10) 2007 Pontiac Solstice Coupe GXP When the Pontiac Solstice debuted in 2005 as a 2006 model, the bubbly little roadster turned a lot of heads. Pontiac had managed to bring the car from concept to production in barely a year and lost very little in translation. When the Solstice GXP bowed the following year, we knew Pontiac had something special on its hands. The real clincher arrived for 2009 with the four-cylinder turbo Solstice Coupe GXP, which covered the quarter mile in 14.0 sec at 100 mph and managed to rip from 0 to 60 mph in just 5.4 sec.
9) 1962 Pontiac Catalina 421 Super Duty The big, 421 Super Duty V-8 powered Catalina amazed our testers in 1962, running down an un-prepped Detroit Dragway in 13.9 sec at 107 mph, with a 0 to 60 mph sprint in just 5.4 sec. In the dead of winter. With snow still on the ground. If that's not impressive, we don't know what is.We speculated at the time that the Catalina's horsepower and torque ratings of 405 and 425 lb-ft, respectively, were dramatically underrated. We also figured that, given proper testing conditions, the car was capable of a quarter-mile run in the mid-12s with a trap speed of at least 115 mph -- possibly vying for the top spot on this list
8) 2008 Pontiac G8 GTBorn and built by Australia's Holden division, the Pontiac G8 GT hit our shores for the 2008 model year as a bargain contender to take on the BMW M5. A practical, four-door, rear-wheel-drive muscle sedan, this bargain beasty came with a 6.0L V-8 under its hood offering a substantial 361 hp and 385 lb-ft. That would be enough to propel our G8 GT tester to 60 mph in 5.3 sec and through the quarter mile in 13.8 sec at 102.3 mph.
7) 2004 Pontiac GTO After a 30-year hiatus, the car that started it all returned in 2004 with a Corvette-derived V-8 under the hood. Imported from GM's Australian Holden division, the new GTO was simultaneously lauded for its blistering performance and derided for its bland styling. Of course, you can't complain about what you can't see, and a GTO blasting to 60 mph in 5.34 sec and through the quarter-mile in 13.62 sec at 104.8 mph is definitely hard to keep an eye on.
6) 1997 Pontiac Firebird Firehawk LT4 Most Firehawks to roll out of SLP's shop packed either an LT1 or LS1 Chevrolet V-8 under the hood, but at the end of 1997, SLP was able to snag the last few Corvette-specific LT4 V-8's off the line before they were dropped in favor of the new LS1. No more than 30 of these cars ever made it to the street and those that did would blast to 60 mph 5.2 sec and thunder down the quarter-mile in 13.7 sec at 102.6 mph
5) 1998 Pontiac Firebird Firehawk 1998 Saw a new face for the venerable Firebird, as well as a new LS1 engine under the hood. The tuners at SLP weren't far behind with their own car, though controversy surrounded the existence of the car and as such, as few as six cars were rumored to have been made. SLP quickly ditched the awkward fixed headlights in favor of the stock pop-ups in 1999, but a few of these '98 cars snuck out and we got our hands on one long enough to run to 60 mph in 5.1 sec and down the quarter-mile in 13.6 sec at 104.5 mph.
4) 2000 Pontiac Firebird Trans Am WS6 The Trans Am was typically the hopped-up model in the Firebird line and the Y2K model was no exception. Outfitted with the WS6 performance and handling package, the Trans Am blasted past 60 mph in five sec flat and through the quarter-mile13.5 sec at 107.4 mph
3) 2005 Pontiac GTO The GTO was updated for 2005 with some non-functional hood scoops and a bigger LS2 V-8 packing 400 hp, and we immediately took it back to the track to do battle with the Dodge Charger SRT8. With a massive Chevy V-8 heartbeat, the updated Goat blasted to 60 mph in only 4.74 sec and blew through the quarter-mile in 13.34 sec at 105.86 mph. Though fun while it lasted, this would turn out to be our last test of the new GTO, as the badge went back to sleep after the 2006 model year
2) 2009 Pontiac G8 GXP Our grief over the second death of the GTO was short-lived, though, as its spiritual successor would arrive just two years later in the form of the Pontiac G8. Again based on the Holden Commodore, the G8 delivered in both the performance and styling departments, more than making up for the damage done the GTO name. A year later, Pontiac rolled out its heavy-hitter, the mighty GXP. Behind the wheel of this bad boy, we roared to 60 mph in 4.5 sec and flew past the quarter-mile mark in 13 sec flat at 108.5 mph. That blistering speed was more than enough to make this car the fastest factory-stock Pontiac we've ever tested, but not quite the fastest overall.
