Nope foil side out, reflects heat from the exhaust. The amount of heat generated from the starter in infinitesimal compared to the heat generated by the exhaust and the engine block and related parts. Besides the starter blanket still leaves the end of the starter exposed and obviously the nose cone is exposed. So air can flow from the flywheel side through the starter and out the back to help aid in cooling without the heat soak on the solenoid and windings from the exhaust.
------------------ 85GT Soon to be 87GT,93 Eldorado 4.9, 5spd Dual O2 Custom Chip, Custom Exhaust. MSD Everything Capt Fiero --- My Over View Cadero Pics Yellow 88GT 5spd Full Poly Suspension, Lowered 1/2" in front, Corner Carver.
Looking at your exhaust layout on page one, I'm going to say you DO NOT have a heat soak issue on your car - I have the same manifold/crossover routing with no issues for years. It's the stock Caddy layout for all intents and purposes.
Look for corrosion on the cable or battery, bad ground, loose connections, loose bolt on the starter to solenoid strap, too small cable from battery to starter or maybe it's just getting weak from age.
I do know the starter to solenoid strap isn't the best, so that might be it. The problem is most likely a combination of several factors, basically IMO heat soak with an old starter. From the looks of that starter, I would say it's the original 1992 starter. No way to confirm that, just a guess, but that starter has seen better days. However, I DO know heat soak is an issue here, just with an old starter. Reason is, when this problem occurs, it's after a long highway trip and when I go to restart it after filling it will gas (or something else in that time frame, there is a good chance it will not work...not even a click...and If I sit there another 10-15 minutes, it may work, it may not. However, if I do the same thing except open the decklid when filling the gas tank, and let the heat rise out of the engine bay, it starts fine the first time.
I'm completely broke right now, but I really should invest in a replacement allante starter before the heat blanket, because now that I think about it I rather not wrap that old rusty starter.
[This message has been edited by mattwa (edited 12-24-2011).]
Yes as Olejoedad has just said, this is actually different than simple heat soak, heat soak in a starter presents like a low battery, where it cranks really slow. If you are not getting a click at all, sounds like a solenoid issue. NOW, before you say, but but its only when its hot. Yes its heat related, yes all the same causes as heat soak can cause a poor solenoid to go south.
The solution is to replace the solenoid. However replacing the solenoid on the Caddy starter can be a bit of a pain and a ton more work than putting on the starter blanket. The starter blanket will cover up the problem and you probably won't have an issue with it anymore.
If it were me, I would look into time/energy/money. Probably buy the blanket, toss that on, so the car is drivable. Then when I have the time and energy to pull the starter and replace the solenoid do that, then put the blanket back on, so that you won't have any troubles for a long time to come.
------------------ 85GT Soon to be 87GT,93 Eldorado 4.9, 5spd Dual O2 Custom Chip, Custom Exhaust. MSD Everything Capt Fiero --- My Over View Cadero Pics Yellow 88GT 5spd Full Poly Suspension, Lowered 1/2" in front, Corner Carver.
Oh, ok. I understand now. I thought heat soak was what I have experienced, with not even a click. Yea the solenoid being the problem sounds pretty accurate, I have noticed some hesitation with it at times as well. The solenoid that is on there now is from a Duke starter because I broke the one that was on the caddy starter when I was installing the 4.9 because it had that stupid plastic end.
But if you didn't notice, I have bigger issues to address before this, namely the alignment going out on me. Other then that it's drivable, the starter issue so far has only happened on hot hot days during a longer highway trip. No heat problems when it's snowing. I have several other solenoids around if I need to replace it. Might just buy an allante starter if it dies, not sure.
How is replacing the Solenoid more work then putting on the heat blanket (besides removing two screws and hoping they don't snap), I would take off the starter to install the heat blanket anyway.
There is no need to remove the starter to install the heat blanket, it comes as a sheet and not as a tube or anything. So you don't even have to remove the cables. Just jack up the car, slide under it, (with whatever safety you feel comfortable with) slide the blanket around the starter, then overlap the blanket. Now slip the zip tie around the back of the starter (between the casing and the oil pan) Wrap the tie around the starter and through the loop in the zip tie, pull tight, repeat for the 2nd zip tie and climb out from under, lower the car and you are done. I did this to my 4.9 about 5 years ago, after finally being fed up when I had to drive into downtown Vancouver BC Canada to pickup a cheque from my Agent. 1/2 hour later I went to my car and nurr, nurr, nurr she would not start. Went for a walk grabbed an Espresso and Scone, relaxed, came back another 1/2 later and she fired right up.
Now with this simple wrap type blanket on there, I have not had a single problem regardless if it is -15 below or +30 above, Celsius of course. (uhm about 90F which is heat wave temperatures for us.)
