Well, like most of you have found at one point or another, I was replacing my select and shift cables and found that my center console skeleton is literally disintegrating. Rather than putting a band-aid on a big wound and using epoxy, I decided to strip it completely out of my car, design and manufacture an aluminum replacement that can be assembled / disassembled in sections, making access to things like the shifter much easier.
Just thought I'd start a thread to document the process, so get out the popcorn...
Well, like most of you have found at one point or another, I was replacing my select and shift cables and found that my center console skeleton is literally disintegrating. Rather than putting a band-aid on a big wound and using epoxy, I decided to strip it completely out of my car, design and manufacture an aluminum replacement that can be assembled / disassembled in sections, making access to things like the shifter much easier.
Just thought I'd start a thread to document the process, so get out the popcorn...
That sounds familiar...WOW....Seperate pieces that is such a awesome idea.How did you come up with that?
[This message has been edited by fierogtlt1 (edited 07-29-2013).]
I just took my pics down from my thread so no more idea stealing will be done.
There are only so many ways to build a center console skeleton that allows stock mounting locations for stock center console pieces, whether it be billet aluminum or plastic with threaded inserts. Functionally they are going to end up nearly identical no matter what you do. It isn't "idea stealing"... It is competition. You have to prove that your product is lighter/stronger/better than the competition's product. Posting a photo of your progress isn't going to help someone else copy what you have done. They still need to get the dimensions, mounting points, etc.
Your design has promise, but it also has no vertical rigidity built into the main center structure. You need some dimensional depth to it in order to strengthen it. I've been watching your progress here and on Facebook and I am excited to see the outcome.
[This message has been edited by Synthesis (edited 07-29-2013).]
holy cow... calm down.. i never even said i'd be selling this.. i'm making myself one... yeesh... and how did i come up with the idea of separate pieces?
well lets see... like every other fiero enthusiast who's been ticked off about the skeleton while trying to get at the shifter. I didn't even know about your thread until the person up there ^^^ linked me to it.
Calm it down, i'm not trying to steal anyones business. just sharing my project with the fiero community, soo chilllll...
Anyway.. first progress pic... started on the CAD model today - more to come.
holy cow... calm down.. i never even said i'd be selling this.. i'm making myself one... yeesh... and how did i come up with the idea of separate pieces?
well lets see... like every other fiero enthusiast who's been ticked off about the skeleton while trying to get at the shifter. I didn't even know about your thread until the person up there ^^^ linked me to it.
Calm it down, i'm not trying to steal anyones business. just sharing my project with the fiero community, soo chilllll...
Anyway.. first progress pic... started on the CAD model today - more to come.
Sorry for freaking out over nothing........It just sounded a lot like my skeleton templates I made in seperate pieces for easier installation. I am making them made to order.Even with a Double DIN stereo option.Good luck with your build process.
Sorry for freaking out over nothing........It just sounded a lot like my skeleton templates I made in seperate pieces for easier installation. I am making them made to order.Even with a Double DIN stereo option.Good luck with your build process.
Sorry for freaking out over nothing........It just sounded a lot like my skeleton templates I made in seperate pieces for easier installation. I am making them made to order.Even with a Double DIN stereo option.Good luck with your build process.
alright wasn't going to let cat out of bag just yet , but with the drama I got to tell.... I was inspired to build a multi-piece hi-grade plastic console skeleton... and all my parts arrived today... Here is just a teaser pic for now...
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87 GT series 1 3800sc (7.597 @88.53 1.579 60ft) (series II swap in progress) 85GT Northstar 86GT 3800 n/a
[This message has been edited by jb1 (edited 08-01-2013).]
I am following both of these. We have had attempts of fiberglass, plastic, aluminum, etc. Yet here we sit as a forum of Fiero owners who still do not have a decent replacement / upgrade to that POS from GM. I was concerned about the HAV control arm move as well. There is nothing wrong with questioning a concept and/or design. We are all after the same end result.
It would really be sad if we had more than one option for replacement, I say no. TXGOOD wood is as good as any other thing than the cheep GM plastic, so go for it.
Been quite busy the last couple of days here - but have managed to get quite a few dimensions recorded. I have a bit more to do before I start modeling out the new frame, and need to take a look at which features of the skeleton, other than the tapped holes & their locations are important for proper function, so that I can minimize the new piece as much as possible. Won't make sense to cut an exact replica of the skeleton from aluminum, since it was designed for the mechanical properties of.... whats that material they used.... glass filled garbage plastic?
Currently as I look at the skeleton I envision it coming apart into four main components - radio housing, shifter skeleton, power accessory panel, and armrest, though depending on how this works out, I may combine the last two.
I am anxious to get this done, because frankly... I want to take my car to fierorama, and right now, it's in pieces!
Picture of the donor and the initial cad skeleton... of the skeleton...
of the skeleton...
To mill a shape like that out of a solid block, there would be quite a bit of waste right? I don't know much about the process, it just looks expensive for the billet aluminum stock. I suppose the modularity of your design would help with that too though...
