What exact part of my post was "not cool"? Tell me! Everything stated there is a fact.
1) "As the Secret Service try to hustle Trump off the stage..." Did this not occur?
2) "... he says Wait". Listen to the video(s). He actually says... "Wait, wait, wait". Or maybe that was Joe Biden shouting from the wings.
3) "... so that he can fist pump the crowd." Did Trump not fist pump the crowd?
4) "Meanwhile, just a few feet behind him, a Trump supporter lies dead with his brains blown out." Regrettably, that's also true. Are you suggesting the unfortunate victim had not been sitting behind Trump or what?
5) "Trump, ever the showman." Okay, you got me there. Donald Trump is actually a very shy introvert who never wishes to draw attention to himself. And he has large hands.
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Originally posted by Patrick:
As the Secret Service try to hustle Trump off the stage, he says "Wait"... so that he can fist pump the crowd. Meanwhile, just a few feet behind him, a Trump supporter lies dead with his brains blown out.
I am actually surprised there have not been more attempts on both candidates.
Even on this forum I have seen multiple posts about having to "shoot our way out of" political problems instead of voting to fix them and wondering how long it will be until the shooting has to start. And those comments were not coming from a "leftist".
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Originally posted by BingB:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by williegoat:
Post a link.
Fred-Bing obliges williegoat:
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Originally posted by randye:
As someone once said about where we seem to be headed: "You can vote your way in but you have to shoot your way out."
I've always wanted to ask Dr. Hansen, based on his historical knowledge, at what point does he think that "the guns will come out."
"The law of unintended consequences" that may be coming could very well be swift and horrifying beyond imagination.
For somebody that "claims" to be a "history teacher", you are either one massive LIAR or the DUMBEST SOB that was ever hired to teach history.
You (should) know damn well that I was QUOTING a saying about Marxism / Socialism that is older, and far, far, wiser than you are, or ever will be.
If want to try to accuse anyone here of promoting gun and/or political violence look to your own Leftist ideology. You have a very long history of it.
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 07-14-2024).]
Oh come on, is this the best you can do??!!! Are you going to allow this Canadian sonofabitch to dare express an opinion on a political forum about Donald Trump!!!! Show some balls, get all your MAGA buddies, who maybe haven't posted here for a few years, to "come on down" and show this obstinate Canuck that you will not tolerate a differing viewpoint from your own. This forum is open for business 24 hours a day. Keep the negs flying in. Put an end to free speech, at least from those ignorant northern bastards in Canada. All hail the Mighty Orange!
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Originally posted by Patrick:
Keep those cards and letters and negative ratings coming! Some of you guys can't handle the truth.
Thanks to olejoedad for the link in another thread of this very on point post by Victor Davis Hanson
Victor Davis Hanson
Assassination **** and the Sickness on the Left
If we were leftists and we were to use leftist tropes to editorialize the recent attempt on Trump’s life, then we would frame the assassination attempt in the following way:
We have witnessed for years blatant exceptions to the once common custom that we don’t normalize the imagined killing of any president or presidential candidate and thus lower the bar of violence.
But the Left constantly makes Trump an exception. Now, it as if the imagined killing of Trump had been mainstreamed and become acceptable in a way inconceivable of other presidents.
(Do we remember the rodeo clown who merely wore an Obama mask during a bull riding contest and was punished by being permanently banned by the Missouri State Fair authorities?)
So since at least 2016 there has been a parlor game among Leftist celebrities and entertainers joking (one hopes), dreaming, imagining, and just talking about the various and graphic ways they would like to assassinate or seriously injure Trump:
By slugging his face (Robert De Niro), by decapitation (Kathy Griffin, Marilyn Manson), by stabbing (Shakespeare in the Park), by clubbing (Mickey Rourke), by shooting ( Snoop Dogg), by poisoning (Anthony Bourdain), by bounty killing (George Lopez), by carrion eating his corpse (Pearl Jam), by suffocating (Larry Whilmore), by blowing him up (Madonna, Moby), by throwing him over a cliff (Rosie O’Donnell), just by generic “killing” him (Johnny Depp, Big Sean), or by martyring him (Reid Hoffman: “Yeah, I wish I had made him an actual martyr.”).
Or should we deplore the use of telescopic scope imagery, given that the Left blamed Sarah Palin for once using bullseye spots on an election map of opposition congressional districts, claiming that such usage had incited the mass shooting by Jared Lee Loughner?
Yet, recently POTUS Joe Biden was a little bit more graphic and a lot more literal.
In a widely reported call to hundreds of donors last week, Biden boasted, “I have one job, and that’s to beat Donald Trump. I’m absolutely certain I’m the best person to be able to do that. So, we’re done talking about the debate, it’s time to put Trump in a bullseye.”
"In a bullseye?”
