Any one who has been to Arlington National Cemetery and came away unchanged has no understanding of why it's considered Hallowed ground. Donald Trump's behavior there was completely disgusting. By his action there, Donald Trump has no place anywhere near the title, Commander in Chief.
Any one who has been to Arlington National Cemetery and came away unchanged has no understanding of why it's considered Hallowed ground. Donald Trump's behavior there was completely disgusting. By his action there, Donald Trump has no place anywhere near the title, Commander in Chief.
The converse could be said... that anyone who would check their watch during the time that deceased soldiers are being removed from C130s, and the person who is directly responsible for putting them in that situation (and why they are dead today)... can't be bothered to visit their graves... that's more disgusting. It could also be that the person, like you, who is using Trump's visiting of the cemetery as a political weapon is just as disgusting. I realize you're a Democrat, and for you it's much more than politics, it's your ideology... perhaps even your religion.
But there's a reason why the U.S. military is now the smallest it's been in over 80 years. Everyone is leaving... in 2022, they missed their recruitment goal by over 60%... and each year, they've dropped that number by 25% so the miss doesn't appear as bad. But their recruitment is down more than 75% from 2022.
You, old man... who's never spent a minute of your life serving your country, wouldn't understand. When I left the agency, I left along with nearly 10+ thousand military and civilians that all just quit because we were so horrified by the complete and total failure of the pull out in Afghanistan. We were getting calls at our desks from the people who'd helped us, and we were instructed at one point to send them to another number, and then finally... not to answer the calls at all.
It's people like you who disgust me... the people who literally VOTED for these policies. It's like how California has effectively been turned into a **** -hole, and then they're upset and confused as to how it turned out this way when it's literally as a result of the policies they voted for. Look in a mirror old man. For all your old age "wisdom," you're one of the most misguided people on here directly behind the psychopath Fred/Jim/Bing who keeps creating fake accounts and making up fake personas.
It could also be that the person, like you, who is using Trump's visiting of the cemetery as a political weapon is just as disgusting.
I would not have had any problem with Trump attending this ceremony if he had not just used it for political purposes. It was a stunt and it used our dead military men as props.
Biden and Harris were not invited. It was a set up so that the right wing media could attack them for not being there.
If it had not been a political set up then Trump would not have had any reason to have it filmed.
But there's a reason why the U.S. military is now the smallest it's been in over 80 years. Everyone is leaving... in 2022, they missed their recruitment goal by over 60%... and each year, they've dropped that number by 25% so the miss doesn't appear as bad. But their recruitment is down more than 75% from 2022..
But no Biden policy has anything to do with the samller size.
Military has been getting smakller and having trouble recruiting for year. There has been research done on the reason. I have showed you the reasons. They are not tied to any Biden policy.
If you have any proof from any study I would like to see it. Your make believe anecdotal evidence is not very convincing.
Originally posted by BingB: But no Biden policy has anything to do with the samller size.
Military has been getting smakller and having trouble recruiting for year. There has been research done on the reason. I have showed you the reasons. They are not tied to any Biden policy.
If you have any proof from any study I would like to see it. Your make believe anecdotal evidence is not very convincing.
Military recruitment, and the size of the military went down under Bush's last term, and went up in Obama's first term, but down significantly in Obama's second term (erasing all the gains he had in the first term). BUT... military recruitment was up from the start of 2016 through 2018... for 3 years, it made slight improvements, and the military grew (as did DoD Civilian service). It was down slightly as a result of COVID, but the military still made 100% of its recruitment goals in 2019 and 2020. Then it dropped SIGNIFICANTLY after the pull out in Afghanistan in 2021, and it's been in a free-fall ever since. Even when they cut their recruitment goals by 20-25%, they still couldn't meet their recruitment numbers. There are very few places that show these numbers in graphs. It's actually extremely frustrating... and this is the same for almost any statistic. Almost nothing shows figures from during the Trump presidency in contrast with everything else. There's always tons of graphs and charts BEFORE, and then a few AFTER (2021+), but nothing that ever shows Trump's information in contrast to the other presidents. This information is available, as government reporting standards didn't change under Trump at all (they've actually decreased under Biden), but for some reason... no major news agency wants to put these in a chart.