1) 2004 Lingenfelter Pontiac GTO It's worth noting that fastest Pontiac we've ever tested wasn't even the fastest available at the time. In fact, the hopped-up 2004 GTO we got from Lingenfelter Performance Engineering was the base model with "only" 100 hp more than the stock configuration. Two other, more-powerful packages were also offered, but it didn't matter. The ability to hit 60 mph in a measly 4.37 sec and run the quarter-mile in 12.65 sec at 113.7 mph makes this special edition GTO easily the fastest Pontiac we've ever had the honor of testing.
Honorable Mention: 1967 Pontiac GTO The car credited with starting the muscle car phenomenon was in fine form by 1967. We managed to get our greedy hands on not one, but two Goats outfitted with the Bobcat performance package, a manual transmission model and an automatic. Run side by side, the manual was, predictably, faster than the slushbox. The stick-shifted Goat needed just 4.9 secs to hit 60 mph and only 14.21 sec to run the quarter, doing it at 103 mph
[This message has been edited by CoolBlue87GT (edited 05-22-2014).]
There were some others that could be on the list like the 74 455SD and a 68 Ram Air II Firebird. These cars would do 13's all day from the factory but they were low production.
My guess is the 1989 Turbo Trans-Am that used the Buick GNX motor.
That was my 2nd guess but it looks like it didn't even make the list. Ask the same question in '89 and it would have been true, probably fastest production American made car that year actually. I'd love to get my hands on one of those GTA Turbo Trans Am's those things were my dream car in junior high.
I think it's a little difficult to compare "old iron" to the newer cars for many reasons, one of them being technology has improved. Better engine management/computers, better tires, better suspension, lighter engines/bodies, etc., etc.
The thing you have to remember is that there were some awesome engines in the early days, that didn't require many changes to be remarkably fast, and they were extremely durable. While not "Production" I've spent quite about of time around Pontiac Vintage racing and it's awesome to watch some of these old heavy cars tear up the track. Just one example without searching though a lot of video's:
This list saddens me not only in that Pontiac no longer exists...but that so many of the cars on this list were not even "real" Pontiacs, like the GTO or G8 or powered by Pontiac motors, instead of the Chevy small blocks.
This list saddens me not only in that Pontiac no longer exists...but that so many of the cars on this list were not even "real" Pontiacs, like the GTO or G8 or powered by Pontiac motors, instead of the Chevy small blocks.
The truth is in stock form most of the cars in the 60's and 70's were not as fast as many people like to remember them.
Yes they could be modified to go fast easy but most were 14 and 15 second cars and no it was not always the lack of good tires.
Many also forget the change from Gross HP to Net HP. That really drops the numbers. Today the Net HP is up where the Gross HP was and even more. That is what is so impressive on the new cars today.
I think it's a little difficult to compare "old iron" to the newer cars for many reasons, one of them being technology has improved. Better engine management/computers, better tires, better suspension, lighter engines/bodies, etc., etc.
The thing you have to remember is that there were some awesome engines in the early days, that didn't require many changes to be remarkably fast, and they were extremely durable. While not "Production" I've spent quite about of time around Pontiac Vintage racing and it's awesome to watch some of these old heavy cars tear up the track. Just one example without searching though a lot of video's:
I too have friends who race vintage Pontiac's. It takes so little to get a 15 second car into the 13's.
