quote Originally posted by Boostdreamer: I'm not so sure this is accurate. If you google "orthodox jew" and check "images", many of them are white to the point of being pale. I don't know if this is just the accepted "stereotype" jew but I think direct decendants of Jews in the middle east are light skinned. I guess it is possible that mid-brown people could produce light-skinned offspring but I believe it is more likely that light-skinned people turned darker.

It seems to have been the other way round - people were dark when they originated from Africa and then turned lighter as they migrated north.

Let me get this straight. So their are seven princes of Hell, for which each demon coincides with the seven deadly sins. There still a debate around Christian theologists if Lucifer and Satan are the same demon. Lucifer is only mentioned once in the Bible.

In the Apocrypha (The scriptures that were in the Bible but were taken out from the Protestant Bibles around the 1800's) mentions Satans in the plural.

Well, Lucifer means the Morning Star or Bringer of Light. Possibly the Sun. Satan is probably a play on Saturn or a tempter of some kind. As Satan never forces anybody to do anything or does anybody harm.

So you have Lucifer and a group of Angels that somehow gets cast down to hell before Adam and Eve were made from mud and a rib bone. Then the forbidden fruit was eaten and the Garden of Eden disappears or is guarded by one of God's angels.

Then humans suck big time so a global flood was drone upon the land and killed everybody except Noah and his family to repopulate the earth along with all the animals on the Ark.

Then humans suck again, so God impregnates a virgin who then bore a son, for which only the day of his birth and skipped over to the last year of his life at age 33, he suddenly becomes the Son of God. Gets crucified to wash the human suck away.

Then after that, one only needs to believe that Jesus is the Son of God to make it into heaven.

Some day Jesus will return and release chaos and mayhem upon the human suck again to kill everybody but his followers.

Then in heaven, you then do what?

Why has God failed so many times? Angels, Adam & Eve, Humans times three?

[This message has been edited by Wichita (edited 05-15-2013).]

quote Originally posted by yellowstone: Formula 88, I ask myself why a being like god, who created the whole universe and is all-powerful and all-knowing, would need our adoration so much.

quote Originally posted by Boostdreamer: Not needs. Wants.

So your saying God has an Ego! Which is a sin.. Wanting but not needing worship.. That all Ego right there.. Hmmmmm, interesting..

Is this thread still going ???

"God" and the power of positive thinking......

Well, pray to yer god for a fearri, or manifist one and the universe will give it to you.....

BULLCRAP, BULLKAKA.............I call bullsheet.......
Just as soon as yer "gawd" sets foot here and starts speaking, then I will listen......until then, dont bother me and go find somebbody who gives a sheet about your imaginery friend in the sky....

GAWD---yeh....I'll stick with Loki...he is just as imaginary as some jew gawd, but at least he is fun...

[This message has been edited by MidEngineManiac (edited 05-16-2013).]

Anyone catch this?
http://abcnews.go.com/blogs...f-cheater-hes-a-man/

Funny.... well, "stupid", but funny.

[This message has been edited by jaskispyder (edited 05-17-2013).]

quote Originally posted by Wichita: Why has God failed so many times? Angels, Adam & Eve, Humans times three?

I think I have the answer for that one. To make us fully realized individuals, God had to give us free will. That accounts for much of the failure.

quote Originally posted by GBglide: I think I have the answer for that one. To make us fully realized individuals, God had to give us free will. That accounts for much of the failure.

Yeah. Figure "free will" was the excuse. I don't buy it. A baby does not possess the ability to express free will, so that means we are not born or given free will. Mentally ill people have no free will either.

So to make us individuals so the God could feel loved he killed humans and threw a 1/3rd of his angels in hell.

Question Christians! Do you not understand or see the blatant absurdity of the God of Jews story?

I guess not. Also looks like Bootsdreamer gave up praying for me. Sigh!

GBglide, thanks for you input in the discussion. I will pray to Lucifer to save your soul. Don't forget to pray to Jesus for me.

[This message has been edited by Wichita (edited 05-19-2013).]

quote Originally posted by Wichita: Yeah. Figure "free will" was the excuse. I don't buy it. A baby does not possess the ability to express free will, so that means we are not born or given free will. Mentally ill people have no free will either. So to make us individuals so the God could feel loved he killed humans and threw a 1/3rd of his angels in hell. Question Christians! Do you not understand or see the blatant absurdity of the God of Jews story? I guess not. Also looks like Bootsdreamer gave up praying for me. Sigh! GBglide, thanks for you input in the discussion. I will pray to Lucifer to save your soul. Don't forget to pray to Jesus for me.

