you must only be on PFF. there are many reviews on facebook fiero group and you tube as well. Theres one link. just google it and many will come up. THERE AMAZING
Honestly i am a little hesitant because I have such mixed feelings. There was such a build up the to the final delivery, that the final product was less than expected I think. The curved line around the trunk lock was covered in the video, but there are more such revelations from inside the lens along the tops..
Also the color is charcoal grey with a tinge of brown. Not black.
When I received my lenses I didn't look really closely at them because I was so excited. I took them to a club meeting for show and tell, there the guys really knit picked them apart. The masking around the edges on the black to clear has blemishes, The inside of the lens in the clear area has what appears to be a sag in the plastic shaped like a horseshoe about the same size. The sag isn't really visible when its viewed straight on, only at an angle when its help up to the light at an angle.
Also the letters have white in the ends of he masked letters. Not sure if it's leftover tape or what.
Over all I'm just glad to have them because my OEM ones are pretty far gone, but, for the price i guess I was just expecting a little more. I can live with the curved line and color but the masking just leaves me a little grated is all.
Edit; mine are serial number 11. I assume the process got better along the way for others.
[This message has been edited by hercimer01 (edited 12-06-2019).]
I was at the meeting as well for the showing of these lenses. I am on the list to get a pair but at this point I might hold off as I would like to see some of these concerns addressed with the later run. Is there anyone else that can look at these details on there lenses and put up some photos to see how they compare. I am OK with the color but the masking tape is an issue to me.
Yes. We had him on the phone to present the lenses at our club meeting. People we asked about these things and got no direct answer. From the feed back in PMs and when I had him on the phone it appears the customer support may be questionable. He can address these concerns here if he feels so inclined.
No one has come up with any replacement lens worth buying and the only option for all those delam lenses was a sub-standard exterior repaint IF there are no cracks and this is the thanks the guy gets?
C'mon folks, have a little love for what an awesome option available on a replacement lens being offered at a price that is far less than uber rare NOS ones.
Besides, not many people will ever notice these very minor issues and certainly not above 5 mph. But they will see delam from 500 feet away and at 50 mph.
They are definitely worthy. They just need some things addressed. 450.00 demands a bit of superb quality.
That one is complete up to the person paying the 450 now isn't it. To some they should be perfect for that price others see it as a deal since if you can find a NOS set they were running almost $1,000.
That one is complete up to the person paying the 450 now isn't it. To some they should be perfect for that price others see it as a deal since if you can find a NOS set they were running almost $1,000.
Yes I have actually, and recieved them. I did purchase an undecorated set as they are going on a car with a modified license plate position and I did not want the PONTIAC on them. I uderstand the concern with the issues, how ever my point is still the quality demanded for the price depends on the person paying. You are not happy with the quality for the price, which is your choice. Others are very happy with the price, which is thier choice.
I saw Keith Goodyears tail light lenses at Carlilse last year and they looked pretty good but I'll agree that for $450/set the pictures that you show are of a set that needs slight refining to look original. Keith has come a long way and made a significant investment. I'm sure that he will get it right.
------------------ " THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Spintech/Hedman Exhaust, P-log Manifold, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, Champion Radiator, S10 Brake Booster, HP Tuners VCM Suite. "THE COLUSSUS" 87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H " ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "
I did. They look flippin' amazing and the were worth EVERY PENNY.
I challenge you sticklers to find anything, especially in the automotive world that is 100% """flawless""" to the n'th degree of examination being displayed here. These pictures were taken mere inches away from the lens and are not visible without being so. FWIW, brand new factory parts have a certain amount of tolerable "flaws" allowed, even more-so aftermarket. These are GM certified reproduction tail lights. They are made with a completely different manufacturing process that completely eliminates delamination of lenses that plagued the original bonded plastic design.
Buy up any aftermarket reproduction part, (fenders and other body parts come to mind instantly) and it ain't gonna be anywhere near perfect... I worked in a car dealer for a long time, installed many components, both factory and aftermarket that had WAY more major flaws than what was pointed out and is being made into a bigger deal than it should be honestly.
Some people like yourself are just sticklers I suppose. If you don't like em, sell em to someone else for what you think they're worth. I could use a spare set at a discount. LMAO.
------------------ "Discord" Red 1988 GT under restoration!
I did. They look flippin' amazing and the were worth EVERY PENNY.
