They imagine that Trump is a criminal, then set out to find a crime.
There is an audio tape of Donald Trump confirmed by multiple witnesses from the Trump National Golf Club in Bedminster New Jersey where he shows a classified document of a "plan of attack" from the Dpartment of Defense and says "I could have declassified this when I was President, but I can't now. This is still a secret" This led to an investigation by the FBI into Trumps retention of documents that he was not authorized to possess. During this investigation Trump made the entire situation worse by continually lying to investigators and trying to hide the documents before finally getting caught with them.
In the Georgia case there are emails and texts from Trumps attorney Sidney Powell discussing how they would use the information they illegally obtained by breaching the Coffee County Election Commission. And there are dozens of people who admit to being sent as fake delegates to cast votes for Trump in States where he lost.
Nothing about that is "imaginary". The only people living in "imaginary worlds" are the Trumpsheep who actually buy the story that a guy who did nothing wrong and had nothing to hide would lie repeatedly to the FBI about what he was doing
How brainwashed do you have to be to fall for that story?
The quote that will go down in history next to Trumps picture will be. . . "I could stand in the middle of Fifth Avenue and shoot somebody, and I wouldn't lose any voters, OK?" . . . He actually BRAGS in public that his followers are brainwashed sheep.
And his followers accuse liberals of being delusional.
It is hilarious.
[This message has been edited by fredtoast (edited 09-07-2023).]
There is an audio tape of Donald Trump confirmed by multiple witnesses from the Trump National Golf Club in Bedminster New Jersey where he shows a classified document of a "plan of attack" from the Dpartment of Defense and says "I could have declassified this when I was President, but I can't now. This is still a secret" This led to an investigation by the FBI into Trumps retention of documents that he was not authorized to possess. During this investigation Trump made the entire situation worse by continually lying to investigators and trying to hide the documents before finally getting caught with them.
In the Georgia case there are emails and texts from Trumps attorney Sidney Powell discussing how they would use the information they illegally obtained by breaching the Coffee County Election Commission. And there are dozens of people who admit to being sent as fake delegates to cast votes for Trump in States where he lost.
Nothing about that is "imaginary". The only people living in "imaginary worlds" are the Trumpsheep who actually buy the story that a guy who did nothing wrong and had nothing to hide would lie repeatedly to the FBI about what he was doing
How brainwashed do you have to be to fall for that story?
The quote that will go down in history next to Trumps picture will be. . . "I could stand in the middle of Fifth Avenue and shoot somebody, and I wouldn't lose any voters, OK?" . . . He actually BRAGS in public that his followers are brainwashed sheep.
And his followers accuse liberals of being delusional.
It is hilarious.
The topic of this thread is about the Electoral College.
Originally posted by olejoedad: The topic of this thread is about the Electoral College. But you [fredtoast] already knew that too. Deflection?
The "toast" is clearly responding to what the "goat" said at the end of the previous page; to wit:
quote
Originally posted by williegoat: Leftists live in an imaginary world. They imagine that Trump is a criminal, then set out to find a crime. They imagine that our republic is a democracy, then set out to concoct an explanation.
Some psychologists would call that rationalization or compensation.
[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 09-08-2023).]
There is an audio tape of Donald Trump confirmed by multiple witnesses from the Trump National Golf Club in Bedminster New Jersey where he shows a classified document of a "plan of attack" from the Dpartment of Defense and says "I could have declassified this when I was President, but I can't now. This is still a secret" This led to an investigation by the FBI into Trumps retention of documents that he was not authorized to possess. During this investigation Trump made the entire situation worse by continually lying to investigators and trying to hide the documents before finally getting caught with them.
In the Georgia case there are emails and texts from Trumps attorney Sidney Powell discussing how they would use the information they illegally obtained by breaching the Coffee County Election Commission. And there are dozens of people who admit to being sent as fake delegates to cast votes for Trump in States where he lost.
Nothing about that is "imaginary". The only people living in "imaginary worlds" are the Trumpsheep who actually buy the story that a guy who did nothing wrong and had nothing to hide would lie repeatedly to the FBI about what he was doing
How brainwashed do you have to be to fall for that story?
The quote that will go down in history next to Trumps picture will be. . . "I could stand in the middle of Fifth Avenue and shoot somebody, and I wouldn't lose any voters, OK?" . . . He actually BRAGS in public that his followers are brainwashed sheep.
And his followers accuse liberals of being delusional.
It is hilarious.
HAHAHH!!! Look at that deflection!!!!
I've never seen such a case of... "I just LOST an argument, so let me pivot!!!"
