What are your thoughts/reviews? In the past it seems I've either worked somewhere where I could use the welder or used a friend's if I needed it. Recently I keep running into situations where a welder would be handy to own plus I took a comfy desk job a year ago so using my employer's is out of the question obviously. I'm also contemplating a 3800 SC swap on my car in the near future and I'm sure a welder would be nice to have. My shop now does not have 220 running to it so I'm stuck with 120 volt options. Brand new models can be had for a decent price with used models on craigslist even cheaper.

Is 120 volts going to cut it? The main things I see are the motor mounts for my swap. Other than that it would just be here and there kind of stuff like exhaust work. I wasn't sure if a 120 welder would get enough heat into a motor mount to trust the weld. Any thoughts and opinions are welcome.

FWIW, I have contemplated running 220 to the shop. Right now electricity is supplied through and overhead cable which I would like to replace with a buried cable. If I ended up doing this, I would be sure to run 220 to the shop at that time. If there was a 220 supply I would just shop around until I found a 220 volt welder and not even consider 120.

120v will be able to do up to 3/16" thick steel at a low duty cycle. You might be able to push it for 1/4" thick steel. That should be enough to do motor mounts.

Personally, I would run the 220 and be done with it. You don't want to buy one piece of equipment then decide to upgrade later. You end up losing money when you could have just bought the 220 to begin with.

I'm currently using a 90 Amp flux-core welder (120VAC) that I bought from Harbor Freight. It's nothing to brag about, but has been useful for small stuff like welding exhaust pipes, welding in patch panels (rust repair), and various engine brackets. For example, I was able to weld up a custom throttle cable bracket for the Buick GN throttle body on my 3.4 V6. And I was able to modify the front tranny mount bracket for the FWD Getrag transmission.

That said, the flux-core welder creates a lot of splatter. If you're trying to make something look halfway decent, you'll be grinding down a lot of stray metal.

quote Originally posted by Doug85GT: 120v will be able to do up to 3/16" thick steel at a low duty cycle. You might be able to push it for 1/4" thick steel. That should be enough to do motor mounts. Personally, I would run the 220 and be done with it. You don't want to buy one piece of equipment then decide to upgrade later. You end up losing money when you could have just bought the 220 to begin with.

If you are going to run 220 underground you better do it quick, the frost is going to be deep very soon and will make digging very difficult or you are going to have to wait until next spring, or use a jack hammer.

quote Originally posted by Blacktree: I'm currently using a 90 Amp flux-core welder (120VAC) that I bought from Harbor Freight. It's nothing to brag about, but has been useful for small stuff like welding exhaust pipes, welding in patch panels (rust repair), and various engine brackets. For example, I was able to weld up a custom throttle cable bracket for the Buick GN throttle body on my 3.4 V6. And I was able to modify the front tranny mount bracket for the FWD Getrag transmission. That said, the flux-core welder creates a lot of splatter. If you're trying to make something look halfway decent, you'll be grinding down a lot of stray metal.

Flux core is messy but does give you more penetration on those thicker metal projects but also has its limitations as well. but also make slag that the regular mig doesn't, something to think about before limiting yourself to it.

I prefer the 220 ones myself, more power but less portability, unless you go with the smaller 220 unit like I have, then you can still have the portability and penetration. All the smaller 220 units have the penetration ability and can be use with the flux core to make them able to penetrate even more. one of the things I like about the smaller 220 units is the ability to weld the thin stuff the bigger 220 units are to powerful for and the thicker stuff as well with multiple passes, just like you would do with the bigger units.

one of the things with the cheaper 110 units I don't like is that they have limited power ranges, usually just 2 or 4 or at most 6 heat ranges, so if you go that route, the 110 unit pay the extra and get a better one with 10 heat ranges not just a few.

Steve

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Technology is great when it works,
and one big pain in the ass when it doesn't



Detroit iron rules all the rest are just toys.

[This message has been edited by 84fiero123 (edited 12-03-2013).]

I have a small Lincoln 100 that is at work for small things that I don't feel like digging out the big Miller for. It worked so good that I bought one just like it for home. LOVE IT. I had one of the horror freight flux welders, used it twice and gave it to my daughter.

quote Originally posted by fastblack: Is 120 volts going to cut it? The main things I see are the motor mounts for my swap.

The current capacity (amps) of a 120-volt welder should be adequate, but you may be limited by a very low duty cycle at high current settings. Some of my certification welds (multi-pass v-notch welds on 1/2 inch steel plate stock) were performed at currents of less than 120 amps, but this was using a professional-quality welder with a virtually unlimited duty cycle.

[This message has been edited by Marvin McInnis (edited 12-04-2013).]

I have a Hobart 135 with gas shielding and it works well enough for steel. Aluminum is a pain though. You want 220v if you can. Then you can run a spool gun for aluminum.

Exactly how is electricity run to your shop? Do you have a circuit breaker box in your shop? Can you install one?

If your power is simply an extension from a 120v source then it's a no go. If your source is the main breaker panel then you have options.

Lets talk 120 volt MIG welders


Lets not.

Instead just get a decent 220 models and run the power.

