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Difference between "Judaism" and "Zionism". by fredtoast
Started on: 10-08-2023 10:42 AM
Replies: 140 (1931 views)
Last post by: Jake_Dragon on 10-24-2023 05:54 PM
Patrick
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Report this Post10-18-2023 03:18 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by olejoedad:

No registration was required for me to view it.



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Report this Post10-18-2023 05:01 PM Click Here to See the Profile for cliffwSend a Private Message to cliffwEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by rinselberg:
... Wichita is "good" for about one cartoon or meme per diem that reveals his [Wichita's] solipsism, ...


Wisdom ?


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Report this Post10-19-2023 07:46 AM Click Here to See the Profile for olejoedadSend a Private Message to olejoedadEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Here is the full text of the article I posted earlier.

It required one to register on the website to view it.

I have italicized a very relevant statement.

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MIDDLE EAST
Who or what are ‘the Palestinians?’
From time immemorial, Jews occupied the spot history knows as ‘Judaea.’ What happened to that?

October 16, 2023 | 9:59 am
palestinians
Protesters shout slogans against Israel during a demonstration in Ramallah (Getty)
Written By:

Roger Kimball

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It’s so cute when politicians like AOC and Rashida Tlaib, to say nothing of hysteric undergraduates and ill-informed lefties across the country, complain that Israel is an “apartheid state” that is illegitimately “occupying” the land West of the Jordan River from the Golan Heights down to the border of the Sinai Peninsula.

Responding to the murderous attacks on Israeli civilians by Hamas on October 7, AOC decried “the occupation of Palestine” while Tlaib urged “ending the occupation, and dismantling the apartheid system” that can “lead to resistance.”

Hermeneuts of the world, unite! What does Tlaib mean by “resistance” here? Slaughtering innocent partygoers? Incinerating and beheading babies? Indiscriminately raping then murdering hostages? And what is the force of “lead to”? Is it meant to suggest that Israel is somehow to blame for such acts of “resistance” because — because why? Because the Jewish people occupy the place that was 1) their ancestral homeland and 2) with which they were reinvested by the Balfour Declaration of 1917, by the victorious Brits after World War One and and the dissolution of the Ottoman Empire, explicitly to provide a “national home for the Jewish people,” and 3) by the creation of the state of Israel in 1948?

What group of people do they think belongs there?


“Palestinians” is the usual answer.

But who or what are the “Palestinians”?

“People from Palestine,” you say.

But what is Palestine?

From time immemorial, Jews occupied the spot history knows as “Judaea.” What happened to that? Gibbon said that Hadrian, who ruled from AD 117 to 138, was one of the “five good emperors.” Maybe so, but there is a reason that the Jews proverbially accompanied any mention of Hadrian with the imprecation, “May God crush his bones.”


Hadrian brutally put down the Bar Kokhba revolt of AD 132-136 and, in an effort to stamp out any remnants of Jewish nationalism killed, or exiled the entire population and renamed “Judaea” “Syrian Palestine.”

The “Palestinians” that we know and love today were an invention of the KGB and their puppet Yasser Arafat, an educated, middle-class Arab of Egyptian origin who devoted his life to murderous anti-American mischief. (Among other things, he arranged for the murder of Cleo Noel, the US ambassador to Sudan.)

Ion Mihai Pacepa, the former chief of Romanian intelligence, defected to the US and wrote about the links between Arafat and the KGB: “Arafat was an important undercover operative for the KGB,” Pacepa wrote in the Wall Street Journal:

Right after the 1967 Six Day Arab-Israeli war, Moscow got him appointed to chairman of the PLO. Egyptian ruler Gamal Abdel Nasser, a Soviet puppet, proposed the appointment. In 1969 the KGB asked Arafat to declare war on American “imperial-Zionism” during the first summit of the Black Terrorist International, a neo-fascist pro-Palestine organization financed by the KGB and Libya’s Muammar Gaddafi. It appealed to him so much, Arafat later claimed to have invented the imperial-Zionist battle cry. But in fact, “imperial-Zionism” was a Moscow invention, a modern adaptation of the “Protocols of the Elders of Zion,” and long a favorite tool of Russian intelligence to foment ethnic hatred. The KGB always regarded antisemitism plus anti-imperialism as a rich source of anti-Americanism.

Somehow, those details are omitted by the “pro-Palestinian” lobby in their pursuit of ecstatic antisemitism, as is the inconvenient fact that “prior to the PLO Charter being released in 1964, no one referred to Palestinians with the same intent as used today. There is a reason no mention exists prior to that moment. The KGB had not created the fictitious people until that time.”

Don’t believe it? How about this statement from Zuheir Mohsen, a senior PLO leader, in 1977:


The Palestinian people do not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity… Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct “Palestinian people” to oppose Zionism. Yes, the existence of a separate Palestinian identity exists only for tactical reasons.