There is an audio tape of Donald Trump confirmed by multiple witnesses from the Trump National Golf Club in Bedminster New Jersey where he shows a classified document of a "plan of attack" from the Dpartment of Defense and says "I could have declassified this when I was President, but I can't now. This is still a secret" This led to an investigation by the FBI into Trumps retention of documents that he was not authorized to possess. During this investigation Trump made the entire situation worse by continually lying to investigators and trying to hide the documents before finally getting caught with them.
In the Georgia case there are emails and texts from Trumps attorney Sidney Powell discussing how they would use the information they illegally obtained by breaching the Coffee County Election Commission. And there are dozens of people who admit to being sent as fake delegates to cast votes for Trump in States where he lost.
Nothing about that is "imaginary". The only people living in "imaginary worlds" are the Trumpsheep who actually buy the story that a guy who did nothing wrong and had nothing to hide would lie repeatedly to the FBI about what he was doing
How brainwashed do you have to be to fall for that story?
The quote that will go down in history next to Trumps picture will be. . . "I could stand in the middle of Fifth Avenue and shoot somebody, and I wouldn't lose any voters, OK?" . . . He actually BRAGS in public that his followers are brainwashed sheep.
And his followers accuse liberals of being delusional.
It is hilarious.
Hmmm, I don't see any links.
Where are the links?
I've been told there are always links to back up claims.....
I've been told there are always links to back up claims.....
"Play dumb, whydoncha..."
If you're not aware of the allegations about Trump's criminal possession and brazen brandishing of a classified Defense Department document at his Bedminster, NJ residence, it's because you've been hiding from the news reports.
These are allegations that Jack Smith put into writing as part of the superseding indictments against Donald Trump in the Mar-a-Lago documents case.
There is zero "deflection". I was responding directly to Willie's allegations that the charges against Trump were "imaginary".
I guess "deflection" is another one of those words that you don't really know the meaning of.
Hahaha Fred, you picked that ONE thing out, because it's the ONLY thing you *THINK* that you have an angle with to "win" because it has yet to be resolved.
Originally posted by rinselberg: I am thinking that MAYBE the reasons for having the Electoral College have become moot, because of the ways that the U.S. has changed since the Electoral system was adopted.
Changes:
Satellite and cable TV
Internet and World Wide Web
Cell phones
Facebook, Twitter and other social networking venues
Global reach of remote video conferencing
Automobiles and Interstate Highways
Passenger Airlines from coast to coast and everywhere in between
More mobile population, more people relocating between cities, suburbs, rural areas and states
?
rinselberg, what do any of those have to do with voting or the Electoral College ?
quote
Originally posted by olejoedad: The individual States are responsible as to how the Electoral votes from their districts are divided. Most States have opted for the 'all in' approach only two have divided their votes to reflect the districts. I think the 'all in' approach is antiquated and excludes the voters in non-urban areas.
Ding ding ding, we have a winner.
quote
Originally posted by Doug85GT: Why don't we eliminate states, counties, and city governments. We will just have one government for the whole country. Everything will be decided by popular vote. If the major cities all decide that they should get free food from the farmers, tough, majority rule. When the major cities decide that we should have free gasoline and cable TV, so be it. Let's have a pure democracy!
Ding ding ding, we have a loser. winner. Nice sarcasm Doug. We can eliminate national borders too. One World Order !
quote
Originally posted by cliffw: Again, I ask, what do you think the First Amendment means ?
quote
Originally posted by fredtoast: This just is not true anymore because even the most red states have 40% or more Democratic voters. the days of certain states being 100% in favor of a certain position are long gone.
Land mass should not control voting value. One person = one vote. People who live in less populated states should not have votes worht more that people in highly populated states.
My oh my, . How much 'wrong' can you put into a post ?
The days of certain states being 100% in favor of a certain position are long gone ? Tell us brainiac, when did they ever exist ?
One person = one vote has always existed within the individual States ! As it does today. You have not demonstrated you are a student of history. Do you even understand the concept of "the United States" ? Do you understand the reasoning for the American Revolution ?
Again, I ask you, what do you think the First Amendment means ?
quote
Originally posted by fredtoast: A Constitutional Republic is a democracy, and since we can completely change anything in the Constitution, we don't live in a Constitutional Republic.
Where do we live ? You say a Constitutional Republic is a democracy, and then say we don't live in a Constitutional Republic democracy.
quote
Originally posted by fredtoast: I did not "choose to overlook" anything. I just don't believe the votes of people who live in the country should count more than the votes of the people who live in the city.
one person = one vote.