At least, Biden did not go back to the full Biden beat-up **** of the past (e.g., “If we were in high school, I’d take him behind the gym and beat the hell out of him"/ “The press always asks me, ‘Don’t I wish I were debating him?’ No, I wish we were in high school – I could take him behind the gym. That’s what I wish.”).
Then there is the question of the Secret Service and one’s political opponents. Given the tragic history of the Kennedys, why in the world did the Biden administration not insist that third-party candidate Robert Kennedy, Jr. be accorded Secret Service protection? Because his candidacy was felt to be disadvantageous to Biden?
And why just this April would the former head of the January 6th Committee and 2004 election obstructionist Rep. Bennie Thompson (D-Miss.) introduce legislation ridiculously entitled, “Denying Infinite Security and Government Resources Allocated toward Convicted and Extremely Dishonorable (DISGRACED) Former Protectees Act” to strip away Secret Service protection for former President Trump and by this April current leading presidential candidate?
Had Thompson’s bill passed, would that not have been confirmation for a potential shooter to feel his task was just made much easier?
But in a wider sense, if the common referent day after day on the Left is that Trump is another Hitler (cf. a recent The New Republic cover where Trump is literally photoshopped as Hitler), then it seems reckless not to imagine an unhinged or young shootist believing that by taking out somewhat identical to one of the greatest mass murderers in history, he would be applauded for his violence?
So is their logic, shoot Trump and save six million from the gas chambers?
After all, The New Republic defiantly explained their Hitler-Trump cover photo this way, "Today, we at The New Republic think we can spend this election year in one of two ways. We can spend it debating whether Trump meets the nine or 17 points that define fascism. Or we can spend it saying, “He’s damn close enough, and we’d better fight.”
Well, New Republic, recently someone took you up on your argument that Trump was “damn close enough” to Hitler and so he likewise chose to “fight”— albeit with a semi-automatic rifle.
If ad nauseam, a Joy Reid is screaming about Trump as a Hitlerian dictator ("Then let me know who I got to vote for to keep Hitler out of the White House”) or Rachel Maddow is bloviating about studying Hitler to understand Trump, then finally the message sinks in that a mass murderer is about to take power—unless....
Finally, the idea, if true, that bystanders spotted a 20-year-old on a nearby roof with a gun, a mere 130 yards from Trump, and in vain warned police of his presence, is surreal.
Is it all that hard for the Secret Service to post a few agents on the tops of a few surrounding buildings closest to the dais, or at least coordinate with local law enforcement to do the same?
That is a no brainer. Whoever made the decisions concerning the proper secret service security details for presidential events should be immediately fired.
I'm genuinely astonished that anyone knows the "proper" way to react in such a situation. Saying Trump endangered people's lives by fist pumping the audience is just as ridiculous as claiming he should have left immediately. There's no way to know beforehand what the outcome of either action would be, and I strongly disagree that one would be inherently "safer" than the other. What if the shooter hadn't been taken down yet? By moving through the crowd he would have actually endangered more people. Point being, in the moment, there's no way to tell what would be "the best thing to do".
Also, I'm equally surprised by how people are making this about themselves. Half of this thread consists of personal attacks. And people defending themselves. And I'm not talking about shooter/Trump/audience. I'm talking about members here. A tragic event occurred. Something truly horrendous. And instead of focusing on the issue at hand, people are quick to shout "See? I was right! You were wrong!".
Whether you like Trump or not, whether you're a Republican or a Democrat, an ex-president and possible future president just got shot, and by some miracle, he didn't die in the attempt. The polarization in the US has become so intense that instead of bringing people together, this incident is being used to fortify existing divisions.
There is something seriously wrong in your country, and it's not Trump or Biden. It's the people who are entrenched in their sides.
I'm genuinely astonished that anyone knows the "proper" way to react in such a situation. Saying Trump endangered people's lives by fist pumping the audience is just as ridiculous as claiming he should have left immediately. There's no way to know beforehand what the outcome of either action would be, and I strongly disagree that one would be inherently "safer" than the other. What if the shooter hadn't been taken down yet? By moving through the crowd he would have actually endangered more people. Point being, in the moment, there's no way to tell what would be "the best thing to do".
Also, I'm equally surprised by how people are making this about themselves. Half of this thread consists of personal attacks. And people defending themselves. And I'm not talking about shooter/Trump/audience. I'm talking about members here. A tragic event occurred. Something truly horrendous. And instead of focusing on the issue at hand, people are quick to shout "See? I was right! You were wrong!".
Whether you like Trump or not, whether you're a Republican or a Democrat, an ex-president and possible future president just got shot, and by some miracle, he didn't die in the attempt. The polarization in the US has become so intense that instead of bringing people together, this incident is being used to fortify existing divisions.
There is something seriously wrong in your country, and it's not Trump or Biden. It's the people who are entrenched in their sides.