I challenge you sticklers to find anything, especially in the automotive world that is 100% """flawless""" to the n'th degree of examination being displayed here. These pictures were taken mere inches away from the lens and are not visible without being so. FWIW, brand new factory parts have a certain amount of tolerable "flaws" allowed, even more-so aftermarket. These are GM certified reproduction tail lights. They are made with a completely different manufacturing process that completely eliminates delamination of lenses that plagued the original bonded plastic design.
Buy up any aftermarket reproduction part, (fenders and other body parts come to mind instantly) and it ain't gonna be anywhere near perfect... I worked in a car dealer for a long time, installed many components, both factory and aftermarket that had WAY more major flaws than what was pointed out and is being made into a bigger deal than it should be honestly.
Some people like yourself are just sticklers I suppose. If you don't like em, sell em to someone else for what you think they're worth. I could use a spare set at a discount. LMAO.
Yep
Life is not perfect and neither are repop parts. Reproduction parts are out there to fill a much desired void.
[This message has been edited by Thunderstruck GT (edited 12-08-2019).]
Why are those lines around the lock area? I haven’t seen that on some of the prototypes. That would drive me nuts. You might have just got an odd ball set
[This message has been edited by jjd2296 (edited 12-09-2019).]
I don't think it can be done better, especially now that the tooling process is over and a large order is placed.. highly exclusive reproductions and rare parts, $450 is incredibly well priced in my opinion.
Nightshade the lenses and install bright LEDs might help.
I'm surprised anyone took on this endeavor, the community is extremely poor compared other niche car clubs.. I just hope he makes his money back and can offer some more products. I'm really impressed with the pics you guys have shown.. very impressed really. I wish the lettering was that nice on the NOS set I paid much more for. The lettering was bulged in a few spots on them.
Originally posted by Steel: I wish the lettering was that nice on the NOS set I paid much more for. The lettering was bulged in a few spots on them.
Those don't sound like a OEM NOS set, but the Fiero Store repros (especially if you just got the outer lens, I am not sure GM ever sold just the outer lens). This was a known issue with some of the Fiero Store lens. I have a set of OEM NOS sitting on the shelf and there are no issues with the bulging letters.
For the price, I think these are a perfectly fine alternative considering the ones you can buy from the competition. lol
Granted the masking issue would bother me, but no one else has made mention of this so maybe a 1 off or no one looked that close at them before and is not really that noticable. To those that nick picked them, what are the alternatives within the same price range?
I can emphasize with the OP on a few aspects. For one, the curved lines around the lock made my heart skip a beat due to thinking it was cracked/delaminated. Obviously, it's part of the manufacturing process and a change from the originals and I don't care other than it can be seen from the outside - I still wish that could be modified. I've not noticed the other tabs on mine, but I wasn't looking for them either. The masking on the lettering looks 'meh' to me... If I have that on mine, I'm not going to lose sleep over it. I'd be more upset over moisture inside the lenses than anything that's been brought up so far.
As to the build-up/manufacturing updates... I remember those that came before, trying to do what Keith has done and how that all went down - so to see a guy actually develop a product, asking for no up front money, meanwhile keeping us updated on progress and then bringing it to market, made, I think, all of us excited. On top of that, he kept pretty close to his original cost estimate.
Personally, I feel Keith has earned a wide amount of leeway to any deviations from the originals. He started from scratch, he had to scan a set of original lenses, have dies made, determine the type of plastic to use, develop a process to mimic the originals but wouldn't later delaminate - and do it on a production level scale, perform all of the durability testing, deal w/ GM over licensing, and all on his own dime for an orphaned and obscure car that's worth about $10,000. He's got to recoup his costs and hopefully make a profit from a model that only existed for 3 years and in small numbers and one that isn't going up in value.
The other aftermarket companies that continue to make parts for old cars, often times have relationships to the mothership (be it Ford, GM, Chrysler, etc) - they buy the old dies and molds when the manufacturer is done with them and continue to make the parts and often can amortize the investment over several model years/cars. Keith started from scratch.
I said in the other thread that we as enthusiasts are going to know the differences, but if you put down the microscope and look at it from a non-expert fiero perspective, they look like an exact match. The deviations that have been brought up are, I feel well within reason.
Those don't sound like a OEM NOS set, but the Fiero Store repros (especially if you just got the outer lens, I am not sure GM ever sold just the outer lens). This was a known issue with some of the Fiero Store lens. I have a set of OEM NOS sitting on the shelf and there are no issues with the bulging letters.
