I have taken the intake manifold off a Ford 360 engine and am looking for something inexpensive to clean the hard carbon deposits both internally and externally. It has cross-flow passages for exhaust gas to heat the air/fuel for better atomization; these are heavily coated with hard carbon. The underside has a sheet metal plate riveted on that also has some carbon build up. I have time to soak in a tank if necessary. I have considered caustic over cleaners, acids and spray 'carburetor' cleaners.

Anyone know of an inexpensive method to clean this 100 lb hunk of old iron prior to installing it on my new engine?

Brake cleaner?

quote Originally posted by 8Ball: Brake cleaner?

I have considered that, but I wonder if it would disolve the heavy deposits before evaporating. Also, I think it would have to be a Chlorinated type which may be hard to find.

Oven cleaner/BBQ grill cleaner and a scraper .

It will discolour aluminum or chrome, but otherwise it works great.

An automotive machine shop can hot tank it for you, or maybe a local regular machine shop can drop it into their parts cleaner tank and let it stay overnight or weekend.

A hot tank at a machine shop should take care of it. Or if you want to do it the hard way, get a can of mineral spirits and an old toothbrush.

This is the stuff I used on popcorn machines (and BELIEVE ME, an intake manifold is NOTHING compared to one of them thats been neglected for a couple of years)

http://www.cretors.com/stor...=165&category_id=156

Its really just a concentrated oven cleaner.

Problem is, I dunno if Cretors will sell to the public. Ya might need to find a local popcorn machine service guy or distributor.

2 things with this stuff, be patient, sometimes it takes 2 or 3 go-arounds to get it all on a really bad machine, and #2 DONT breathe the fumes unless ya want to get higher than a kite with the corresponding crash. Outdoors or VOC resperator HIGHLY recomended.

<edit>

Here is your MO distributor

Missouri
Sonic Equipment Company
900 W. Miller Road
P.O. Box 667
Iola, KS 66749
United States

Provides equipment and service

Phone: 620-365-5701
Fax: 620-365-2753
Email: customerservice@sonicequipment.com
Website: www.sonicequipment.com

[This message has been edited by MidEngineManiac (edited 05-03-2013).]

I'd hesitate to use it, because its nasty stuff and highly carcinogenic, but trichloroethane would clean it mighty quick.

wire brush and elbo grease

steve

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Technology is great when it works,
and one big pain in the ass when it doesn't



Detroit iron rules all the rest are just toys.

You could try Seafoam or B12 Chem-tool or maybe Marvel Mystery Oil. They all are used for that kind of thing.

Suggestions for using a cleaner and a wire brush would work except the exhaust passage through the manifold crosses diagonally from one cylinder head to the other. It is convoluted and hignly coated with hard carbon. There are no local machine shops or anyone who has a cleaning tank I can take it to. The nearest shop is about an hour away. I am going to the automotive and hardware stores to see what potent chemicals are still available to the public. One local suggestion was to put it in a fire and burn out the carbon. That might work but I fear alteration of the properties of the casting or cracking if temperature increase/decrease could not be properly regulated.
This manifold is off an 1974 to 198x Ford 360 FE engine. It is going on a rebilt 360 into a 1967 Ford F350 I bought a couple of weeks ago. I'll get some photos up in a new build/patch-up post later and tell the, "It was a good thing", story about breaking down on the way home when I bought the old truck.

You know, if you soak rusted tools or anything rusted in vinegar and it just disolves it right off. Maybe ypu can try the same thing? Soak it in white vinegar for a day or two.

Having owned old british sport cars, carbon tetrachloride.

Maybe buy a 2-liter bottle of Coke and pour it into a pan big enough to soak the manifold in? They say it'll dissolve a nail eventually...

Marine decarbonizer will dissolve carbon and gunk when everything else fails. It comes in a spray can and IIRC it is sold under the name Engine Tuner. This stuff is absolutely amazing. It will clean nasty carb parts in 5 minutes when it would take 2 days of soaking in carb cleaner. It's designed to be sprayed in the carbs of 2 stroke outboard motors to remove carbon from the rings and pistons. In my opinion, carb and oven cleaner can't compare to this stuff.

quote Originally posted by gusshotrod: Having owned old british sport cars, carbon tetrachloride.

I don't know if that is still available. Dry Cleaners used to use it, but it is really toxic stuff. I think I'll try to find some caustic soda (concentrated oven cleaner) and soak it for a while and see what happens. I just ordered a replacement engine that should be here Tuesday or Wednesday. I hope to be ready to set it in and get this beast running. Thanks for the suggestions

Soak it in water. Water will dissolve carbon into a mush.

How about good old fashioned gasoline? works wonders.

Carbon TetraChloride is a carcinogen. Also, soaking in Caustic Soda solutions will eat away anything that's aluminum. Oven cleaners and other caustics will remove any painted surfaces on the part and could possibly pit mating surfaces if left on too long. You're wise not to use high heat since it could warp the piece, if it doesn't do other visible damage to it. Don't remove the metal plate that's riveted to the underside. It's near impossible to find the fasteners to reinstall it.

