As I begin work on my how-to guide for recovering a GT wheel in new leather, I have been giving another idea some consideration. Is there anybody who would be interested in me recovering their wheel for them? While the cost of materials ($35 just for the required leather) initially turned me off to the idea of recovering wheels for others, I found an upholstery retailer less than an hour away that sells leather in bulk for a fraction of what I have been paying.
I will still be putting up the guide this weekend for all those do-it-yourselfers out there, but I am now open to the idea of recovering a wheel for others. I figured I would gauge interest before moving forward with purchasing materials.
Here are some pictures of my first wheel, done in black leather with euro-style stitching: Front Back Euro-stitch
------------------ "The Twins" '87 GT 3.4 pushrod daily driver '88 GT 3.4 DOHC swap in progress
I figured I would gauge interest before moving forward with purchasing materials.
Don't base your decision simply on expressed interest, as it's been demonstrated here more than once that people often have trouble actually paying for a service after initially stating that they were gung-ho.
I just don't want to see you get burned.
The job you did on your steering wheel looks great.
[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 12-19-2014).]
Don't base your decision simply on expressed interest, as it's been demonstrated here more than once that people often have trouble actually paying for a service after initially stating that they were gung-ho.
I just don't want to see you get burned.
The job you did on your steering wheel looks great.
Yeah the best way to gauge interest is to collect the money up front. That puts the burden on you to actually deliver though.
Given the time involved and cost of materials, my estimate on price would be $100-$125. The price would also depend on the cost of shipping the wheel back to the buyer (You will be responsible for shipping the wheel to me).
Given the cost of the bulk leather, I would need to do two wheels in order to break even, but I would only move forward if I had 4 confirmed buyers. I'm fairly sure that there is at least four members here on the forum in need of a steering wheel recover. For this first batch of wheels, I would be only be doing black leather, and you would have a choice between the euro-style pictured here, or the baseball stitch (seen on the back of the spokes in the pictures).
------------------ "The Twins" '87 GT 3.4 pushrod daily driver '88 GT 3.4 DOHC swap in progress
[This message has been edited by Irrationable (edited 12-20-2014).]
I would certainly be interested. I have one that needs to be done. However, with the limitation being that the first set is black I wouldn't be in your first set. If I could offer a suggestion. If I were to embark on this endeavor I would buy a few color lots. They would consist of black, grey, tan, and beechwood color lots. I know that means you would have to expand your payback window to eight steering wheels but it would also expand your pool of candidates. I would gladly pay $100 for a wheel to be recovered seeing as Dallas Steering Wheel charges a multiple of that amount. If you do decide to expand I have at least two to have done, one dark grey factory color and one beechwood factory color.
Another thing you might want to consider, is that Dallas offers the option of thicker padding under the leather (or an additional layer, or something) which results in a thicker, more contemporary-looking wheel. You'll probably want to offer that too.
I would certainly be interested. I have one that needs to be done. However, with the limitation being that the first set is black I wouldn't be in your first set. If I could offer a suggestion. If I were to embark on this endeavor I would buy a few color lots. They would consist of black, grey, tan, and beechwood color lots. I know that means you would have to expand your payback window to eight steering wheels but it would also expand your pool of candidates. I would gladly pay $100 for a wheel to be recovered seeing as Dallas Steering Wheel charges a multiple of that amount. If you do decide to expand I have at least two to have done, one dark grey factory color and one beechwood factory color.
This is the kind of feedback I was looking for by starting this thread! I realized that color would be another hurdle in doing wheels for others. Given that the seats in my car are done in black, as well as having a black dash and carpets, the black wheel made the most sense for me. However, I know that many of you would likely want to stick with the factory grey/tan/beechwood.
As of right now, doing a wheel in factory colors would require me to purchase the leather from Mr Mikes by the square foot, as my wholesale source likely wouldn't carry an EXACT match. This is not a huge issue, but would require me to charge around $25 more per wheel due to the increase in material cost. Additionally, leather orders from Mr Mike take around 2 weeks to arrive, which would drastically increase the time it would take me to get your wheel back to you. Another option would be for you to buy the leather from Mike yourself, then send it in to me with your wheel (for which I could offer a discount as I would not have to supply the leather)
------------------ "The Twins" '87 GT 3.4 pushrod daily driver '88 GT 3.4 DOHC swap in progress
Another thing you might want to consider, is that Dallas offers the option of thicker padding under the leather (or an additional layer, or something) which results in a thicker, more contemporary-looking wheel. You'll probably want to offer that too.
I initially considered offering thicker padding, but it would require me to alter the template dimensions that I currently have. Since this would require some trial and error (and likely result in some wasted materials), I'm opting to focus on restoring wheels to factory specs, as I have this method down to an exact science.