[This message has been edited by carbon (edited 07-31-2013).]
With laser cutting and CNC bending machines, you could actually manufacture the majority of the skeleton out of bent sheet aluminum with press fitted brass threaded inserts.
Less waste and easier/cheaper in the long run.
The thicker and more intricate parts may need to be machined out of billet.
It will definitely not be produced from a solid hunk of aluminum. That'd be one pricey part, both in material cost and machine time. I'm building a cad skeleton of the positionally relevant items (holes, fastener locations, etc etc,) to model the components that will make up the final product around - which will help me ensure I have a precise part in the end.
It will initally begin as a handful of parts which will be assembled into 3 or 4 more permanent sub-assemblies that are readily disassembled for access to important areas.
While I do agree that a stamped part with post machining operations to locate holes would the the ideal method for a production part... the dies and equipment necessary to work out that process would be cost prohibitive... since we're all in a niche market here, my best option is to model it up and build what I can on the machines I have access to. If I produce something in time for fierorama that I'm happy with, I may produce an extra to be raffled off.
I do have a feeling that the cost of this will be relatively high said and done, not to mention the time I'll be putting in to lay it all out and make it a reality, but like i said... I need a stupid skeleton! lol
Frankly the BEST method would be to make it with an additive manufacturing process... (3d printer) But again... limited by what equipment is available.
[This message has been edited by evowake (edited 07-31-2013).]
So, the million dollar question....will you be making more of these? You know, for the rest of us knuckleheads to purchase from you? Not to bring up a sore subject, but the guy that was trying to make them out of plastic had quite a list of interested potential buyers going, and it seems that he has given up now...but judging by the response he was getting, I'd say there is a market here on the forum for a replacement whatever the material. I would have stuck with him since I had already committed to buying his product, but he is out of the market, and I still want a replacement. So how about it? Are you planning to sell these?
So, the million dollar question....will you be making more of these? You know, for the rest of us knuckleheads to purchase from you? Not to bring up a sore subject, but the guy that was trying to make them out of plastic had quite a list of interested potential buyers going, and it seems that he has given up now...but judging by the response he was getting, I'd say there is a market here on the forum for a replacement whatever the material. I would have stuck with him since I had already committed to buying his product, but he is out of the market, and I still want a replacement. So how about it? Are you planning to sell these?
For the record, I'm a mechanical designer by day and so I'm guilty of over thinking everything and I'm intentionally going over-kill with this, since I'm first and foremost doing it for myself.
Well like I said above, it really depends on what the cost to manufacture comes out to be. I consider the effort of the initial run a labor of love to make myself one, and if the raw materials + machine time + shipping doesn't put it out of the ballpark for what you folks find acceptable for a replacement, then I don't see why not. That being said I don't want to get ahead of myself. Let me finish one. If it is something I'm proud of and would feel comfortable selling to others then I'd be happy to offer a quality, US designed and produced part to the community.
Couple more pics - Switch panel section coming together:
It will definitely not be produced from a solid hunk of aluminum. That'd be one pricey part, both in material cost and machine time. I'm building a cad skeleton of the positionally relevant items (holes, fastener locations, etc etc,) to model the components that will make up the final product around - which will help me ensure I have a precise part in the end.
It will initally begin as a handful of parts which will be assembled into 3 or 4 more permanent sub-assemblies that are readily disassembled for access to important areas.
Frankly the BEST method would be to make it with an additive manufacturing process... (3d printer) But again... limited by what equipment is available.
Cool... I just made an assumption with the word billet. A 3D printer with the right material would be awesome, we use one for fast prototyping at a previous job, but the materials used were not strong enough for much of anything other than small parts.
Cool... I just made an assumption with the word billet. A 3D printer with the right material would be awesome, we use one for fast prototyping at a previous job, but the materials used were not strong enough for much of anything other than small parts.
Yea, when I started the thread my excitement got ahead of my logic
There are a variety of new 3d printing technologies that can print with organic materials... polymers... metals... but again... $$$$$$$
That reminds me.. I do have access to one at the local community college, I may need to see if i can run a couple parts!
There are a variety of new 3d printing technologies that can print with organic materials... polymers... metals... but again... $$$$$$$
That reminds me.. I do have access to one at the local community college, I may need to see if i can run a couple parts!
Machine yours out of AL, then make some rubber molds off those parts and reproduce plastic ones. That probably is by far the cheapest way to make this (without access to expensive machinery). However you need to keep the mold making part in mind while designing your AL part. Meaning the rubber mold sections for each piece should be thought about during the design portion.
If you were closer I would let you run them on my cnc mill
That would be a good idea for making spares but I'm not sure homebrew molding would offer me the type of consistency, control, and quality that i'd be happy to install in my own car let alone offer to others, but then again I don't have a ton of experience with it. May be worth lookin into once i'm through. I can always modify the CAD models slightly and produce a positive to make a mold from. first priority is to finish one that i'm happy with for my '88 GT. I appreciate the offer on the CNC!
[This message has been edited by evowake (edited 07-31-2013).]
Hmmmm.....