But most at these vintage races are far from stock. I have seen so many claimed 389 engines be found to be a 421 etc.
But it is still something to see a early Cat with AC and all the options pull the left front tire off the ground and run a 12 second run. My buddies 68 Bird looks stock other than the wheels and he can hit 11's all day and put both front tires up in the air. He beat the Tiger GTO a couple years ago in the challenge. No tubs etc.
The torque is the fun part of a Pontiac that most post 79 owners never got to feel. Generally that is what slows a Pontiac down as it is hard to hook em up after you get into the 12 second range till you improve the suspension to take it.
This list saddens me not only in that Pontiac no longer exists...but that so many of the cars on this list were not even "real" Pontiacs, like the GTO or G8 or powered by Pontiac motors, instead of the Chevy small blocks.
They're just as "real" as the Pontiacs were in the 60s. Just because the engine had the Pontiac stamp on it, doesn't mean the rest of the car wasn't just as much of clone as the late model re-bodies are. Everyone likes to say how the new GTO/G8 aren't "real" Pontiacs, as they quickly forget that the A-body was a shared platform across Chevy, Pontiac, Buick, and Oldsmobile.
Back in 1974 some Pontiac engineers brought a 74 SD455 Trans Am with a 2.41 rear axle ratio to the Cannon Ball Run that year. While the quarter mile time was not that great, it had some serious top speed. My 72 455 HO Trans Am was impounded back in the day for speeds "in excess of 140 mph". That was with a 3.08 rear gear........
Maybe everyone should first agree on the definitions of "Quick" And "Fast".
I would use quarter mile times to define how quick a car is.
I would use top speed to define how fast a car is.
Others might use the terms differently, though I'm not sure why.
Kevin
True that people confuse issues related to these "terms". I look at a car as an overall package, reason being that a fast car can be turned into a quick car or vise-versa, by changing axle ratio's / gear ratio's. The main stay is that the Engineering originally in the product has the ability to greatly exceed production numbers related to performance, without greatly sacrificing durability.
Originally posted by Lambo nut: Maybe everyone should first agree on the definitions of "Quick" And "Fast".
Perhaps because they are synonyms, and mean the same thing.
Of course, also only looking at 1/4 mile times and top speed, leaves out several other measurements which relate to how fast a car is. Slalom times, skid pad G force, and braking distance add to that.
But looking at the full spectrum of performance doesn't get as many readers of magazines or blogs, as just listing out the top speeds or lowest 1/4 mile times of 10 production cars. It's too bad too. It would be great to see some articles that had the top 10 production cars with a rating based on the full spectrum of performance measurements.
The GTO and G8 were very nice cars... but they are textbook examples of badge engineering. There is nothing Pontiac about either of them other than the badge.
And outside of Pennock's a 14 second car is a fast car. It seems only here that people look with derision of any car not running 12 seconds or faster. As many noted not too many cars ever left the factory running the 1/4 much faster than 14 seconds. Yeah old cars could be tweaked but so can modern cars.
The GTO and G8 were very nice cars... but they are textbook examples of badge engineering. There is nothing Pontiac about either of them other than the badge.
And outside of Pennock's a 14 second car is a fast car. It seems only here that people look with derision of any car not running 12 seconds or faster. As many noted not too many cars ever left the factory running the 1/4 much faster than 14 seconds. Yeah old cars could be tweaked but so can modern cars.
I agree with jscott 1 that most 60's muscle cars that everyone loves so much ran in the 14's. The tires of the day were horrible, slicks on many muscle cars would drop as much as a 1/2 second. I remember reading in Hot Rod or Car Craft that a 13 second street machine hot rod is a fun car to drive. A 2013 Accord coupe V6 6 speed runs 13.9 at 101, thats not bad, beats most everything except V8 Camros and Mustangs and a handful of V8 real expensive cars.