The history of the Levant makes for a complicated story, not least its recent history. I will not try to tell it all here. But the idea that the Jews are illegitimately occupying territory that really belongs to “the Palestinians” is a politically-motivated historical falsehood that only an unhappy terrorist or a half-educated Western leftie, could believe.

By
Roger Kimball

Roger Kimball is the editor and publisher of the New Criterion, publisher of Encounter Books and a Spectator columnist and contributing editor.

[This message has been edited by olejoedad (edited 10-19-2023).]

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Report this Post10-19-2023 08:41 AM Click Here to See the Profile for cliffwSend a Private Message to cliffwEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by ray b:
since the end of 2017, RealClearPolitics has had a rightward, pro-Donald Trump turn in its content.


Britch and moan when it's fake news.
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Report this Post10-19-2023 08:45 AM Click Here to See the Profile for cliffwSend a Private Message to cliffwEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

cliffw

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quote
Originally posted by ray b:
since the end of 2017, RealClearPolitics has had a rightward, pro-Donald Trump turn in its content.


Britch and moan when it's fake news.
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Report this Post10-24-2023 09:39 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ray bSend a Private Message to ray bEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by cliffw:


Britch and moan when it's fake news.


you mean like the BS posted by olejoedad above

jews out by 130ace until 1880
but you claim ''Palestinians” that we know and love today were an invention of the KGB ''
people who were there 130 to 1880 were invented by the KGB who were started after 1917 revolt
HOW DID THE KGB DO THAT BEFORE THEY EXISTED

MUST BE A MIRACLE

SORRY BUT THAT MAKES NO SENSE
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olejoedad
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Report this Post10-24-2023 09:47 AM Click Here to See the Profile for olejoedadSend a Private Message to olejoedadEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Perhaps you should putin put on your glasses when you read.

The article didn't say that.
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Report this Post10-24-2023 09:57 AM Click Here to See the Profile for olejoedadSend a Private Message to olejoedadEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

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Report this Post10-24-2023 10:40 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ray bSend a Private Message to ray bEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by olejoedad:

Maybe this will help....

https://youtu.be/V1adoNjKaPI?si=85rCTDndSeiiUf9C


LOVE THOSE FAKE SITES don't you

PRAGER NOT A U YET AGAIN

sorry but fake BS about the people who live there is a sad lie
didn't JC tell you not to bear false witness but you do exactly that repeatedly

real people lived there after the religious jews were run out by the romans in 130ace
they did not go there by KGB plots like your BS claims
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Report this Post10-24-2023 11:00 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ray bSend a Private Message to ray bEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

ray b

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Member since Jan 2001
 
quote
Originally posted by olejoedad:

Perhaps you should putin put on your glasses when you read.

The article didn't say that.


the quote is from your fake site

''Palestinians” that we know and love today were an invention of the KGB ''

unlike some copy/paste seldom lies

but is real zionist/christian fundie propaganda

I have seen your ways far too often for my liking
you ain't the first nor the last fundie I have debated

there is no revealed truth in the buybull
no history prior to 600bce just tall tales
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olejoedad
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Report this Post10-24-2023 12:27 PM Click Here to See the Profile for olejoedadSend a Private Message to olejoedadEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
This is what is in the article I posted, in reference to the 'Palestinians'....

'The “Palestinians” that we know and love today were an invention of the KGB and their puppet Yasser Arafat, an educated, middle-class Arab of Egyptian origin who devoted his life to murderous anti-American mischief'.

This is what was said about the 'Palestinians'....


'Don’t believe it? How about this statement from Zuheir Mohsen, a senior PLO leader, in 1977:

The Palestinian people do not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity… Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct “Palestinian people” to oppose Zionism. Yes, the existence of a separate Palestinian identity exists only for tactical reasons.'

[This message has been edited by olejoedad (edited 10-24-2023).]

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Report this Post10-24-2023 02:08 PM Click Here to See the Profile for rinselbergClick Here to visit rinselberg's HomePageSend a Private Message to rinselbergEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by olejoedad:

This is what is in the article I posted, in reference to the 'Palestinians'...."The 'Palestinians' that we know and love today were an invention of the KGB and their puppet Yasser Arafat, an educated, middle-class Arab of Egyptian origin who devoted his life to murderous anti-American mischief."

This is what was said about the 'Palestinians'.... don’t believe it? How about this statement from Zuheir Mohsen, a senior PLO leader, in 1977?

"The Palestinian people do not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity… Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct 'Palestinian people' to oppose Zionism. Yes, the existence of a separate Palestinian identity exists only for tactical reasons."

The PLO of that time (the 1970s) was responsible for many heinous acts of criminal murder and terrorism.

Why should the "ghosts" of the 1970s-era PLO, like Zuheir Mohsen, who died in 1979, be regarded as legitimate spokespersons in connection with the current situation?