Whoah! An infant has the potential to develop the capacity for making his/her own decisions (free will) as he/she ages and develops.. so there is an innate human capacity for free will, just as for the ability to communicate using language.

Do wild animals have free-will, or is that just chalked up to "instinct"?

[This message has been edited by Boondawg (edited 05-19-2013).]

quote Originally posted by rinselberg: Whoah! An infant has the potential to develop the capacity for making his/her own decisions (free will) as he/she ages and develops.. so there is an innate human capacity for free will, just as for the ability to communicate using language.

At what age or mental capacity does one need to reach in order to think and make a decision to worship Jesus God or not?

What does Free Will mean anyways. Can you define it?

Whether or not it is or isn't free will doesn't matter. Does anyone here actually think they lack free will? There is no other way for us to perceive it. Anyone that thinks they don't have feel will needs therapy. Anyone that claims any super being is controlling them needs help.

Except in marriage ....

[This message has been edited by TK (edited 05-19-2013).]

Free will is when Wichita decides to pray to Lucifer, and not Jesus.

QED

quote Originally posted by rinselberg: Free will is when Wichita decides to pray to Lucifer, and not Jesus. QED

Free Will is when I decide that the devil is a fiction character and Jesus is dead and has been and is no God.

I like this definition of Free Will from Wiki: True free will must involve self-realization, which is a maturing of the self that allows the dissolution of one's counter-productive obsessive, internal pre-occupations and assumptions, including unrecognized peer-pressure and the like,—all of which reduce our actual choices, thus reduce our freedom.

Self-realization as freedom from external coercion, including cultural expectations, political and economic freedom, etc.


Basically I think those who believe in religion, due so not under free will but have been indoctrinated to do so, and as religion is also a very socially organized cultural and belief system, it is under peer-pressure that religious people undergo, so their whole faith if not of Free Will.


Christians are just a socialize group of Convenient Sinners. They can sin, effortlessly without true remorse or accountability have their sins forgiven, they can break promises without accountability and they evangelize more than any other religion. A social group bounded by indoctrination and not of true free will or free choice to become one.

The Christian who started this thread has disappeared. His faith isn't strong enough, just convenient for his own ego.

quote Originally posted by NoMoreRicers:

So true.

quote Originally posted by Wichita: Christians are just a socialize group of Convenient Sinners. They can sin, effortlessly without true remorse or accountability have their sins forgiven, .. The Christian who started this thread has disappeared. His faith isn't strong enough, just convenient for his own ego.

Threads been over for a while now. Back to your regular scheduled programming.

Tha last thing I will say in this thread is if a Christian continures to willingly sin, they arent one.
Anyone have questions?
gotquestions?

quote Originally posted by 2.5: Threads been over for a while now. Back to your regular scheduled programming. Tha last thing I will say in this thread is if a Christian continures to willingly sin, they arent one. Anyone have questions? gotquestions?

You have been feeding of a Diet of Worms, so to me, you aren't a true Christian either. That's how I see it.

Anyone have questions? Ask a librarian.

[This message has been edited by Wichita (edited 05-24-2013).]

quote Originally posted by NoMoreRicers:

I was gonna say something but hey they want to waste their time on something that ain't going to happen, having him turn into what they think is the right religion. Now that is just so selfish for those who think that is the right religion, who is to say it is right for him.

All it does is make the ones praying feel good, not him.

But go ahead and keep trying to convert him to your religion, I wont.

Steve

------------------
Technology is great when it works,
and one big pain in the ass when it doesn't



Detroit iron rules all the rest are just toys.

quote Originally posted by 2.5: Tha last thing I will say in this thread is if a Christian continures to willingly sin, they arent one.

Wow, I didn't know there were so few christians.

quote Originally posted by Wichita: ... The Christian who started this thread has disappeared. His faith isn't strong enough, just convenient for his own ego.