Originally posted by Cliff Pennock: ... Whether you like Trump or not, whether you're a Republican or a Democrat, an ex-president and possible future president just got shot, and by some miracle, he didn't die in the attempt. The polarization in the US has become so intense that instead of bringing people together, this incident is being used to fortify existing divisions.
There is something seriously wrong in your country, and it's not Trump or Biden. It's the people who are entrenched in their sides.
Business as usual, sadly.
I've had Fiero - and other - friends (not referring to the people here - people who I know in real life) who just refuse to associate with me because of my moderately right leaning views. I have never refused to associate with anybody just for that.
I fear that as the migration into European countries increases, so will the polarization.
The USA has never been a homogeneous country, we are all immigrants at some time in our history.
European countries are (were) still made up of people who have deep roots to their country, i.e. Germans, French, Poles and etc.
The immigration laws in America's past allowed for integration of newcomers into our society due to quotas. Those days are gone, and we see the results now.
Europe is starting to see the problems of unfettered immigration; I fear their problems will get much worse.
What bothers me Is the fact that a 20 year old could be consumed by so much hate. He was to the point that he wanted to end his life and others. When I was 20 the most important things in life was work, drinking beer and chasing girls.
I agree with one of those, but my '20' was probably a lot different than most people here, when they were 20.
[/U] I agree with one of those, but my '20' was probably a lot different than most people here, when they were 20.
I was a slacker. I didn't have a care in the world, didn't think about anything other than what went on in my immediate life and how these things affected me directly, and served no benefit to anyone unless you were shopping for supplies at Scotty's Hardware.
I'm genuinely astonished that anyone knows the "proper" way to react in such a situation. Saying Trump endangered people's lives by fist pumping the audience is just as ridiculous as claiming he should have left immediately. There's no way to know beforehand what the outcome of either action would be, and I strongly disagree that one would be inherently "safer" than the other. What if the shooter hadn't been taken down yet? By moving through the crowd he would have actually endangered more people. Point being, in the moment, there's no way to tell what would be "the best thing to do".
Also, I'm equally surprised by how people are making this about themselves. Half of this thread consists of personal attacks. And people defending themselves. And I'm not talking about shooter/Trump/audience. I'm talking about members here. A tragic event occurred. Something truly horrendous. And instead of focusing on the issue at hand, people are quick to shout "See? I was right! You were wrong!".
Whether you like Trump or not, whether you're a Republican or a Democrat, an ex-president and possible future president just got shot, and by some miracle, he didn't die in the attempt. The polarization in the US has become so intense that instead of bringing people together, this incident is being used to fortify existing divisions.
There is something seriously wrong in your country, and it's not Trump or Biden. It's the people who are entrenched in their sides.
I agree. However, it's pretty fair to also say, that there has always been (by some foreign standards anyway) , "something seriously wrong with [our] country" even before it was a country. It's just 'the way' of this country and always has been. The lists of political successful, unsuccessful assassinations, and violent political plots in America dates back to the early 1800s with numerous plots all areas of Federal and State politicos having been twarted even in the years right after the American Revolution. https://en.wikipedia.org/wi...American_politicians
For most of our modern time, political anger stayed in the grass roots, person to person and didn't even make the local papers, much less TV. I saw it personally in the months leading up to the 1964 election when an argument broke out at our kitchen table between the 3 adult couples there playing dominoes. It mostly involved my father (a staunch Democrat) and the wife of one of his co-workers (both Republicans). She, was a delegate to the State Republican Conventin and midway thru the discussion, stood up, swpt my father's dominoes off the table and declared" This started back with FDR and the New Deal so you just as well get your ass back there!". It went downhill from there.
Now, as boomers die off, younger, more publicly vocal generations and the internet have allowed that sort of thing to be 'in your face' globally and all the world sees & hears it, but........ it's always been there.
Now, I don't really see this as a "political" assassination. At least not in the usual sense. Not like Mexico.
I see this more like the "angry young white boy" shootings that have been in the news for a couple of decades now. If Trump wasn't in town, he would have shot up a bowling alley or a grocery store.
Originally posted by williegoat: Now, I don't really see this as a "political" assassination. At least not in the usual sense. Not like Mexico.
I see this more like the "angry young white boy" shootings that have been in the news for a couple of decades now. If Trump wasn't in town, he would have shot up a bowling alley or a grocery store.
Probably, or his previous rifle team, which had excluded him because of poor marksmanship (assuming the news reports are correct).
I'm genuinely astonished that anyone knows the "proper" way to react in such a situation. Saying Trump endangered people's lives by fist pumping the audience is just as ridiculous as...
I don't have any inside information... but I somehow doubt that world leaders are instructed by their security staff to delay their removal from the scene of an active shooting so that they can stop and fist pump the crowd. Call me crazy (or any other number of pleasantries mentioned in this thread), but I suspect immediate and swift removal from the scene is of prime consideration.
Cliff, we can agree to disagree... like civilized people do.