Again I ask what do you think the First Amendment means ?
quote
Originally posted by fredtoast: And as I pointed out before. Even the most red/rural state still only has about 40% democrats. When the Constitution was drafted a southern state might be 90% agricultural. That just does not exist any more. Even farm states have large industries and businesses that have nothing to do with agriculture.
Are you really trying to say rural areas should produce agricultural for cities which want to rule them, :crazy : ?
quote
Originally posted by RayOtton: Hey how about just the opposite?
A true confederation of states.
Do away with the Federal government, except for defense and military treaties. Everyone throws the same % of $ into the pot for mutual protection.
Then let the states figure the rest out for themselves. Education, economy, infrastructure, healthcare, the works.
I like it ! The general welfare of the united states becomes the general welfare of the State.
Originally posted by fredtoast: There is zero "deflection". I was responding directly to Willie's allegations that the charges against Trump were "imaginary".
Allegations means guilty ? Just like Russian collusion ?
Again I ask what do you think the First Amendment means ?
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
And like all of our Constitutional rights these individual rights are limited when they infringe on the rights of other citizens.
You have freedom of speech, but you can't commit libel, slander, fraud, or perjury. You also can't incite a riot, or make threats.
You have freedom to worship as you please but it can't be endorsed by any government authority, and it can't violate criminal laws (except some very narrow rulings regarding illegal drugs)
You have freedom of the press, but with the same limits placed on freedom of speech. Also broadcasting regulations apply to TV and radio.
People have the right to "peaceably assemble, with certain limitations regarding public health and safety.
You have the right to petition the government for redress within the constraints of our legal and electoral systems. So what do you think it means? Why do you keep asking this question?
Are you really trying to say rural areas should produce agricultural for cities which want to rule them, :crazy : ?
No. I am saying that we should all work together. Treat everyone equal. One person = One vote.
People in rural areas can not survive without the products and services from other areas, and people in cities are not trying to "rule" people who live in rural areas.
Hahaha Fred, you picked that ONE thing out, because it's the ONLY thing you *THINK* that you have an angle with to "win" because it has yet to be resolved.
It was williegoat that brought up the criminal cases against Trump in the course of this discussion.
What did you expect Fred to do... just ignore that? Ignore it Like It Never Even Happened? How Do You Make Like It Never Even Happened Happen?
This is such a "carp"... to accuse that Fred "picked that ONE thing out" is as conspicuous as one of those giant goldfish that look like they've been pumped up by radioactivity-induced genetic mutations. "Koi." It's just unbelievable. And then to be "Hahaha Fred" about it... it doesn't pass the smell test. If anything, it should be "Hahaha 82-T/A..." Or maybe even "Bwahaha 82-T/A..." As in "Bwahaha with a B."
Unbelievable.
[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 09-08-2023).]
Originally posted by cliffw: Again, I ask you, what do you think the First Amendment means ?
quote
Originally posted by fredtoast: Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
And like all of our Constitutional rights these individual rights are limited when they infringe on the rights of other citizens.
So what do you think it means? Why do you keep asking this question?
Peaceably assemble also means to peaceably disassemble. Does it not ? How does that infringe on the rights of other citizens ?
Are you really one of those that thinks the United States owns everyone ?
Originally posted by cliffw: I am not on the Grand Jury, which can indict an imaginary ham sandwich.
It's a bromide, that a grand jury can indict a ham sandwich.
Has a jury indicted a ham sandwich (so to speak) in the context of this discussion?
This discussion has it origins in my remarks from 2016 about the Electoral College, but at the end of page two of this thread, forum member williegoat referenced (albeit indirectly) the criminal indictments of former President Trump that have converged like an avalanche, from New York County District Attorney Alvin Bragg, U.S. Department of Justice Special Counsel Jack Smith and Fulton County Georgia District Attorney Fani Willis.
In my world, cliffw's "ham sandwich" remark is downright hard to swallow.
[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 09-09-2023).]
Originally posted by rinselberg: It's a bromide, that a grand jury can indict a ham sandwich.
Has a jury indicted a ham sandwich (so to speak) in the context of this discussion?
In my world, cliffw's "ham sandwich" remark is downright hard to swallow.
What planet do you live on ? Bromide ? Ha ! In our world we speak English. The art of conversation involves being easily understood. I have your bromide hanging.
I did not say a jury indicted a ham sandwich. In fact, I said "Grand Jury". Maybe DredToast can school you on how a Grand Jury works.
The judge who is credited as having first said that a prosecutor could get a grand jury to indict a ham sandwich was later indicted himself on extortion charges and plead guilty.