I suspect that he disappeared because he believed that he was trying to do something good/helpful for you (with your permission, even, as I understand it)
By praying to Lucifer to take his soul, you were clearly saying that you wished harm upon him, in his eyes.
You can twist the logic around however you like. That's it, in a nutshell. (Or course, I'm telling you stuff that you already know.)

I'm pretty sure you don't care. I can see that you have had a lot of fun making a mockery out of another man's good intentions.
So... Do carry on. Have fun.

quote Originally posted by Raydar: By praying to Lucifer to take his soul, you were clearly saying that you wished harm upon him, in his eyes.

Playing devil's advocate here ... If Wichita doesn't believe in God (any god), then he can hardly believe in Lucifer. Therefore, him stating that he's praying to Lucifer is simply a joke. He's just yanking the OP's chain.

Far be it from me to defend Wichita, as he's ticked me off on more than one occasion. But seriously, I think this whole thread is beyond weird.

what the original poster wanted to do was change his beliefs to what the OP. he was being no better than all those terrorists who kill for Allah because they are non believers in whatever god YOU believe in. We all have our beliefs, some stranger than others. i would be insulted if someone wanted to pray for me to turn to their religion.

you believe what you want and leave everyone else to believe in what is right to them. Trying to change them to whatever you want is just not right and has caused many wars all over the world for centuries.
I thought we were founded on the right for anyone to believe in whatever god or no god they wanted.
Think about it, what if he was Jewish, or catholic, or some other religion would he also be praying for him then?.
steve

------------------
Technology is great when it works,
and one big pain in the ass when it doesn't



Detroit iron rules all the rest are just toys.

[This message has been edited by 84fiero123 (edited 05-27-2013).]

quote Originally posted by Patrick: ... He's just yanking the OP's chain. Far be it from me to defend Wichita, as he's ticked me off on more than one occasion. But seriously, I think this whole thread is beyond weird.

Well, sure he is. Looks to me like he's been yanking Boost's chain since day one.
And yes. It's weird. But it was there. In the beginning I was willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, but I see that it turned out, more or less, like I expected.

At least Boost was sincere. (Again, with Wichita's "approval". That's what pisses me off. I could have seen it for the waste of time and effort that it was. But then I'm not quite so benevolent or trusting as some people, I suppose. I'd just as soon say "F*ck 'im.")

Whatever.

[This message has been edited by Raydar (edited 05-27-2013).]

quote Originally posted by Raydar: At least Boost was sincere.

IMO, that probably adds to the weirdness of this thread.

quote Originally posted by Raydar: I could have seen it for the waste of time and effort that it was.

You know that and I know that, but we're both old and jaded.

quote Originally posted by 84fiero123: ...you believe what you want and leave everyone else to believe in what is right to them. Trying to change them to whatever you want is just not right...

Someone needs to tell my wife!

quote Originally posted by yellowstone: Someone needs to tell my wife!

Give her my number, i would love to talk to her.

steve

------------------
Technology is great when it works,
and one big pain in the ass when it doesn't



Detroit iron rules all the rest are just toys.

I don't wish Boost no harm. I was being sincere and allowed him to display his faith and he probably believed or at least hoped his faith on display was so powerful, since Jesus was on his side, that I would convert to Christianity and he then can boast about how powerful his message was to other Christians.

But knowing the fallacy of human behavior that all I had to do was challenge and test his faith and he would cave in and run away. Because I know that most Christians are not strong in faith, they display it well for their own egos, but can't handle conflicts and debate especially when they have no answers.

Christians suppose to have faith so strong that not even Lucifer can change them, as the story of the temptation of Christ. But Lucifer won and made Boost run away. All this does is solidify the fact that the Jesus God is not real. The belief in the Jesus God also does nothing to improve or strengthen ones character, but rather it weakens it because you believe in something that isn't real.

quote Originally posted by Wichita: I don't wish Boost no harm. I was being sincere and allowed him to display his faith and he probably believed or at least hoped his faith on display was so powerful, since Jesus was on his side, that I would convert to Christianity and he then can boast about how powerful his message was to other Christians. But knowing the fallacy of human behavior that all I had to do was challenge and test his faith and he would cave in and run away. Because I know that most Christians are not strong in faith, they display it well for their own egos, but can't handle conflicts and debate especially when they have no answers. Christians suppose to have faith so strong that not even Lucifer can change them, as the story of the temptation of Christ. But Lucifer won and made Boost run away. All this does is solidify the fact that the Jesus God is not real. The belief in the Jesus God also does nothing to improve or strengthen ones character, but rather it weakens it because you believe in something that isn't real.