Originally posted by V8 Vega: A 2013 Accord coupe V6 6 speed runs 13.9 at 101, thats not bad, beats most everything except V8 Camros and Mustangs and a handful of V8 real expensive cars.
Eh? Numbers I see for that are 14.2, and the heavy V6 Camaro has the same 1/4 time. V6 Impala is right there as well. Then there's the MazdaSpeed3, Subaru Legacy GT and WRX, 2012 VW Golf R, Mitsubishi Lancer EVO, and Genesis Coupe 3.8.
Plenty of cars to choose from, especially given that if you're thinking about a new Accord V6 for performance, the starting price is about $30K, about the same as the 1SS Camaro starting price.
The last real Pontiac was the 88 4 cylinder Fiero.
It was built in Pontiac, Had a Pontiac engine and was not shared with any other division. Now that is a real Pontiac.
I used to think the old timers were an little off with not accepting the post 79 cars as real Pontiacs. I grew up with some of the old Kanafel Pontiac Racers here and have had access to many of my friends and my own Pontiacs over the years.
But now that I look back at the decline of Pontiac I can see that the real heart an soul of the Pontiac was the special engineering that went into the older cars and the V8 they used to have. You remove both of these you have a styling and marketing exercise on a Chevy or in some cases Holden.
If you really study the small details on the older cars you will find things that no other GM car got or shared. They lead in many technology areas. As time went on Pontiac engineering had surprises that pissed GM off like the 455 SD, The Fiero and even the Turbo V6 Pace car. But the special projects after the 80's got less and less as these engineers retired and GM put brand managers in from Nabisco.
The later cars were better than most of the Chevys in styling but they were left wanting for that little extra Pontiac used to give. Many who embrace these cars as the best of all time just never have spent the time with the older cars and really learned the details that set them apart.
I used to think that way but in hind sight I can now see what so many other already had.
I was thinking the SD Trans Am (73/74?) but most performance cars today will stomp 99.9% of the 60's and 70's muscle cars. The GTO's and G8 have to be at the top of the pack.
[This message has been edited by TK (edited 05-23-2014).]
Perhaps because they are synonyms, and mean the same thing.
Of course, also only looking at 1/4 mile times and top speed, leaves out several other measurements which relate to how fast a car is. Slalom times, skid pad G force, and braking distance add to that.
But looking at the full spectrum of performance doesn't get as many readers of magazines or blogs, as just listing out the top speeds or lowest 1/4 mile times of 10 production cars. It's too bad too. It would be great to see some articles that had the top 10 production cars with a rating based on the full spectrum of performance measurements.
You are putting too much thought into this. Question was which was the "fastest". That would be the one that is able to reach the highest top speed. Take a car capable of doing a 125 mph quarter mile but is maxed out at that speed due to gearing, tires etc, at the end of the quarter. Then take a Corvette or Veron capable of doing that speed AND MORE for quite a while. Which you going to pick if you needed to outrun the cops in a high speed chase? The 125 mph quarter car would be quick, but the faster speeds of the others two will prevail. That 125 mph quarter miler is not going to last long. Just because a car is quick, it does not make it fast, nor the other way around.
This post from another site sheds a little light on why this is a difficult question to answer, discussion was related to the GTO, but the basics hold the same for all vintage Pontiac's:
Quote:
Back in the 60's they didn't do flat out test for top speed and advertise it because of Insurance going through the roof any time the speed showed over 100 mph.
