In a time when Biden has plans to allow people to sue ammo manufacturers when and end user uses their ammo for something nefarious....so far this lawsuit is also currently working its way up to suing an ammo retailer as well:
"The latest is the court ruling allowing a lawsuit against the Cabela’s store in Cheektowaga to proceed after it sold ammunition to then- 19-year-old Jake Klocek, who used it in a handgun to accidentally kill 19-year-old Anthony King, a friend he’d invited over while housesitting for an Elma couple.
The suit by the victim’s family contends that Cabela’s – a defendant along with Klocek and the Elma couple – “knew or should have known its failure to use reasonable care” in selling the ammunition to someone like Klocek would result in serious injury or death.
But that claim hinges on the fact that Klocek, under 21 at the time, could not legally buy handgun ammunition.
However, he could legally buy long gun ammunition. And as Cabela’s attorneys point out, the ammunition in question – .45 ACP – can be used in both handguns and rifles. If the clerk asks and the buyer says it’s for a rifle, how is the store supposed to know, short of having a polygraph machine at every register?
Nevertheless, the fact that both a State Supreme Court justice and an appellate court allowed the case to proceed is likely to ripple through the retail firearms industry. If the case makes it to trial and King’s parents win, it’s easy to envision it precipitating more of the types of marketplace constrictions that anti-gun politicians can only dream about..."
In a time when Biden has plans to allow people to sue ammo manufacturers when and end user uses their ammo for something nefarious....so far this lawsuit is also currently working its way up to suing an ammo retailer as well:
"The latest is the court ruling allowing a lawsuit against the Cabela’s store in Cheektowaga to proceed after it sold ammunition to then- 19-year-old Jake Klocek, who used it in a handgun to accidentally kill 19-year-old Anthony King, a friend he’d invited over while housesitting for an Elma couple.
The suit by the victim’s family contends that Cabela’s – a defendant along with Klocek and the Elma couple – “knew or should have known its failure to use reasonable care” in selling the ammunition to someone like Klocek would result in serious injury or death.
But that claim hinges on the fact that Klocek, under 21 at the time, could not legally buy handgun ammunition.
However, he could legally buy long gun ammunition. And as Cabela’s attorneys point out, the ammunition in question – .45 ACP – can be used in both handguns and rifles. If the clerk asks and the buyer says it’s for a rifle, how is the store supposed to know, short of having a polygraph machine at every register?
Nevertheless, the fact that both a State Supreme Court justice and an appellate court allowed the case to proceed is likely to ripple through the retail firearms industry. If the case makes it to trial and King’s parents win, it’s easy to envision it precipitating more of the types of marketplace constrictions that anti-gun politicians can only dream about..."
A simple, easy, one page or less "hold harmless wavier" with every ammunition purchase will effectively END this type of litigation.
Yes, I know it creates yet another hoop that we shouldn't have to jump through and it potentially would create a retained record of who bought what with regard to ammunition unless a way is found to create a "blanket" wavier, (which I am sure can be done), but the point is there are ways to stop this type of litigation and protect merchants.
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 11-08-2020).]
Just wait until they start suing knife, hammer and rock manufacturers.
Maybe a "great reset" is what we need. Wipe it all out and start gain. THIS experiment is a failure.
Never let a crisis go to waste. A reset is what the Deep State wants to use to remove Constitutionally recognized rights from Americans. The rights that get in the way of furthering tyranny.
A simple, easy, one page or less "hold harmless wavier" with every ammunition purchase will effectively END this type of litigation.
Yes, I know it creates yet another hoop that we shouldn't have to jump through and it potentially would create a retained record of who bought what with regard to ammunition unless a way is found to create a "blanket" wavier, (which I am sure can be done), but the point is there are ways to stop this type of litigation and protect merchants.
That's how they sell fireworks in Florida for the last 30 years
2009 video, about the past, and its no better now.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlhIW8X5cRU . . What they apparently don't realize when "fighting the NRA" like big tough guys...is they are fighting the American people they are supposed to be serving. . .
Democrats are going to have a really difficult time in the very near future.