Kinda good to know, as I had no idea that the Fiero solenoid was the same as the Caddy. (The duke and the V6 are the same starter) I'll too be replacing my starter with the Allante starter at some point, probably if, (when) this one eventually fails on me. However for now, it works great, always starts the car, and I am happy with it.
------------------ 85GT Soon to be 87GT,93 Eldorado 4.9, 5spd Dual O2 Custom Chip, Custom Exhaust. MSD Everything Capt Fiero --- My Over View Cadero Pics Yellow 88GT 5spd Full Poly Suspension, Lowered 1/2" in front, Corner Carver.
Well, very bad luck today. I brought it in the garage today and took off the rear wheels to see if I could fix the alignment issue. I tightened the two strut bolts too 140 ft-lbs on each side, and checked all the links, all proper torque there. Went for a test drive, NO CHANGE. The tires keep badly sinking in. I called it quits till Alex called and came over to help. We took off the driver's tire again...brainstorming like crazy. Inspected many things, just re-tightened the strut bolts to 155 ft-lbs this time, and again, just moving it down and up the driveway messed it up again...only thing I noticed was it corrected it-self (for the most part) while going in reverse?! Makes zero sense. And seems like when it goes forward it sinks in again. I gave up.
But BEFORE all this happened, while I was pulling Goldie into the garage the first time...I have no idea how it happened but I guess I misjudged the distance and ran my front bumper into the rear tire of the snapper rear engine mower...hard. My front bumper is badly crushed in at that corner now. If I need to remove the bumper to repair it I'm just going to trash it as it wasn't a good bumper to start with.
The check engine light is on, my driver's side axle boot has a tear, spit out all the grease and it's been making noise, now the whole rear suspension is not working and feels very bad even more so in the corners (obviously), my thermostat housing is leaking coolant, gas gauge still doesn't work, the 4.9 isn't running like it used to...ugh. I'm not even sure what to do anymore, I just want to rid of it all and be done with it...
[This message has been edited by mattwa (edited 12-31-2011).]
Sorry to hear about your bad luck Matt. I hope you manage to repair your Fiero and get it back on the road where it belongs.
I really admire the hard work and enthusiasm you have put into your car. Especially the mechanical work you've done yourself. In my case, I do work on my own car and perform as many repairs and upgrades that I'm capable of doing without venturing too far into the major mechanical areas (engine/drivetrain/suspension) where I feel I could make a mistake that could cost me a fortune in replacement parts and shipping overseas.
For the moment I think it might be best to slow down and not concern yourself with all the issues at once as it might sound a little overwhelming. Hopefully someone will be able to help you figure out the alignment issue, it does sound very bizarre.
Tackle one problem at a time. Start with the visual aspect and that will make you feel like the other problems are worth doing. If a car looks like crap, it's hard to be enthusiastic about it. I enjoy reading and watching your adventures...makes me wish I was younger with more energy and money. You'll regret taking the easy way out but will be proud of your repairs when completed. Just remember, owning a Fiero is good practice for marriage...a lot of stress, money and time spent on high maintenance between the occasional ride.
D: That really sucks man. I wish you were closer so I could help you out. I'd hate to see you get frustrated and make a stupid decision and sell it. Remember, your car is like a woman. It'll throw a hissy fit and steal all of your money and then, but for the most part it'll treat you right if you treat it right.
Just walk away for a while. I've been there with my car. You need a couple weeks off to clear your head. Don't sell it because of a few problems that are fixable.
From what you describe that is happening with your rear suspension, it sounds like your rear tires are pointed outward slightly. So when you drive forward the tires try and move outward, go in reverse they come back together.
Thank you everyone for the support, it really does help. I think there is just too many projects going on right now and no working fieros. So yes I did get really frustrated and overwhelmed. What frustrated me the most was the stupid rear alignment issue, I have no clue what the problem is and none of it makes any sense at all. Then I could at least drive Goldie and that would make me feel better. If any of you haven't noticed the 3800/F23 I'm doing thats taking up all my time and money as well, and right now I'm not liking putting this much time and effort into two fieros..more so when both aren't driveable.
No I don't plan on selling it. No I don't plan on getting married.
[This message has been edited by mattwa (edited 12-31-2011).]
From what you describe that is happening with your rear suspension, it sounds like your rear tires are pointed outward slightly. So when you drive forward the tires try and move outward, go in reverse they come back together.
No they move inward, not outward. But other then that yea.
When you say inward, you mean Camber inward, not toe inward right?
If yes is the answer and you have torqued the snot out of the strut bolts, take the assembly off and see where the movement has left marks.
You may have to take the springs off, but something is moving and you have tightened it twice by what I have counted thus far. Something failed (Part) not installer is my feeling. The C/V Boots sound like they are not happy about it as well. If the strut tower bolts are tight, and ball joint is tight, problem is in between them.
The solenoid's coil grounds through the starter's brushes/armature. So if you get no click at all, usually the trouble is bad contacts between the armature and brushes.
