get out my way. I'm headed to AutoZone for a k&n air filter,"- hehe. As for the GT40 I've only been in 1-completed kit and it was a nice kit and it wasn't poorly built.

To Quote Jim Carey in Dumb and Dumber " So you're saying there's a chance"

[This message has been edited by steve308 (edited 12-21-2011).]

quote Originally posted by ferrobi: Curly's always right no matter what you say he will twist it to seem like he is in the right - so I'm sure he will chime in any second or wait a few days and post why he is the right one. This will just go on and on and on and on and on.

Unlike you I have more important things to do.

quote Originally posted by madcurl: During the past couple of days I found out that a beloved friend of mine past away in the choptop community. I'm going by Bakersfield, CA. today and I'm not really feeling good about my visit. I will tell you more about it today with their permission to post and mention the name here. Death is surly our enemy.

Condolences to you for the loss of a close friend. I'm sure all PFF posters can agree.

My condolences as well.

The loss of a friend is always a bitter pill to swallow. When it happens this time of the year it is even more difficult to grasp. My thoughts go out to you and to the family of your friend. This type of event puts the content of this thread into its true perspective of importance. Pease to all.

quote Originally posted by madcurl: Let me refresh your memory. Exoticse started a thread on your ever so lovely "Kit Kar Forum" and YOUR comment WAS, "This crap shouldn't be here and to keep that crap over on Pennock's (#020 and #022). Being the type of person you are-you had it deleted and so too your comments, but it was copied. Thus the stalker is actually "YOU" and the hater of all things that are badged "correctly" is you.

You do realize that if you go on a Kit Car forum trying to force your beliefs as you have in this thread you will get run off. I do not remember. It was not important to me but I see it made you cry as to the fact you would write a statement like the one above that is very childish. If I told you what I think of your car(s) it is my opinion and it was said once. What you have been doing for years speaks for its self. Looking at what you did on a Kit Car forum. I would say you had it coming and should realize that saying a car looks bad to you is everyone’s right but what you do on this forum is not normal and tiresome.
I am sorry for your loss, losing a friend is a bad time in ones life. A lot of people take that experience and grow with it I guess we all will see how you chose to be forward.

Double post

[This message has been edited by dratts (edited 12-25-2011).]

quote Originally posted by madcurl: This is an example of a replica so badly done you can spot it 100 yards away. Please tell that this can fool anybody except a 4-yr old.

There are one of these running around my area and you would be surprised how many people think it's the real deal.

I think there are some awesome kitcars and replicas out there, and there are some fugly ones too. I get what your trying to say Madcurl, but this is a touchy subject. I used to think replicas were dumb, but lately I have seen some really nice ones that have changed my opinion. I like it when the preformance of the replica is on par or exceeds the car it is based upon. There are a lot things I seee done to Fieros on here I don't like either, I try not to critisize too much. Fiero owners seem to be a sensitive bunch!

Fiero owners seem to be a sensitive bunch!

Sensitive! Who you callen sensitive? Those sound like fightin words to me

Back to kits dying out - I believe I read on here a week or two ago that the maker of the NAF (later becoming ASPP) GT-40 kits, Jack Kube, recently passed away. I sure would like to get my hands on one of his MK I kits! I hope his molds are sold to someone who will make them again.

Jonathan

[This message has been edited by Boostdreamer (edited 12-25-2011).]

quote Originally posted by F355spider: You do realize that if you go on a Kit Car forum trying to force your beliefs as you have in this thread you will get run off. I do not remember. It was not important to me but I see it made you cry as to the fact you would write a statement like the one above that is very childish. If I told you what I think of your car(s) it is my opinion and it was said once. What you have been doing for years speaks for its self. Looking at what you did on a Kit Car forum. I would say you had it coming and should realize that saying a car looks bad to you is everyone’s right but what you do on this forum is not normal and tiresome. I am sorry for your loss, losing a friend is a bad time in ones life. A lot of people take that experience and grow with it I guess we all will see how you chose to be forward.

Beliefs? Dude, get real. I'm LOL at your comments. I'll show you what's "tiresome." Grown men thinking their the real super heros driving super exotics.



Seriously, create something "new" and if you lack creativity then at least build a "kit" that looks like the original 5 feet away.


http://www.youtube.com/watc...=1&feature=endscreen

http://www.youtube.com/watc...LSQ0&feature=related

Two examples of replicas 34k that you can drive around town trying to fool the 2-yrs old kid down the block (super replica suit optional).

[This message has been edited by madcurl (edited 12-28-2011).]