Laser guns are becoming easier and easier to make. You can make one from an old CD-ROM... it takes a lot of battery power, and it has to be focused on the target for a few seconds... but if someone actually put in some real effort you'd have something feasible. With Tesla improving battery power and reducing size, we're maybe a decade away from this hitting markets I'd suspect.
Second you can basically 3D print guns anyway... so anyone can make their own gun right now... with CNC machines getting cheaper, people can actually CNC their own guns now too.
I can see all kinds of silly legislation coming out in the near future... none of it will make a bit of difference.
Yep, and looking back at our freedoms, folks used to be able to buy fully automatic machine guns from a catalog. Now here even just suppressors, used to reduce the need for hearing protection, require you be on an NFA list and a 200 tax. Sounds like liberal leaders desire for that to be the case for any gun that isn't manual loading for each shot. Meaning anything semi auto. On top of that limiting magazine capacities. Step one is go after the scary looking black rifles, the best selling most populer rifles in the USA. Meanwhile in Norway you can still buy suppressors at the hardware store. ...And meanwhile in the US, criminals still dont follow laws or regulations, so adding more aren't making a difference.
From the 5 min mark The National Shooting Sports Foundation talks about Biden's plans for gun owners.
Reclassifying firearms, undermining the industry by allowing lawsuits against manufacturers, and using tax money to pressure states against gun owners.
[This message has been edited by 2.5 (edited 11-15-2020).]
All the girls in my family know their way around firearms. Sis-n-law with her 243, moved up to a 300 mag later. 2 of my nieces waiting for 'the 200 yard boys' to get thru so they can move up closer to the targets with their handguns. all 3 nieces have concealed carry. my wife on the end with another PFFer's 300 blackout. Both my older sisters have their CC.
That's funny, Hudini, but sometimes too accurate. I'm all for some modifications but I've seen way too many weapons (pistols and AR types alike) that have more weight in mods than in the stock weapon. I EDC a SIG X Compact. The only "stock" part is the FCU (Fire Control Unit...the only serialized part on the pistol making it the actual pistol....love modularity). Everything else is aftermarket or at least not native to an X Compact. Wilson Combat grip module, Streamlight TLR-7a weapons light, Barsto bull barrel (which is completely unnecessary but it was on sale), Gogun gas pedal, etc. The RDO is a genuine SIG Romeo 1 Pro (although I didn't buy it from SIG) and the slide is a genuine SIG Pro slide. But.....EVERYTHING on the gun is fully functional. It's not Gucci'ed out like so many. If it doesn't enhance the functioning, I don't need it.
(Just so everyone knows, just after I took this pic, this pistol fell in the lake, too. In the deep part.)
"In late November, the Trump administration took its firmest action yet to counteract ongoing banking discrimination against firearms-related companies ... The proposed OCC rule aims to end politically-motivated manipulation of the financial service industry and to require large banks to provide fair access to all the products they offer to law-abiding customers who are able to satisfy predetermined “quantitative, impartial risk-based standards.” It reiterates that the Dodd-Frank Wall Street Reform and Consumer Protection Act requires “fair treatment of customers by . . . the institutions” subject to its jurisdiction. The rule would therefore establish enforceable standards of fairness for America’s largest banks. Those standards would prevent activists and banks from conspiring to deprive otherwise eligible customers of financial services for purely political reasons. ... The Office of the Comptroller of the Currency, a significant banking regulator, issued a proposed rule to prohibit politically-motivated service denials and to ensure large, nationwide banks would have to make offered products available to all law-abiding customers without ideological bias.
Of all the Obama/Biden administration’s attacks on the Second Amendment, Operation Choke Point (OCP) was one of the most insidious. Frequent readers of this page will recall how federal banking regulators, under the guise of shielding banks and the public from fraud, pressured financial service providers against doing business with lawful but politically-disfavored customers. These included sellers of firearms and ammunition, which were specifically singled out as “high risk” by the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation in regulatory guidance provided to banks in 2011.
What made these firearm-related businesses high risk? In the circular reasoning of OCP, it wasn’t their creditworthiness or financial performance but the “reputation risk” they supposedly posed to banks that, so the story went, could anger third parties by serving the “high risk” clients. And the regulators made sure the banks understood that no one might be angrier than the regulators themselves: failing to heed their “risk-based” guidance could subject the banks to costly and embarrassing investigations. The simple solution was for the banks to avoid conducting business with “high risk” customers entirely.