If you get a loud click of the solenoid activating, moving the pinion to the flywheel, but no rotation of the starter motor it usually means the contacts in the solenoid are bad.
Your suspension will move/flex a bid in normal driving. Your tires will flex quite a bit. When you look at your alignment you need to measure/base it off of the rim, not the tire. You also need to have your suspension at driving height, and it has to not have pre-loads on it. Jacking the car up so the tires come off the ground and then putting it back down on concrete will definitely give you bad data when you try to make precision measurements on alignment.
One way to do that is to put the tires on two pieces of steel with grease in between the two.
And yeah you are putting a lot of nasty loads on the top of your struts if you left out a flexible joint up there.
[This message has been edited by phonedawgz (edited 01-01-2012).]
I do know the starter to solenoid strap isn't the best, so that might be it. The problem is most likely a combination of several factors, basically IMO heat soak with an old starter. From the looks of that starter, I would say it's the original 1992 starter. No way to confirm that, just a guess, but that starter has seen better days. However, I DO know heat soak is an issue here, just with an old starter. Reason is, when this problem occurs, it's after a long highway trip and when I go to restart it after filling it will gas (or something else in that time frame, there is a good chance it will not work...not even a click...and If I sit there another 10-15 minutes, it may work, it may not. However, if I do the same thing except open the decklid when filling the gas tank, and let the heat rise out of the engine bay, it starts fine the first time.
I'm completely broke right now, but I really should invest in a replacement allante starter before the heat blanket, because now that I think about it I rather not wrap that old rusty starter.
Agreeeed sir, the Allante starter is soooo much nicer.
Wanted to update this thread. Goldie's been sitting since December, the rear suspension issue, whatever it is, really pushed my patience. I haven't done anything to her either, other then move her over in the driveway and throw on a cover. I guess she is sitting during winter like I wanted, but not really in the condition I'd like. The end of 2011 was really rough for her. But I'm posting this because I think I finally found my problem with the leaking thermostat housing while messing around with the spare thermostat housing I got from pull-a-part. Ever since I had the 4.9, I have been fighting with the thermostat, it kept leaking on me when it was running. Started up again before I put a cover on her. I now realized I have been installing it wrong the whole time. WHOOPS. I didn't know the rubber O-ring went around the Thermostat. I have been always just putting it on top or under it. Oooops. I'm going to fix that very soon.
Hopefully fixed the thermostat issue a while ago, but I haven't started her up for a few months and the battery is dead anyway.
But the past two days I have been working on some of the wiring. I'm honestly surprised it worked as well as it did, my idiot younger self ran the power wire for the whole car minus starter, down the whole length of the car with just 14ga wire. After building what I have with Skye, this is pretty bad. I hate the stock plastic "power block", so I bought a new one with a single 1/4" stud that I'm going to mount in a different location. Today I installed a new 4ga wire going from the starter to my new "power block" when I get it in the mail. I'm attaching all main power connections at this point. This should work much better then the 14ga wire I had...yuck. Also replaced the Alternator wire that phonedawgz pointed out was too small with 8ga (I think).
I'm honestly surprised it worked as well as it did, my idiot younger self ran the power wire for the whole car minus starter, down the whole length of the car with just 14ga wire. Today I installed a new 4ga wire going from the starter to my new "power block" when I get it in the mail. I'm attaching all main power connections at this point. This should work much better then the 14ga wire I had...yuck. Also replaced the Alternator wire that phonedawgz pointed out was too small with 8ga (I think).
That, my friend, is what age and experience do. So don't beat yourself up over what mistakes you've made; learn from them. Keep up the good work!
That, my friend, is what age and experience do. So don't beat yourself up over what mistakes you've made; learn from them. Keep up the good work!
Yep! That's why this Fiero is becoming some-what second rate to me because I'm using all that I have learned since I started working on Fiero's on my current project, Skye. I can't think of a better example then that power wire, a single 14ga wire about 12 feet long powering the whole car, including the power to the starter trigger wire?! What was I thinking.
I'm also really liking the battery under the passenger headlight compared to in the spare tire area. Only disadvantage is you can't put it under the headlight without the "areo" nose, wouldn't be deep enough.
Today I uncovered Goldie and started her up for the first time in 2 months. She still runs! Leaking coolant from the thermostat, but she runs! Can't really drive her because of the rear suspension problem, but I'm going to get that solved hopefully soon. I even took a video!
Wow, Matt! That's awesome!!!! So are you guys going to make it to our Harrisburg Armory Show May 9th? You know you guys always have a roof over your head here, so there's really no excuse.
I have several other solenoids around if I need to replace it. Might just buy an allante starter if it dies, not sure.
She still runs! Leaking coolant from the thermostat, but she runs! Can't really drive her because of the rear suspension problem, but I'm going to get that solved hopefully soon. I even took a video! 