You proved nothing other than the fact that you can string somebody along and waste their time, and then slap them across the face for their trouble. I don't think you challenged his faith, in the slightest. I think you pissed him off.
Pretty dickish thing to do, actually.

Just recognize that there are all flavors of Christian. Some feel the need to evangelize. Some don't.
I happen to be of the second school.
I think it would be great if you would believe, but I'm not one to go out of my way to get you to.
Truthfully, regarding people like you, I just don't care more than about > -< that much.
You've heard it enough. You're a big boy.
Everyone is ultimately responsible for themselves. Everyone has a choice and a free will.

Later.

[This message has been edited by Raydar (edited 05-27-2013).]

quote Originally posted by Raydar: You proved nothing other than the fact that you can string somebody along and waste their time, and then slap them across the face for their trouble. I don't think you challenged his faith, in the slightest. I think you pissed him off. Pretty dickish thing to do, actually. Just recognize that there are all flavors of Christian. Some feel the need to evangelize. Some don't. I happen to be of the second school. I think it would be great if you would believe, but I'm not one to go out of my way to get you to. Truthfully, regarding people like you, I just don't care more than about > -< that much. You've heard it enough. You're a big boy. Everyone is ultimately responsible for themselves. Everyone has a choice and a free will. Later.

X2

I also think you (Wichita) just try to ruffle feathers to get a response or you're just an attention whore.

quote Originally posted by Raydar: You proved nothing other than the fact that you can string somebody along and waste their time, and then slap them across the face for their trouble. I don't think you challenged his faith, in the slightest. I think you pissed him off. Pretty dickish thing to do, actually. Just recognize that there are all flavors of Christian. Some feel the need to evangelize. Some don't. I happen to be of the second school. I think it would be great if you would believe, but I'm not one to go out of my way to get you to. Truthfully, regarding people like you, I just don't care more than about > -< that much. You've heard it enough. You're a big boy. Everyone is ultimately responsible for themselves. Everyone has a choice and a free will. Later.

I know what I know and learning more each day, and of course I'll never claim to have all the answers.

But you'll keep feeling what you feel though your emotions, which is on display as being unchristian.

It's not myself that I need to worry about. But you'll have to worry about your fellow Christians who believe you are not Christian, which many of them will believe that.

I'm not in the clueless, feely, feely club of fearful folks who think that a bearded man is starring down on them from the sky and that girls with bird wings is protecting them.

I'm so far from that delusional beliefs that I'm the last person you want to think about. You need to make sure your love ones and your children go to cloud city with streets paved in gold.

It's funny that not a single Christian, no matter how many times I have asked the question, never answer.

What will you do in heaven for eternity?

quote Originally posted by Wichita: It's funny that not a single Christian, no matter how many times I have asked the question, never answer. What will you do in heaven for eternity?

Enjoy it.

quote Originally posted by Wichita: ...But you'll keep feeling what you feel though your emotions, which is on display as being unchristian.

I don't care. I never said I was "a perfect Christian." Far from it.

quote ...It's funny that not a single Christian, no matter how many times I have asked the question, never answer. What will you do in heaven for eternity?

Not a single one? I find that difficult to believe.
My answer is "Love." That's what I believe my faith is all about.
I expect that you'll have an argument for that, too. That's okay. I'm not beating my head on the wall, trying to convince you.
Like I said, you've heard it before. Your choice.

quote Originally posted by Wichita: What will you do in heaven for eternity?

Enjoy the company of all those people that came before and after me. I want to have long discussions with the founding fathers, dinners with the great generals, early morning walks with the Popes, have the engineers of the Pyramids explain how they managed to do it, etc...We'll have plenty of time

quote Originally posted by Wichita: Or you just want nobody to debate your delusional, superstitious and childish beliefs. I know it's probably bad etiquette to say that Santa, Tooth Fairies, Easter Bunny, Apollo, Zeus, Jesus God and etc are not real....to Children, maybe. But grown adults? Yeah, I'm just an attention whore. I'm trying to get Jesus's attention. What's wrong with trying to find love from the lord? I just want him to kiss me to show me he's real. But I suspect I'll die without any love from Jesus. So be a good Christian and pray for my soul or be a typical Christian and hate me, chastise me and wish me death in hell.