How "short" is the duty cycle on these 110v flux core machines?
When it says "20%" what is that a % of?
Time?--amps?

1 minute working and 20 minutes cooling?

[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 12-03-2013).]

quote Originally posted by maryjane: How "short" is the duty cycle on these 110v flux core machines? When it says "20%" what is that a % of? Time?--amps? 1 minute working and 20 minutes cooling?

that depends on how high you are running it, very few people except a pro is going to hit it.
think more in min Don, say you have a 20% duty cycle, it should run at FULL POWER say 20 min out of 100 min. I think, mine is a 220 unit and really don't know what the duty cycle is for it and have only ever run into it once, welding long beads multiple times over a foot long on 1/4" plate, starting at one end, then returning to the beginning and back, sort of like ribbon candy. and I had been at it long enough that I needed a brake anyway. you don't have to wait that long for it to reset, that just depends on when the breaker cools down. like I said I forget how long it was but guess it was running at 3/4 power for over 20 min without any waiting or cooling down between beads.

http://www.millerwelds.com/...echoose/basics6.html

The average home owner is not going to hit the duty cycle limit on their machine because they are not constantly running their welder, even most pros don't with them, because you weld a little, reposition yourself or the part or something. For just like muffler thickness pipes you could run a bead all the way around a 2" pipe and never hit it. the first and only 110 unit I bought never let me down but it was a brand name, there are many of those. But the constant inability to weld 1/4" in one pass just pissed me off, while I already has a arc welder for that stuff and those are not all that expensive if you just buy a Buzz box welder, now when you get into the welder/generators that's when they start costing the big bucks.

one recommendation I will make if anyone decides on a 110 unit, get one with 10 heat ranges and the ability to go from flux core to regular wire. in other words it comes with a regulator or has it as an option, the cheaper units don't have that ability.

I think this is the new version of my mig.

http://www.lincolnelectric....9-2(LincolnElectric)

Don't let that price scare you, I bought mine at a welding supplier and it was under 600 I think but that was probably 10 years ago and you don't have to buy them there, hell you can buy them online at places like Cyberweld and many other online retailers.

Steve

[This message has been edited by 84fiero123 (edited 12-03-2013).]

I wonder how many people have bought those 120V units, unknowingly plugged them into a standard 15a outlet with the old 14awg wiring in their garage and melted the wiring or burned up the outlet when they went to full rated output? Newer codes require 12awg and 20a outlets and circuit breakers on all wall outlets but many garages and shops still have the old wiring and outlets. They won't handle 20amps./2400watts and that doesn't take into account anything else that might be plugged into the same circuit and active.

Steve, you said weld 1/4 inch. What thickness is a truck frame? 1/8? 3/32? Or a suspension arm? 14 gauge? 16 gauge? If I'm not fabricating another Titanic ( that may not be the right reference ), the 120 sounds adequate. Maybe not perfect, but adequate. Just for my info, BTW; the steel maker says the epoxy adhesive will work just fine on bulkheads, and it's waterproof.

quote Originally posted by heybjorn: Steve, you said weld 1/4 inch. What thickness is a truck frame? 1/8? 3/32? Or a suspension arm? 14 gauge? 16 gauge? If I'm not fabricating another Titanic ( that may not be the right reference ), the 120 sounds adequate. Maybe not perfect, but adequate. Just for my info, BTW; the steel maker says the epoxy adhesive will work just fine on bulkheads, and it's waterproof.

You are using a John Buchanan welder?

quote Originally posted by maryjane: I wonder how many people have bought those 120V units, unknowingly plugged them into a standard 15a outlet with the old 14awg wiring in their garage and melted the wiring or burned up the outlet when they went to full rated output? Newer codes require 12awg and 20a outlets and circuit breakers on all wall outlets but many garages and shops still have the old wiring and outlets. They won't handle 20amps./2400watts and that doesn't take into account anything else that might be plugged into the same circuit and active.

I have a 120 amp, 115V flux core welder. I really love it for what I do with it. I use a dedicated 20 amp circuit (single plug, 12ga wire, about 20' from panel). If I run on max power for too long a run, I have tripped the breaker a few times. A dedicated 10ga, 30 amp circuit would be preferable if you plan on welding lots of thicker material on the high setting.

As Steve mentioned, the downside of these welders is the lack of power settings. I have 4 power settings. If I set it on Min-1 (lowest setting) and a feed rate of about 2-3, I am able to weld 16ga pipe (i.e. exhaust). This may not be possible on some machines since they may not go low enough, and you'll just blow through the pipe.

quote Originally posted by maryjane: When it says "20%" what is that a % of? Time?--amps?

It's 20% of time at rated continuous output. For example, the Lincoln SP-140 model (i.e. 120 volt inpout, 140 amps max output) is rated for a 20% duty cycle at 90 amps continuous output. It's hard to pin manufacturers down, but 20% usually means something like 3 minutes (max) welding out of every 15. For home use, that's usually not very limiting ... but it can still be a pain to have the thermal protection trip without warning right in the middle of a weld.