------------------ "The Twins" '87 GT 3.4 pushrod daily driver '88 GT 3.4 DOHC swap in progress
Hmmm. Some of my Fieros had thin wheels, others had thicker wheels. All were stock. Maybe later years had thicker wheels? My '88 GT & '86 SE had thick wheels, but the '85 had a thin wheel.
There may be a thickness difference between years, but I was fairly certain that all the three spoke wheels had the same thickness and diameter. I know that some of the earlier years had three spoke GT-style wheels in which the leather only covered an inch or so of the spokes of the wheel.
------------------ "The Twins" '87 GT 3.4 pushrod daily driver '88 GT 3.4 DOHC swap in progress
When I first saw your original post about doing a tutorial on how to recover a wheel I was very skeptical and I thought there is no way this is going to end well. But I have to say I have to eat my words, that looks awesome! Very nice job! I think you will have a lot of takers at the $100-125 price range even if there is an up charge for material from Mr Mike. I thought I read somewhere about someone using material from Mr Mike for something before and they said it was thicker and more difficult to work with though, so I don't know if that would be an issue or how thick the stuff you are using is.
I would be a customer, at some point in the future for sure! I have a few other big expenses to cover first. I'm not 100% sure what color I'd want, my car has tan interior but it's got a black wheel in it now and it looks decent, but I may want to go back to factory tan.
[This message has been edited by zmcdonal (edited 12-19-2014).]
I thought I read somewhere about someone using material from Mr Mike for something before and they said it was thicker and more difficult to work with though, so I don't know if that would be an issue or how thick the stuff you are using is.
The leather pictured above is actually from Mr Mike's. I wanted the grain and color of my wheel to match the material that was used on my seats, so I opted to order my leather from him. The leather was pretty heavy, but that actually worked well for the steering wheel, as I didn't have to worry about the leather tearing as I pulled the stitching tight.
The shop that I would be buying bulk leather from will match the weight and grain of any sample that you bring to them. I was planning on bringing them a scrap of leftover leather from Mike's since it worked so well on this wheel.
------------------ "The Twins" '87 GT 3.4 pushrod daily driver '88 GT 3.4 DOHC swap in progress
I don't care about the manual. If I had a wheel I would want you to do it. That looks great! I think $35 for good leather is nothing. But some people here are cheap.
I agree that $35 for leather from Mike is perfectly reasonable. I've already covered one wheel with it, and will be covering a second one for myself in it within the next few days.
As I stated before, the big issue with Mike's leather is the time that it takes to receive the leather after placing an order. I would hate to keep customers waiting additional time because I hadn't received the leather yet. By purchasing the leather in bulk from a local supplier, I can eliminate this additional wait time.
As far as cost is concerned, I'd like to keep my price affordable while still maintaining a profit margin that makes it worth my time. If buying the same quality leather in bulk locally allows me to shave 20-30 bucks off the price of each wheel, I can offer the wheels that much cheaper.
------------------ "The Twins" '87 GT 3.4 pushrod daily driver '88 GT 3.4 DOHC swap in progress
I have decided to pull the trigger on my wheel recovery service. Given that I have two more wheels of my own in need of recovery, I went ahead and bought an order of bulk leather. I ordered a half-hide of black leather that matches the leather pictured above from Mr Mike, but it won't be in for at least a week. Once I have the leather in hand and can verify that it is what I wanted, I will begin accepting orders.
Until then, I will be working on getting my how-to guide posted, as well as prepping a second wheel for recovery for myself.
------------------ "The Twins" '87 GT 3.4 pushrod daily driver '88 GT 3.4 DOHC swap in progress
Are you familiar with the early 3 spoke SE wheel, that looks like a vinyl GT wheel? Would it be possible to leave the vinyl in place, as padding, and just cover everything in leather? Seems like that might allow for a thicker cross-section.
Edit - I missed this post. DOH!
quote
Originally posted by Irrationable:
There may be a thickness difference between years, but I was fairly certain that all the three spoke wheels had the same thickness and diameter. I know that some of the earlier years had three spoke GT-style wheels in which the leather only covered an inch or so of the spokes of the wheel.
...except that my wheel is covered in vinyl. I'm not sure that there was ever a leather covered version of this wheel. Would you have to strip that wheel? Or can you use the vinyl as a "base"? Or can you even do those wheels?
Thanks for looking. Nice work! ------------------ Raydar 88 Formula IMSA Fastback. 4.9, NVG T550 Praise the Lowered!
[This message has been edited by Raydar (edited 12-20-2014).]
However, I know that many of you would likely want to stick with the factory grey/tan/beechwood.