1969 RAIII 400 Hiden Pontiac Spec chart for GTO and Judge Performance figures (with 4 spd) Power 365.5 bhp / 272 KW @ 5100 rpm (366 advertised) Torque 603 Nm / 445 ft lbs @ 3600 rpm BHP/Liter 56 bhp / liter Power to weight 0.26 bhp / kg Top Speed 200 km/h / 124 mph 0-60 mph 6.5 s ((( Note posted RAIV listed Top Speed at 124 for insurance when it would do over 130 easy)))
1968 They did not post a good top speed in the GTO but did in the Firebird 400. GTO 112 mph
Firebird 400 RAII top speed 123.5 mph set to factory spec's on radial tires. 120 speedo
After 1978 people started posting what they could get there personal cars to in Magazines
Factory spec's of the 1968 car with Ram Air I could pass 112 mph but the tires couldn't hold up 68 Ram Air II could hold 123 mph again tires could not hold up.
In 1969 Ram Air V 303 set a course record of 1 mile pass at 146 mph with 2:73 posi on a 5 mile course. using air craft tires
in 1969 The Ram Air V was introduced in 1969. It was a special 400 block with newly designed high compression tunnel port heads and a special high rise intake manifold. A prototype GTO so equipped could go 0-60 mph in 5.2 seconds, and the quarter-mile time was 11.5 seconds at 123 mph (198 km/h). Ram Air Vs were not installed in GTOs at the factory; it was available only as an "over-the-counter" product, and most went to Pontiac racers of the time. Top speed set at off factory spec's , changing carb, ign, ad overdrive and using 2:55 posi rear with push start set record at 175 mph with the RAV using the 400 setup.
1969 Ram Air III factory setup with 3:23 rear end A/C car hit top speed in Nevada Dec 1968 138 mph starving out came back in for carb change to Holley 780 topped out at 148 mph before blowing up from running to lean and lose of oil pressure.
in 1970 a 1969 Judge Ram Air IV was clocked at 136 mph with 3:55 rear end posi with street tires
Some road test for short track posted this is 1/4 mile times and speed
1968 Pontiac GTO RA II 400 n/a 366@5400 450@3800 7.4 14.19@98 mph MCR 6/95
1968 Pontiac GTO Ram Air II 400 4.33 360@5400 445@3800 6.5 14.45@98.2mph MT 2/
1969 Pontiac GTO Judge RA IV 400 3.90 370@4600 445@3900 5.7 13.20@104mph MCR no date
1969 Pontiac GTO Judge RA IV 400 3.55 370@4600 445@3900 6.2 14.45@97.8mph Car Life 3/69
1969 Pontiac GTO Judge RA IV 400 3.90 370@5500 445@3900 6.6 13.90@101.50mph MCR 6/95
1969 Pontiac GTO RA III 400 n/a 366@5100 445@3600 7.4 14.10@98.2mph MCR 6/95
motor trend and Hot Rod Notes 1968 Hot Rod tested a four-speed GTO equipped with the standard engine and obtained a quarter mile reading of 14.7 seconds at 97 mph (156 km/h) in pure stock form. Motor Trend clocked a four-speed Ram Air with 4.33 rear differential at 14.45 seconds at 98.2 mph (158.0 km/h) and a standard GTO with Turbo-Hydramatic and a 3.23 rear axle ratio at 15.93 seconds at 88.3 mph
I found this listing for Pontiac times. However, it did not list the 71 Trans Am. I owned one back in that era, but it was too fast for me. The only car I ever totaled! Sheesh, what was I thinking? 0-60 in 5.9 seconds. I/4 mile- 13.9 at 103 m.p.h. The 72's were a little quicker at 5.4 to 60 and 13.4@ 104 m.p.h. How about that Solstice coupe? 5.1 to 60 and 13.5 1/4 mile! http://www.zeroto60times.co...-0-60-mph-Times.html
You are putting too much thought into this. Question was which was the "fastest". That would be the one that is able to reach the highest top speed. Take a car capable of doing a 125 mph quarter mile but is maxed out at that speed due to gearing, tires etc, at the end of the quarter. Then take a Corvette or Veron capable of doing that speed AND MORE for quite a while. Which you going to pick if you needed to outrun the cops in a high speed chase? The 125 mph quarter car would be quick, but the faster speeds of the others two will prevail. That 125 mph quarter miler is not going to last long. Just because a car is quick, it does not make it fast, nor the other way around.