If you have an Advance or AutoZone or any major auto parts store near you, they probably do brake turning and will probably have a parts cleaner tank. Especially if there are no automotive machine shops near you. As a last resort, order a 5 gallon container of parts cleaner from SafetyKleen.

quote Originally posted by MidEngineManiac: Oven cleaner/BBQ grill cleaner and a scraper . It will discolour aluminum or chrome, but otherwise it works great.

This.

Yes, it will discolor the aluminum but, it'll clean it up also. Use liberally, place in an oven and heat up a couple of hundred degrees. Follow the directions on the label. You won't believe the outcome. I've seen this done before, works well.

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Ron
Sadly, it appears that in these days, the definition of an honest politician is one that, once bought, STAYS bought...

If I can find some dry Sodium Hydroxide aka Caustic Soda I am going to try it on scrap parts and see if I get the desired results. I may shoot some walnut blast media through the exhaust passages of the intake manifold after the cleaning and drying process to try and clear any remaining carbon.

just to add to all the "soak it in ____" - a handy thing to do while soaking is to set the tub on a speaker, and play music - especially thumpy music - LOUD.

but - yes - water is actually pretty good on carbon. tho - on an intake - its more than just carbon usually....

getting it dipped isnt that costly is it? havent had anythign dipped in a long time, not sure if its gotten costlier due to environmental concerns...?

quote Originally posted by blackrams: This. Use liberally, place in an oven and heat up a couple of hundred degrees.

MAN, you DO NOT want to be in house when the other half comes home and you have done that.....dont ask how I know.....also, dont ask how I know tearing apart a snowblower in the kitchen is a bad idea when she come home.....LMAO....torn-apart carter carbs on the kitchen table with gasoline in the sink ?....Uhhh, YEH, she aint gonna be a happy camper and ya aint getting any for a couple weeks.....

<edit>

Hey, I didnt have a garage so had to improvise. Thats my storey and I'm sticking to it

[This message has been edited by MidEngineManiac (edited 05-04-2013).]

Well, I can't find any caustic soda locally other than the diluted 'consumer grade' in oven cleaner or drain cleaner. Seems everything; mechanics with tank, chemicals, walnut shell blast media, or anything other than chlorinated brake cleaner or degreasers are too far away. I am going to get some chlorinated brake cleaner and try that first. This is 40+ year old baked on carbon so it is pretty tough, and that which is inside the manifold passage will have to be cleaned chemically and washed out at the car wash. I am going to block off the passages where the manifold connects to the head and spray the brake cleaner into the EGR port on top. I’ll post the result later. Thanks for the suggestions and interest.

Just after I got out of high school, I worked at an aluminum extrusion company. We used caustic soda flakes diluted in water to keep the hot aluminum from sticking to the extrusion dies. Pouring a quart of flakes into a 5 gallon pail of cold water brought about a rapid geyser eruption and would generate enough heat to cook the paint off the pail. I saw a co-worker's Vega that had received a dose of caustic soda into the radiator after a dispute with another co-worker. The car didn't make it the 30 miles home. Be very careful if you find any.

How about Dran-O, Liquid Plumr or CLR?

I had to de-funk and intake and used the liquid paint stripper from the local home center. I found a plastic tub big enough to hold the intake, poured a couple of gallons of the stuff on top of it, and closed the lid. A couple of days later, a trip to the local spray-n-wash and everything was nice and clean. There was NO carbon anywhere, and all the paint was gone, so all it took was a quick spray with some brake cleaner and a coat of paint to make it new again.

I just remembered an old trick used to remove baked on stuff from the charcoal grill, baking sheets and oven racks. Pour a gallon of ammonia into a plastic garbage bag, put your part inside and tie it up tight. Leave it overnight and hose it off. Repeat if necessary.

Maybe try CLR?

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Jonathan

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quote Originally posted by fierofool: I just remembered an old trick used to remove baked on stuff from the charcoal grill, baking sheets and oven racks. Pour a gallon of ammonia into a plastic garbage bag, put your part inside and tie it up tight. Leave it overnight and hose it off. Repeat if necessary.

Looks like Winter # II is over, it will get to almost 60 degrees today. I looked at Wal-Mart’s assortment of 'consumer chemicals' yesterday and saw that ammonia was only about $1.14 a gallon. That's cheap enough to try a 'full immersion' bath before I try any of the more expensive/dangerous chemicals that might also attract attention from Homeland De’ Security. A large plastic storage/bath tub there is under $10 also. I'm going to load the 100 pound piece of old iron up for a pre-ammonia-bath trip to the car wash today. The ammonia could be 'recycled' for other uses, so it is certainly worth a try.
If you hear a large explosion and see a mushroom cloud rising over Southwest Missouri, you'll know I tried one of the more risky methods of cleaning the manifold I've considered...


Here's a photo of the old truck from the CraigsList ad.

BURN the carbon. I did it with my TDI intake.

here is a video on youtube. (not mine).

TDI INTAKE CLEANING


It was surprisingly easy and effective.

Cheers!

[This message has been edited by Purple86GT (edited 05-05-2013).]