For the price, I think these are a perfectly fine alternative considering the ones you can buy from the competition. lol
Granted the masking issue would bother me, but no one else has made mention of this so maybe a 1 off or no one looked that close at them before and is not really that noticable. To those that nick picked them, what are the alternatives within the same price range?
I don't think he ment "bulging" per se.
I think he was referring to the fact that some lenses from the factory had imperfections or waves where the letters are. This was due to the mould process and was fairly common.
As far as being able to purchase just the outer lens from GM..... Yes you could and really was the more common way to buy them. I have had many outer lenses but only ever seen 1 assembly and that 1 assembly I still have.
And for the record, notchback tail lamp lenes were the same way. I also have a pair of those.
[This message has been edited by Thunderstruck GT (edited 12-10-2019).]
I'm trying to figure out why they were designed with the curved lines around the lock. It's strange that they are so visible.
From what I have read on facebook it is there on the factory ones but you cant see it because the factory black covers it up, (the part that delaminates) these don't have the part that delaminates.
Geez, guys, can we nitpick any more? Compared to what most of us have on our GT's, Keith's lenses are top-notch. I've ordered two sets, one for each of my GT's. I'm very happy with them as I expect most of the buyers are. As for the price of $450, I think it's very reasonable. Sure, I would have like to have paid less but $450 is still a lot less than the cost of NOS lenses (if you can find them) or even used lenses . Plus, Keith has footed the bill for development, prototyping, production, international shipping from the manufacturer, and...dum dum dum... paying royalties to GM! As for Customer Service, Keith has always got back to me when I've left emails or IM's. Maybe not immediately but within a reasonable amount of time for someone who is effectively a one-man operation.
Keith has all done us a service. The product is better than most of us expected. I'm thankful that he took on this project for GT owners.
I'm off my soapbox now and moving back into lurk mode.
Good ain't cheap & cheap ain't good. $1,350.00 + S&H ain't crap for 3 sets. As it is(was) I'd had to use whats' on my Gt now, cracked, de-laminated, scratched, just **** . NOW! New lenses, all spiffy. So now I gotta get the rest of my **** -box up to the same level. Damn you Kieth....
My experience with auto parts is that initial prototypes are usually good... once you go into production, the quality takes a dive. It then descends further with tooling wear.
From what I have read on facebook it is there on the factory ones but you cant see it because the factory black covers it up, (the part that delaminates) these don't have the part that delaminates.
You can't cover that up unless it is painted from the outside. What I'm thinking is that the factory lenses had that piece as part of the actual laminate material, not the lens itself. Since there is no laminate on the new lenses, that piece had to be added to the actual lens.
They are definitely worthy. They just need some things addressed. 450.00 demands a bit of superb quality.
Sorry, but you are out of touch. Go price out any late model lens, never mind one that goes the whole width of the rear of the vehicle. 450.00 is a deal. But this IS why no one wants to support these cars. You want 100 point show car parts for, rock auto prices
[This message has been edited by E.Furgal (edited 12-11-2019).]
This is an interesting discussion and as always value the feedback from Frugal Fiero Fans.
I'm not going to go into a lot of detail here. I was unaware this thread was going or I would have monitored it. I've spent much of my time over in FaceBook.
The curve around the lock pocket was a trade off for cost and overmolding and unfortunately just part of a manufacturing necessity.
We are always working to do due diligence to build a good product at a fair price.
------------------ Goody & .......George
The beauty of a solution lies in its simplicity
[This message has been edited by kgoodyear (edited 12-11-2019).]
I'm happy with both of my sets (stockers and custom decorated). I once paid around 750 for uncracked, "unscratched" but delaminated lenses. So yeah, 450 for something made of out of newer materials? Well worth the small issues NIFE found (making a guess it was NIFE, it's only the big Fiero club I know in Illinois). In casual light, at arms-reach, the "lock arch" is only noticeable if you know to look for it.
I did buy a pair and they and not perfect but far better than the ones I had and better than any used ones I could ever find, they are not OEM but are better then anything anyone has made or any used ones you can get. I think they are great and I am so happy that one person took the time and spent the money to make something lots of GTs need. If anyone thinks they can do better for less than $500 per set then they need to go for it.
This is an interesting discussion and as always value the feedback from Frugal Fiero Fans.
I'm not going to go into a lot of detail here. I was unaware this thread was going or I would have monitored it. I've spent much of my time over in FaceBook.
The curve around the lock pocket was a trade off for cost and overmolding and unfortunately just part of a manufacturing necessity.
We are always working to do due diligence to build a good product at a fair price.
.