Kevin
I think you're the one putting too much thought into it.
A car capable of doing 125 MPH in the quarter mile is maxed out at that speed, because of distance, not because of gearing. A brand new Vette is going to be nowhere near its max speed in the 1/4 mile, and won't even be halfway through the gears (3rd out of 7). Top speed is 99% gearing and aerodynamics. If the aerodynamics and gearing let you go a certain speed, you don't need much power to get there once you're past the initial movement barrier. All you need is distance. Heck, given enough distance, and assuming the aerodynamics are good for it, my Honda del Sol can do 170 MPH.
Anyway, definition of "quick" is "having rapid movement" and the definition of "fast" is "able to move quickly." So yeah. That is why people use both terms interchangeably. Because they are.
Really, they are not synonyms. Quick refers to acceleration. Fast refers to velocity.
Bob
Really, they are synonyms. Go look in any dictionary/thesaurus.
And in my 30+ years of drag racing experience, I have used, and seen them both used, countless times, as such, in reference to the performance of pure bred race cars.
For example, the Quick 16 being a tournament of the 16 fastest cars at the track that day.
Also, almost nobody cares about actual top speed numbers, except to brag in the event they own an Enzo or something. There are very few places in the world where you can legally and safely drive a street car at such speeds. And yes, even in magazine articles, "fastest" is used interchangeably to reference quarter-mile times, 0-60 times, and top speed.
I think you're the one putting too much thought into it.
A car capable of doing 125 MPH in the quarter mile is maxed out at that speed, because of distance, not because of gearing. A brand new Vette is going to be nowhere near its max speed in the 1/4 mile, and won't even be halfway through the gears (3rd out of 7). Top speed is 99% gearing and aerodynamics. If the aerodynamics and gearing let you go a certain speed, you don't need much power to get there once you're past the initial movement barrier. All you need is distance. Heck, given enough distance, and assuming the aerodynamics are good for it, my Honda del Sol can do 170 MPH.
Anyway, definition of "quick" is "having rapid movement" and the definition of "fast" is "able to move quickly." So yeah. That is why people use both terms interchangeably. Because they are.
No, I realize fastest is the one able to reach the highest top speed. You started with quick and fast are the same thing crap and I tried to explain the difference to you. Bonneville salt flat cars are very fast, but are geared in a way that they are not quick. You probably don't understand that either. He didn't ask which car was the best performing just which one was the FASTEST. If you want to continue being a hard headed dick, go right ahead.
My guess is the 1989 Turbo Trans-Am that used the Buick GNX motor.
I was never able to figure that out...the Buick was plain bad azz fast. Me and a friend both had Turbo Firebird TAs. mine was a Pace Car. They were both dogs. My stock old 318 auto Challenger was faster. Putting a turbo in one dont automaticly make it fast. Why the GN was fast and the TA was not was weird.
I had a 89 formula firehawk and well I can say that is for sure the fastest and fun damn car I owned. It would do a buck sixty easy out on a long road and had lots more in it yet. SLP really had that car figured out that year. the Ws6 suspension seemed to really help it over the stock Camaro I had at the time too My only complaint I had was the rear wing seemed to never like to keep it's clear coat. other than that it was a great car. As ex wives do she made me sell it for a more family friendly car Ex wife that is...
I was never able to figure that out...the Buick was plain bad azz fast. Me and a friend both had Turbo Firebird TAs. mine was a Pace Car. They were both dogs. My stock old 318 auto Challenger was faster. Putting a turbo in one dont automaticly make it fast. Why the GN was fast and the TA was not was weird.
Yea, I cant figure that one out.The GN was the fastest American made car for a few years running.
[This message has been edited by davylong86 (edited 05-25-2014).]
those things were my dream car in junior high.