The Obama/Biden administration retreated from OCP when Congressional investigators and other watchdogs revealed its obvious wrongdoing. The FDIC revised its infamous 2011 regulatory guidance in 2014, and issued further clarification in 2015, refocusing on case-by-case risk management, rather than debanking of entire industries. Nevertheless, the regulators portrayed the furvor over OCP as a big misunderstanding, with banks supposedly overreacting to legitimate attempts to hinder scammers.
Subsequent events, however, confirmed that political activists were indeed deliberately trying to weaponize the financial services industry against the targets of their activism.
On February 18, 2018, the New York Times published an infamous essay by Andrew Ross Sorkin that called upon the financial services industry to adopt restrictions on relationships with gun companies to demonstrate its commitment to “moral responsibility.” The plan was for banks and payment processors to defund activities – like the making and sales of semiautomatic rifles – that anti-gun activists had unsuccessfully lobbied the political branches to ban.
Sorkin’s proposal, like OCP, recognized that financial services are the lifeblood of any successful business. But the pressure this time was to come from the social justice mob, not faceless government bureaucrats. The new OCC rulemaking actually cites Sorkin’s article as an example of how politics have infected the provision of financial services.
Even some in the government itself have retroactively embraced the tactics of OCP. After anti-gun Democrats took over control of the House Financial Services Committee following the 2018 midterms, the committee hauled a Wells Fargo Bank executive to a hearing to berate him for, among other things, the bank’s transactions with gun companies.
Other banks, Rep. Carolyn D. Maloney (D-NY) lectured, had forced their firearm-related customers to adopt “best practices” that limited the scope of their lawful activities. These practices just happened to mirror unsuccessful legislative proposals pushed by anti-gun Democrats, that included such constitutionally dubious measures as refusing to sell otherwise-legal long guns to otherwise-eligible adults of military age. To his credit, the executive stood his ground, asserting, “We just don’t believe that it is a good idea to encourage banks to enforce legislation that doesn’t exist.”
The tenor of the hearing, however, made it unmistakably clear that certain committee members were unabashedly trying to pressure the bank to curb its business with certain customers, not because those customers were behaving illegally, but because the committee members found them objectionable.
All the while, firearm-related businesses were finding their options for financial services shrinking. ...
For its part, the Trump administration explicitly repudiated OCP, with the U.S. Department of Justice (which had participated in OCP under the Obama/Biden administration) providing written assurance to the U.S. House Judiciary Committee that the program had been terminated and would not be revived. Characterizing OCP as a “misguided initiative conducted during the previous administration,” the DOJ’s Aug. 16, 2017, letter stated:
“the Department will not discourage the provision of financial services to lawful industries, including businesses engaged in … firearms-related activities.”
Still, whether from lingering doubts left by OCP or in the vain hope of appeasing the social justice grievance lobby, some of America’s biggest banks have continued to shun lawful, creditworthy, and financially sound businesses within the firearm and ammunition sectors. ...
We also thank the Trump Administration and Acting Comptroller of the Currency Brian P. Brooks for their leadership in seeking to restore fairness and sanity to the nationwide market for financial products. Ideological discrimination in the services businesses need to survive is a shameful, pernicious, and thoroughly un-American trend. The proposed OCC rule is a welcomed step toward eliminating it."
Smith and Wesson Sues New Jersey (Attourney General)
"Smith & Wesson’s attorneys said in its complaint, filed in federal court in New Jersey, that the subpoena “seeks evidence of consumer fraud relating to advertising—but in reality, it seeks to suppress and punish lawful speech regarding gun ownership in order to advance an anti-Second Amendment agenda that the Attorney General publicly committed to pursue.” ... https://www.wsj.com/article...subpoena-11608067784
To submit your comment to ATF/DOJ: (You do not need to enter any personal info) https://www.federalregister...h-stabilizing-braces As he said, they expect poor turnout by taking comments over the holidays to work in their favor.