This is knavery.
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Report this Post10-24-2023 02:13 PM Click Here to See the Profile for olejoedadSend a Private Message to olejoedadEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I didn't think it was possible, but you have broken the bell on the county fair stupid meter.
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Report this Post10-24-2023 02:27 PM Click Here to See the Profile for rinselbergClick Here to visit rinselberg's HomePageSend a Private Message to rinselbergEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
The British mandate. Folke Bernadotte, Count of Wisborg and United Nations mediator for Palestine. The original "two-state solution."

All this predates the statements that "olejoedad" has dredged up, from and about the 1970s-era PLO.
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Report this Post10-24-2023 02:43 PM Click Here to See the Profile for olejoedadSend a Private Message to olejoedadEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
The 'Two State Solution' created after World War One has never worked.

Do you know why?

Do you know who created the name 'Palestine' , when the name was created and why it was created?

[This message has been edited by olejoedad (edited 10-24-2023).]

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Report this Post10-24-2023 03:54 PM Click Here to See the Profile for rinselbergClick Here to visit rinselberg's HomePageSend a Private Message to rinselbergEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by olejoedad:

The 'Two State Solution' created after World War One has never worked.

Do you know why?

Do you know who created the name 'Palestine' , when the name was created and why it was created?

I'm not even clear on what is being argued here, at this point.

Tom "The World Is Flat" Friedman thinks that Israel needs to balance the IDF's military campaign against Hamas with a diplomatic initiative, focused on the West Bank, to patch things up between Israel and the Palestinian Authority.

Sounds like a plan to me.

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Report this Post10-24-2023 04:04 PM Click Here to See the Profile for williegoatClick Here to visit williegoat's HomePageSend a Private Message to williegoatEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Israel has given the killers more opportunities than they deserve. There is only one path.
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Report this Post10-24-2023 04:15 PM Click Here to See the Profile for olejoedadSend a Private Message to olejoedadEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by rinselberg:

I'm not even clear on what is being argued here, at this point.

Tom "The World Is Flat" Friedman thinks that Israel needs to balance the IDF's military campaign against Hamas with a diplomatic initiative, focused on the West Bank, to patch things up between Israel and the Palestinian Authority.

Sounds like a plan to me.


Of course you don't.

Who the f*** is Tom Friedman?
Who cares what he thinks?

Of course you think that is a plan.

Troll.

[This message has been edited by olejoedad (edited 10-24-2023).]

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Report this Post10-24-2023 05:43 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ray bSend a Private Message to ray bEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I find people who call others trolls

are the TROLLS

BTW an other buybull story the EXODUS
IS A LIE
no evidence of massive numbers of jews in egypt
before the greeks 300bce al the G and his boys
not abes time or joes or moses time

no pottery no egyptian notice of the whole crazy story

pot shards DO NOT lie
they lay around forever
pot shards say never in egypt in numbers worth note
jews evolved in the hills of the holyland that was ruled by egypt
sorry but not what the buybull claims


broken bits of pottery never lies it lays where it was broken
it is in the hills never by the nile


btw 2 no chit in the sinai desert
the claimed numbers for 40 years in a desert
there should be mounds of poop big mounds dry desert stuff never goes away
no poop no people no exodus no conquest no empire or even a kingdom

and no broken pots
say the buybull lied
no real history before 600 bce
no flood
no babal
no eden [note no angel with flaming swords as claimed]
no exodus
no zombie man/god

see a trend ?
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Report this Post10-24-2023 05:47 PM Click Here to See the Profile for rinselbergClick Here to visit rinselberg's HomePageSend a Private Message to rinselbergEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by olejoedad:
Who the f*** is Tom Friedman? Who cares what he thinks?

Of course you think that is a plan.

I think I had that same thought myself, even before I saw Friedman's op-ed in the NYT.

[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 10-24-2023).]

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Report this Post10-24-2023 05:54 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Jake_DragonSend a Private Message to Jake_DragonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by ray b:

I find people who call others trolls

are the TROLLS

BTW an other buybull story the EXODUS
IS A LIE
no evidence of massive numbers of jews in egypt
before the greeks 300bce al the G and his boys
not abes time or joes or moses time

no pottery no egyptian notice of the whole crazy story

pot shards DO NOT lie
they lay around forever
pot shards say never in egypt in numbers worth note
jews evolved in the hills of the holyland that was ruled by egypt
sorry but not what the buybull claims


broken bits of pottery never lies it lays where it was broken
it is in the hills never by the nile


btw 2 no chit in the sinai desert
the claimed numbers for 40 years in a desert
there should be mounds of poop big mounds dry desert stuff never goes away
no poop no people no exodus no conquest no empire or even a kingdom

and no broken pots
say the buybull lied
no real history before 600 bce
no flood
no babal
no eden [note no angel with flaming swords as claimed]
no exodus
no zombie man/god

see a trend ?


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