DeV8er, you're supposed to let the fumes do the work without soaking the part. If you have something to place into the bottom of the bag and set the intake on it. Probably a quart or two would work, but I suppose immersion might do the trick, too. I've used it for years for the BBQ grill ceramic racks and for the oven racks before we got a self-cleaning oven.

Some other things that might work--Automatic Dishwasher Powder like Cascade or Sparkle, mixed into hot water at a high concentration and poured into the passages and left to soak.

Just be careful mixing caustics and ammonia or chlorine.

I used water and borax a cookie sheet and a car battery charger. Came out great and I had to use no effort.
[/QUOTE]

quote Originally posted by 87antuzzi: I used water and borax a cookie sheet and a car battery charger. Came out great and I had to use no effort.

Interesting. Please detail the process for us. Looks like that process could be used in many ways.

quote Originally posted by fierofool: Interesting. Please detail the process for us. Looks like that process could be used in many ways.

Using a DC car charger and some sort of sacrificial steel you use it as an anode in your tank. The part you want to clean is the Cathode and your water and borax or sodium bicarbonate is the conductor between the two. The anode will pull all the impurity's off the cathode leaving a clean part.

Thank you. That looks like a very safe and effective cleaning method. How long did it take to clean that head?

For the novices among us, explain which piece gets positive and negative, since cathode and anode can be either, depending upon whether you're making an electrolytic or galvanic cell. You wouldn't want to draw all the impurities to the part. What did you use as your sacrificial piece? Never mind. I see it.

[This message has been edited by fierofool (edited 05-06-2013).]

quote Originally posted by fierofool: Thank you. That looks like a very safe and effective cleaning method. How long did it take to clean that head? For the novices among us, explain which piece gets positive and negative, since cathode and anode can be either, depending upon whether you're making an electrolytic or galvanic cell. You wouldn't want to draw all the impurities to the part. What did you use as your sacrificial piece? Never mind. I see it.

The head stayed in for 19 hours or so. When removed there will be a film over the metal that can be removed with Diesel fuel and a stiff brush. I used my parts washer and about 10 minutes of manual labor to clean the residue off. The sacrificial piece gets the positive voltage. I was using 12volt DC at 30 Amps. A bi-product of this is hydrogen gas so I recommend you do it outside and I also recommend you use a GFCI outlet as your are playing with water and electricity. I used a steel cookie sheet, NEVER USE ANY SORT OF STAINLESS as it will produce a toxic Chromium due to the process. While using steel produces a not toxic mixture I still wore chem gloves (if you need some I will send you some free of charge as I get them form work for free). The process is roughly based on line of sight, meaning the sacrificial anode will only pull from the cathode its facing. You can suspend the part in the center of the tank and use multiple anodes but I simply rotated the part every few hours. This is the anode after 10 hours, remember all the parts were stuck into clean water with parts that had been run in a pressure washer. The rust colored goop is all impurity's pulled out of the head, its everything you want cleaned off without damaging the metal or the mating surfaces. However, if you are doing this to a high mileage part it will break down the carbon and cause the tolerances to slip. If you have a valve covered in carbon it will be cleaned, the seats will be cleaned of carbon causing a bad valve seat until the engine is warm. I would at least re lap the valve seats and a minimum. here is the anode after cleaning

Does it harm dis-similar metals (brass, aluminum, etc.), or plastics, rubber, etc. or sensors attached to the steel?
This is a very interesting method I have never heard of before, which is unusual for me at my age.
Thanx!

[This message has been edited by Boondawg (edited 05-06-2013).]

"Light" metals such as aluminum, zinc, white metal or other alloys break down much quicker than steel, cast iron or brass. I think it's because at the molecular level, there is a weaker bond, but I am not a chemist. A smooth aluminum surface that has light surface corrosion can still be cleaned, but only immerse the material for short periods (15 minutes) and clean with a soft brush. Longer periods will discolour, badly pit or even completely dissolve aluminum. It will eat plating off metals. As far as the sensors go I left all the sensors in the head and they came out fine. It wont effect plastic as it will not conduct. Its normally used for heavy items, cast parts, engine blocks, cranks, pistons or frozen industrial sized bearings. Ultrasonic cleaning is generally used for less stout parts.

quote Originally posted by 87antuzzi: I used water and borax a cookie sheet and a car battery charger. Came out great and I had to use no effort.

Plus for you!

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Jonathan

Please join me in prayer that forum member Wichita gives his life to the Lord Jesus.
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This is what the head looked like before BTW. This was of an 84 I purchased.

If you need a container and are willing to drive to Joplin I have a polymer 55 gallon drum you can have that would be perfect for a tank. Also with the round shape you use wire from concrete work as the anode. I cant recall the name of the wire but its the fence looking material you lay down then tie the wire before you pour. It comes in a roll so it already has the form to just drop into a drum. It also takes well to heat, hot water heater elements are a quick, cheap and easy way to get consistent and controllable heat. If you are going with the chemical route the cheapest and most effective product is going to be Aircraft Stripper, not the aerosol but the consecrated gallon jug. Aircraft stripper is no joke, use proper PPE when using it.