quote Originally posted by RWDPLZ: Oh they expect engineers to do and be everything now. Most positions I've looked at lately want engineer sales people, with excellent communications skills, outgoing extroverted personalities, excellent people and speaking skills, etc.

Ya old school stereotypical engineers are almost non existent now. its a different world we live in.

quote Originally posted by RWDPLZ: When I was in school at Michigan Tech a few years ago now, they told us we'd be having difficulty deciding which job offers to take. Starting salaries in the $45,000 - $60,000 range. People will always need engineers they said.

What did you expect from a business that makes money only when people take classes.. the truth?

[This message has been edited by User00013170 (edited 07-18-2012).]

quote Originally posted by RWDPLZ: When I was in school at Michigan Tech a few years ago now, they told us we'd be having difficulty deciding which job offers to take. Starting salaries in the $45,000 - $60,000 range. People will always need engineers they said.

Yeh, we were all told that when I signed for flight school...within a couple years we would all be flying Gulfstreams and 737's, making 50+ and picking and choosing who we worked for......out of about 120 in the group, I think it was 10 or 11 that made it to any sort of aviation career, 1 guy got into Air Force, 3 ended up on Mu-2's and Lear 25's doing medivac, the other 6 or 7 of us mostly flew smaller prop stuff for a while before taking ground jobs servicing planes because those jobs paid more. Its the only industry known to man where your experience gained is considered part of the remuneration.

[This message has been edited by MidEngineManiac (edited 07-18-2012).]

And there ya go. I have an old gf whos been flying 737s I think, for Federal Express for 15 years. Shes just now breaking into the $45K salary. When she started flying for them she didnt make $25K. I have an uncle who retired as a flight captain from Delta Airlines and I think he barely topped $60k when he retired. I remember talking to him when I got out of the AF about me doing it and we sort of figured Id make more owning my own auto painting business.

quote Originally posted by User00013170: Ya old school stereotypical engineers are almost non existent now. its a different world we live in.

Not necessarily. That stereotypical engineer doesn't exist at the entry level, or even mid level. Those types of engineers companies want are the ones with 10-20 years under their belt. They're the ones doing the "real" engineering, not just having a technical understanding of a product and doing sales or maintenance. Even in engineering, you have to start somewhere. Nobody's going to hire a new EIT with a 4 year degree and maybe a year of co-op experience, if that, and immediately put them to work designing major projects. Until you get that PE, you're not even an engineer.

"old school" should more accurately be "experienced."

I think the biggest problem with up and coming engineers today is they got into it because they believed it would be job security and a fat paycheck. Nothing wrong with considering those things, but you'll notice neither one of those have anything to do with wanting to be an engineer. The ones who really want to be an engineer - who enjoy that type of work - are the ones who will excel and move beyond the "sales" jobs.

[This message has been edited by Formula88 (edited 07-19-2012).]

quote Originally posted by RWDPLZ: When I was in school at Michigan Tech a few years ago now, they told us we'd be having difficulty deciding which job offers to take. Starting salaries in the $45,000 - $60,000 range. People will always need engineers they said.

Another fellow Tech grad, they were telling us the same numbers when I was there, Luckly I did get a job right out of school making 58,000 doing transmission controls and devlopment work. But with the high cost of Tech I am paying about $1200 a month on my student loans

quote Originally posted by Formula88: Not necessarily. That stereotypical engineer doesn't exist at the entry level, or even mid level. Those types of engineers companies want are the ones with 10-20 years under their belt. They're the ones doing the "real" engineering, not just having a technical understanding of a product and doing sales or maintenance. Even in engineering, you have to start somewhere. Nobody's going to hire a new EIT with a 4 year degree and maybe a year of co-op experience, if that, and immediately put them to work designing major projects. Until you get that PE, you're not even an engineer. "old school" should more accurately be "experienced." I think the biggest problem with up and coming engineers today is they got into it because they believed it would be job security and a fat paycheck. Nothing wrong with considering those things, but you'll notice neither one of those have anything to do with wanting to be an engineer. The ones who really want to be an engineer - who enjoy that type of work - are the ones who will excel and move beyond the "sales" jobs.

I'm an EE by nature, and for a while now any job i saw was of the 'modern' type, where you had to be social as well as technically experienced. ( hopefully i don't have to worry about it again and can stay here for the rest of my time working. Don't get paid a lot but i'm old enough now not to want to have to 'retool' again )

( tho i do miss 'making stuff' like the old days back in the automotive world.. now all i do is move bits around. But its for a good cause )

[This message has been edited by User00013170 (edited 07-19-2012).]