As of right now, doing a wheel in factory colors would require me to purchase the leather from Mr Mikes by the square foot, as my wholesale source likely wouldn't carry an EXACT match. Another option would be for you to buy the leather from Mike yourself, then send it in to me with your wheel ...
I think eventually you'll need to determine the correct match for the factory colors directly from your wholesale source. Not everyone wants leather seats (thus eliminating the need to match them) but would appreciate a nice recovered wheel anyway.
Very nicely done. I attempted to do that some years ago and applaud your offer and ambition to do this for others. I'd be interested in knowing what material you used for padding under the leather. Mine needs to be redone again, I'd like to use a better quality leather and padding this time. My attempt, https://www.fiero.nl/forum/A...120111-1-083591.html
Very nicely done. I attempted to do that some years ago and applaud your offer and ambition to do this for others. I'd be interested in knowing what material you used for padding under the leather. Mine needs to be redone again, I'd like to use a better quality leather and padding this time. My attempt, https://www.fiero.nl/forum/A...120111-1-083591.html
Wow. When was first researching how to recover a wheel, your thread was the only one here on the forum detailing an attempt to recover a wheel. I actually followed your lead and used a thin dense black felt as padding. I'm using a 1mm thick automotive grade leather that has been treated to be UV resistant.
------------------ "The Twins" '87 GT 3.4 pushrod daily driver '88 GT 3.4 DOHC swap in progress
The four-spoke wheels (both the kind shown above and the paddle-horn style) were never offered wrapped in leather. My method for recovering the GT wheels involves using the old leather as a template to cut new leather that is a perfect match for the wheel. While I'm sure these style of wheels could be covered in leather, it would require quite a bit of trial and error to get right as I wouldn't have a reference to use as a template. Given that I have no experience with this kind of wheel, or with creating the leather wrap without any kind of reference, I would not feel comfortable offering to recover this kind of wheel, as I could not guarantee the same quality of results.
------------------ "The Twins" '87 GT 3.4 pushrod daily driver '88 GT 3.4 DOHC swap in progress
Are you familiar with the early 3 spoke SE wheel, that looks like a vinyl GT wheel? Would it be possible to leave the vinyl in place, as padding, and just cover everything in leather? Seems like that might allow for a thicker cross-section.
...except that my wheel is covered in vinyl. I'm not sure that there was ever a leather covered version of this wheel. Would you have to strip that wheel? Or can you use the vinyl as a "base"? Or can you even do those wheels?
Thanks for looking. Nice work!
I've did a little research on the different steering wheels that were available on the various years of fieros. The three spoke wheel has two variations. The 84-85 version was wrapped in a single piece of vinyl, with the seam and stitching located on the bottom of the wheel on the face of the bottom spoke. The redesigned three spoke wheel offered from 86 to 88 was wrapped in two pieces of leather with seams at the 10 and 2 o'clock positions. The 86-88 version was also given thumb notches for comfort.
The 84-85 style wheel that you asked about could be recovered by stripping the old vinyl and using it as a template, but I wouldn't recommend using the old vinyl as a base. The smooth surface of the vinyl would likely cause the leather to slip and twist, ruining the wheel. When I recover a wheel, I use an adhesive to glue felt padding to the core of the wheel, the wrap the new leather over the felt padding. I rely on the friction between the felt and the leather, as well as the tightness of the leather on the wheel to keep the new leather from twisting. By not using adhesive between the leather and the padding, I ensure that no glue oozes out of the wheel once its sewn up.
I suppose the leather could be glued to the vinyl to keep it from twisting, but I'm not sure if this could lead to oozing later on.
------------------ "The Twins" '87 GT 3.4 pushrod daily driver '88 GT 3.4 DOHC swap in progress
No problem. I wasn't trying to be discouraging, I just don't want to make any promises to anybody that I can't keep. If given more time and a four-spoke wheel to tinker with, I could probably figure something out (as I know Dallas Custom has done them in the past).
------------------ "The Twins" '87 GT 3.4 pushrod daily driver '88 GT 3.4 DOHC swap in progress
If you are just breaking even with the $100~$125 range, after paying for a wheel of material...... I will suggest something that may not go over so well with some, a price increase Seriously, I think $150 for the wheel recovered in leather, and returned to the user is a very fair price. It is half of what Dallas charges I believe. This way you are at least making a profit, and can afford to more easily purchase supplies and such. If not $150, then at least go with your original top price of $125. The bottom line is your time and effort are not free, nor is how sore your hands are going to be from doing all these steering wheels.
As for finding the leather in the correct colors, Mr. Mike is AMAZING, and I HIGHLY recommend him. That said, I seriously doubt that he is tanning the leather to the correct colors, and is purchasing it from somewhere. I had Mr. Mike do my seats in black and a bright blue. When I went to have my door panels upholstered, I took the local upholsterer a sample of the blue from Mr. Mike, and in the literally PILES of sample books he had, he was able to match it exactly.