Maybe something like this:
How is it possible that the "contents do not have force of law or bind the public"... they will though if they pass correct? Or The ATF serves no purpose? Which is it? You shall not infringe on the 2nd amendment, you should not be regulating any of this, you should undo past regulation. Do not test the citizens freedom.
I watched the opening 'dsarming' movement. Very slow. He'd be shot and bleeding and if it happened in the hood the shooter might even urinate on him afterwards. Plus what's he gonna do when the perp is holding it sideways?
I used to train Isshinryu as a teen. In real fights the punches don't come at you like in the dojo. The kicks don't have the same results as in the katas. But it did help preserve my face twice in the inner city when jumped by gangs of Blacks.
An individual's duty to retreat before using force has been eliminated in Ohio under a gun rights bill signed by Ohio's Republican governor on Monday. Gov. Mike DeWine signed the bill despite his vocal concerns that GOP lawmakers were ignoring his own legislation proposed following the 2019 mass shooting in Dayton.
The measure expands the so-called "stand your ground" right from an individual's house and car to any place, "if that person is in a place in which the person lawfully has a right to be."
As recently as last month DeWine hinted he might veto the bill, saying lawmakers should focus on what he sent them instead. But on Monday, he signed the bill in "the spirit of cooperation" with the General Assembly.
As the demographics change in America the bad news is there will be more shutdowns and takedowns of traditional rights and rules.
Inner city groups that are subject to more gun violence seen by losing toddlers, sons, sisters and uncles, view the fix as infringement on everyone else's legal practice as some retribution, perhaps an avoidance at looking at their communities as being responsible. So they lump everyone in their group as having to sacrifice along with them. The mass shootings happen every weekend in inner cities at birthday parties, night clubs, funerals, convenience stores, etc..
There's a reason leading politicians should fit the traditional family model of the past.
If you don't have the family unit, you aren't building anything lasting for your children's future. Passing laws in hope that it will stop your child from shooting someone or being shot is giving up on proper family modeling.
Yes indeed.. it appears there are people in office who hate your freedom.
New gun registration bill submitted...HR 127 License to posess a firearm that must be carried, required psyche eval including approval of family and any former spouse, required heavy taxes, expensive mandatory insurance, heavy penalties. Banning of "large" capacity (more than 10 round capability) all this and more.. but wait.. I'm sure it gets better!
Ioan Grillo wants federal lawmakers to pursue four specific objectives.
Require NICS background checks for buyers at gun shows and in other (he doesn't say "all") private sales.
More severe sentencing for convictions obtained in "straw purchase" cases.
A "crack down" on sellers and purchasers of firearms stolen from wherever firearms are stolen, which includes stolen from gun shops and gun dealers.
A "crack down" on Internet firearms kits, which are Grillo-referenced as "ghost" guns.
Grillo asserts that none of his "Big Four" agenda should be regarded as any kind of infringement on 2A and cites a 2019 NPR PBS NewsHour Marist poll in asserting that "closing the gun shows and private sales loophole on background checks" (#1) scored an 81 percent favorability rating among "conservatives."
The article includes this text:
quote
Mexico’s Foreign Ministry estimates that more than 2.5 million guns have flooded over America’s southern border in the last decade. In that time, Mexico has been gripped by violence that terrorizes communities and stifles the nation’s growth. Even the pandemic did little to curb the nation’s murder rate, with more than 34,000 homicides last year.
The Biden administration has a window of opportunity to reduce the traffic of guns to Mexico and beyond. Firearms that are smuggled from the United States make their way across the continent, to Mexico as well as to Central American nations, where violence has sent waves of migrants and refugees fleeing to the United States’ southern border.
. . .
The black market in guns is driving murders on both sides of the border, and traffickers exploit the confusing patchwork of regulations that govern the legal firearms industry in America. Amazingly, there is no federal statute specifically prohibiting firearms trafficking in the United States.
quote
[Ioan] Grillo is a contributing opinion writer based in Mexico who has investigated drug trafficking, violence and organized crime in Latin America. He is the author of “Blood Gun Money: How America Arms Gangs and Cartels.”
"Slow the Iron River of Guns to Mexico"
quote
The Biden administration has an opportunity to stem illegal gun trafficking to Mexico and beyond.