You just don't see or won't see the hypocricy in your own texts. And you talk about Christians being blind.

Hate you? Nope. Look down on you, pitty you, or anything else for that matter. Go your own way.....it never mattered to me one way or the other. I don't care if you look at yourself in the mirror and claim to be your own god. Do watcha gotta do, just stop being a hypocrite just as you claim all Christians are.

quote Originally posted by Cooter: I want to have long discussions with the founding fathers, dinners with the great generals, early morning walks with the Popes, have the engineers of the Pyramids explain how they managed to do it, etc...We'll have plenty of time

What makes you think those people would be in heaven? The Egyptians would certainly not be in a christian heaven and I have serious doubts about most of the popes...

quote Originally posted by kyunderdawg: You just don't see or won't see the hypocricy in your own texts. And you talk about Christians being blind. Hate you? Nope. Look down on you, pitty you, or anything else for that matter. Go your own way.....it never mattered to me one way or the other. I don't care if you look at yourself in the mirror and claim to be your own god. Do watcha gotta do, just stop being a hypocrite just as you claim all Christians are.

Care to point it out? Or are you just another Christian without anything to say but to be un-Jesus like pissed off.

Well, I'm not the only one you despise. You can add Muslims and Mexicans. Should I add Obama?

Hypocricy[sic]? LOL! The devil is smiling and Jesus is crying.

quote Originally posted by Wichita: Care to point it out? Or are you just another Christian without anything to say but to be un-Jesus like pissed off. Well, I'm not the only one you despise. You can add Muslims and Mexicans. Should I add Obama? Hypocricy[sic]? LOL! The devil is smiling and Jesus is crying.

How does me pointing out how much of a hypocrite you are make me pissed off?. Nice try.

Ok, smart guy. You calling out Christians on how much they hate others and how stupid they are.........constantly, yet you do the same = HYPOCRITE. I never said I despise you or any others......again, nice try. I believe I posted in THIS thread that I didn't agree with 'Boost doing what he did, but that's on him.

Do I think you or any other Atheist is stupid for not believing in God? Nope. Do I judge you for it? Nope. Be happy at what you do.


EDIT: I better add this ( ) so you don't think I'm PO'd........

[This message has been edited by kyunderdawg (edited 05-27-2013).]

quote Originally posted by kyunderdawg: How does me pointing out how much of a hypocrite you are make me pissed off?. Nice try. Ok, smart guy. You calling out Christians on how much they hate others and how stupid they are.........constantly, yet you do the same = HYPOCRITE. I never said I despise you or any others......again, nice try. I believe I posted in THIS thread that I didn't agree with 'Boost doing what he did, but that's on him. Do I think you or any other Atheist is stupid for not believing in God? Nope. Do I judge you for it? Nope. Be happy at what you do. EDIT: I better add this ( ) so you don't think I'm PO'd........

I believe that hypocrisy is when somebody tells others to abide by a behavior or belief that they in fact do not follow themselves.

I don't subscribe to Christianity. I also don't tell people they must believe in no God. I'm just laying out the evidence that Jesus is no God. I also know why people believe that Jesus is God, by indoctrination.

Christians aren't stupid, just indoctrinated. How else can someone believe in a God, in Christians, that would be Jesus, without knowing anything about Jesus, ever reading the Bible or not even knowing the history of your religion?

Indoctrination is opposite of education. I don't know a Christian who has been educated to become Christian. Because education requires you to question or critically examine the religion. But Christians have been indoctrinated to NOT question anything about their faith, but to accept it as truth.

It's just the way it is. I don't think that being Christian is bad or wrong. Self-limiting, maybe, but most everybody self-limits themselves with something, religion being the most common though. But that's not my battle to overcome. But I also won't be silence by religion either, unless it becomes against the law, then I would have to for self-preservation.

Do I judge Christians? Sure I do. I may be wrong about people sometimes, but right most of the time. I accept my fallacy though. I also don't get upset at the matter nor at religious people. They are who they are.

quote Originally posted by yellowstone: What makes you think those people would be in heaven?

Because if I am there, the standards must be pretty low