[This message has been edited by Marvin McInnis (edited 12-03-2013).]

quote Originally posted by Marvin McInnis: It's 20% of time at rated continuous output. For example, the Lincoln SP-140 model (i.e. 120 volt inpout, 140 amps max output) is rated for a 20% duty cycle at 90 amps continuous output. It's hard to pin manufacturers down, but 20% usually means something like 3 minutes (max) welding out of every 15. For home use, that's usually not very limiting ... but it can still be a pain to have the thermal protection trip without warning right in the middle of a weld.

I've tried my best, but I have never even seen the thermal trip go off on mine! I believe mine is 10% duty cycle for 120 amp, 35% for 60 amp

On another note....why do they call a 120 amp machine a MIG130, and a 90 amp machine a MIG100...hmmmm...I bet some people buy them without paying attention thinking they are getting more power than they actually are!

DONT dial it up to 26 or 28, and in the haste grond to the lug nuts...YES, they are a nice celan ground for the unit, YES, it works great......but putting al that electricity thru the bearings and expecting it to actually ROLL afterward??--not so good. AFTER ya have changed the bearing and race ya welded together accidently, THEN ya get to stand there while everybody points and laughs about how smart ya were....Dont ask, just dont.

[This message has been edited by MidEngineManiac (edited 12-03-2013).]

quote Originally posted by MidEngineManiac: DONT dial it up to 26 or 28, and in the haste grond to the lug nuts...YES, they are a nice celan ground for the unit, YES, it works great......but putting al that electricity thru the bearings and expecing it to actually ROLL afterward??--not so good. AFTER ya have changed the bearing and race ya welded together accidently, THEN ya get to stand there while everybody points and laughs about how smart ya were....Dont ask, just dont.

Don't ask? I'm going to ask....

Personal experience?

I've seen that same trainwreck when they were welding the casing in the oilfield, and inadvertently ground to the rotary table that turns on big roller bearings and ball bearings where the individual balls were as big as your fist and rollers the size of beer cans. Them big Lincolns set on 200amps to weld enough to hold 1 million lbs dead weight and 5000-10,000 psi hyd pressure.
Really ugly outcome when the ball separators are bronze.

quote Originally posted by Hudini: I have a Hobart 135 with gas shielding and it works well enough for steel. Aluminum is a pain though. You want 220v if you can. Then you can run a spool gun for aluminum. Exactly how is electricity run to your shop? Do you have a circuit breaker box in your shop? Can you install one? If your power is simply an extension from a 120v source then it's a no go. If your source is the main breaker panel then you have options.

There is a breaker box in the shop. Transformer is on the pole at the road, then to the distribution box for the property on my light pole. From there it splits to the house and down to the shop. I am just assuming the wire running to the shop is not heavy enough for 220 since the guy I bought the house from never seemed to do things the right way. Whether I went with 120 or 220 I would run a dedicated outlet directly off the breaker box (within inches) so I know it was wired properly.

Plans for running new supply line to the shop aren't exactly in the near future, it's just something that I would like to do at some point. A 220 unit would be great but I don't think I can justify the expense that would go along with it for as little as it would get used.

I think a 120 unit will work just fine for what I need. Thanks for all the input and advice on what to look for. Pretty sure I mentioned Northern Tool gift cards to almost everybody for x-mas so maybe I'll have a good down payment on one

I have one of the 90 amp 120v Harbor Freight wire feed units, which I actually use more than my 220v Lincoln Mig or the 220V Lincoln Arc. Why do I use it more? Because while I do some welding for myself, most of it is out on jobsites where I might not have 220v in the vacinity. I've used that little wire feed to repair a 5' tiller tine shaft on a tractor implament and the next time it broke, it wasn't where I welded it. So for me, while I like my MIG and Arc and I do use them, the ease of transport and ability to be used almost anywhere I go of that little wire feed is just to convienant. So if you plan on taking it other places to use, you might want to consider that. If your only planning to ever use it in your garage then I agree with the others, run the 220v and get a 220v unit. Me? I need to get a generator I can use to run my other welders at jobsites...

[This message has been edited by Khw (edited 12-03-2013).]

Make sure your generator is rated for at least 5000 watts continuous--not 5000 peak or pulsed.

quote Originally posted by Neils88: ...why do they call a 120 amp machine a MIG130, and a 90 amp machine a MIG100...hmmmm...I bet some people buy them without paying attention thinking they are getting more power than they actually are!

It's mostly marketing puffery. Probably 130 amps peak for a few seconds vs. 120 amps for a longer period, etc. Some of the better manufacturers even publish graphs of continuous output current vs. duty cycle. The peak output current is primarily an electrical limit, while continuous output current and duty cycle are primarily thermal limits due to heat generated in the welder itself.

The "horsepower" ratings advertised for the motors in air compressors and other power tools are often even more egregious. They are commonly "instantaneous peak" horsepower ratings based on an abruptly locked rotor, which apparently includes a substantial inertial component. If you compare the power consumption of many air compressors with the claimed horsepower, you will often calculate motor efficiencies of 150% or higher.

[This message has been edited by Marvin McInnis (edited 12-04-2013).]