Search around, and maybe send a few samples of the beechwood and the gray from the Fiero to a few suppliers, and ask if they can match the color for you from their inventory, or from their suppliers. It has to be out there somewhere if Mr. Mike is getting it.
Ahem..... With all due respect, sir.... You are a total and complete bastard for not offering this service a week ago! I just wore out my hands , made a mess of my garage AND my kitchen, got goo all over the place and ,although my wife doesn't know it yet, used up half of the miss' nail polish remover (of which i have yet to get in trouble for). I would've GLADLY paid $150 for your service! I'm not sure about the leather (cleaned and reused original), and my choice of padding (foam rubber pipe insulation wrap), so i may be hitting you up in a year. Thanks for the info and very nice work sir! Ron
I rely on the friction between the felt and the leather, as well as the tightness of the leather on the wheel to keep the new leather from twisting. By not using adhesive between the leather and the padding, I ensure that no glue oozes out of the wheel once its sewn up.
I suppose the leather could be glued to the vinyl to keep it from twisting, but I'm not sure if this could lead to oozing later on.
If I decide one day to redo my wheel, I'd make sure to glue the padding to the wheel and the leather to the padding, at least 3/4 of the way around the circumference. That would leave a little stretch room. I stretched the leather around the wheel tightly w/o gluing and now it feels loose. The leather I used was a cheap piece, not quality stuff that you used and it's a little thinner. That might be why it loosened up also. I would also use a different padding now. A closed cell foam that won't bottom out called Poron. 1/8" or 3/16" thick.
I thought the ooze was a combination of the old glue and rubber padding melting together in the heat. I don't think a contact cement would do that with vinyl.
Originally posted by Irrationable: .... The 84-85 style wheel that you asked about could be recovered by stripping the old vinyl and using it as a template, but I wouldn't recommend using the old vinyl as a base. The smooth surface of the vinyl would likely cause the leather to slip and twist, ruining the wheel. When I recover a wheel, I use an adhesive to glue felt padding to the core of the wheel, the wrap the new leather over the felt padding. I rely on the friction between the felt and the leather, as well as the tightness of the leather on the wheel to keep the new leather from twisting. By not using adhesive between the leather and the padding, I ensure that no glue oozes out of the wheel once its sewn up.
I suppose the leather could be glued to the vinyl to keep it from twisting, but I'm not sure if this could lead to oozing later on.
Thanks for your response. The wheel that I have appears to be molded. The "stitching" is actually just molded in, like the stitching in the faux leather on most GM interiors. But if you're using the old covers as a pattern, I can see how this might be unworkable.
Thanks! Nice work.
[This message has been edited by Raydar (edited 12-21-2014).]
If you are just breaking even with the $100~$125 range, after paying for a wheel of material...... I will suggest something that may not go over so well with some, a price increase Seriously, I think $150 for the wheel recovered in leather, and returned to the user is a very fair price. It is half of what Dallas charges I believe. This way you are at least making a profit, and can afford to more easily purchase supplies and such. If not $150, then at least go with your original top price of $125. The bottom line is your time and effort are not free, nor is how sore your hands are going to be from doing all these steering wheels.
After some deliberation I have to say that as unpopular as your suggestion may be, I have to agree with you. I began working on another wheel for myself today, and I realize how much time it takes to even prep a wheel for new leather (scraping wheel goo is a ***** ). After taking this into consideration and looking around online to see what other places were charging for a recovery job, I realize that a price bump is needed to make it worth the effort that I will be putting into it. I have finally settled on a price of $150 to recover a wheel using bulk leather (no cost for shipping the wheel back, the shipping cost is included in this price)
I feel like this is a far price given the work involved. When I decided to offer this service, it was not my intention to turn this into a full-fledged operation such as what Fieroguru offers with his brake upgrade packages. My intention was to recover a few wheels for those that didn't have the time or skill to do so, and to make some money on the side to fund my own fiero restoration project. This is the reason that I haven't gone out and purchased a variety of leather colors or offered to increase wheel diameters.
All I ask is that all of you realize that the service that I am proposing consists of a single college student and his mom's sewing machine
------------------ "The Twins" '87 GT 3.4 pushrod daily driver '88 GT 3.4 DOHC swap in progress
Oh, and for those of you waiting on my how-to guide, I apologize for the wait. I took a number of pictures today and will do my absolute best to have the guide up tomorrow after I get off work.
Happy holidays to you all!
------------------ "The Twins" '87 GT 3.4 pushrod daily driver '88 GT 3.4 DOHC swap in progress
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