You can defend Biden all you want... but people joined the military for two reasons:
1 - To serve their country and be a part of something bigger than themselves. 2 - Get out of poverty and do something with their lives.
For #1 especially... no one was excited to join the military under Biden. There are no masses of people who felt particularly patriotic because Biden won the election. Democrats were just happy that Trump wasn't inaugurated, and couldn't have cared less who it was that won. Biden has never given an inspirational speech, and he's been effectively senile for his entire presidency. Even still... people who still wanted to serve their country would have joined the military regardless... but after the pull out in Afghanistan... it changed people entirely. We felt as though we betrayed the country, and everyone else. For a long time I personally felt as though I'd betrayed both America and Afghanistan. I cried at my desk for two months straight, until I finally quit. We had more suicides at the agency in 2021 than at any time in history, but it fell 2022, and has continued to go down since (thankfully). I was never suicidal, I never saw the point in it, but I had severe depression from it, and I saw no other option than to leave... I felt that things had changed so much that there was no point in being there, and that we weren't even "serving" anymore. My coworker was an avowed Communist, had an English literature degree, despite being given a critical technical role for which he had absolutely no clue. He was a diversity hire. The agency, for example... lost more than half of its workforce in that one year. Matter of fact, it's now 1/4th the size it was in say... 2019.
In addition to all of those stressors, the continued push for DEI throughout the agency was just another nail in the coffin for most people. You wouldn't have a clue about this, but the entirety of government looks exactly like NASA does right now... a shell of its former self. I laugh when I see TV shows that show NSA employees with joysticks to control satellites... not only does the NRO do that, but we no longer have half the technology we used to. We used to make our own processors, even create our own crypto. All of this expertise left the NSA, the CIA, and all the other organizations over the last three years. These agencies are no longer innovative at all... they're just organizations that manage defense contracts now. Everything is being done by defense contractors now because no one wants to work for the government, and they've effectively destroyed themselves.
[This message has been edited by 82-T/A [At Work] (edited 08-31-2024).]
Let me repeat. "Any one who has been to Arlington National Cemetery and came away unchanged has no understanding of why it's considered Hallowed ground."
No I never served but somehow I understand what it means to those who did. For some reason, when facing a Veteran I stand just a bit taller and straighter out of respect.
Yes, Donald Trump is free to visit Arlington just like me and every one else. But unlike him, I understand what it is.
The point is that it was a private ceremony set up by Trump and the families. It was not any kind of public ceremony that Biden or Harris would have even known about.
It was a complete set up. And it exploited the use of Arlington National Cemetary for purely political purposes. If not then Trump would not have gone to the trouble to film it. That video is not news footage. It is Trump video production.
[This message has been edited by BingB (edited 08-31-2024).]
Originally posted by BingB: The point is that it was a private ceremony set up by Trump and the families. It was not any kind of public ceremony that Biden or Harris would have even known about.
It was a complete set up. And it exploited the use of Arlington National Cemetary for purely political purposes. If not then Trump would not have gone to the trouble to film it. That video is not news footage. It is Trump video production.
Yes. Not only is it illegal to use it for political purposes but it is just plain wrong.
Oh the disgrace! The dishonor of having cameras around when honoring dead soldiers! This is clearly a publicity stunt.
It must have been a long ceremony for 13 dead.
Are the pearl clutchers just as angry at the president that got those men and women killed?
The ceremony that Trump attended:
I looked for a picture of Trump looking at his watch or phone during the ceremony. I could not find one.
You are completely missing the main point.
The Biden footage is from PUBLIC MEDIA at a PUBLIC event.
When Trump went to section 60 of Arlington National Cemetary the public media was not allowed. It was a private ceremony. But Trump had his own private video production unit filming and taking pictures. This was part of a set up. They were going to use the footage and criticize Biden and Harris for not being there when it was a private ceremony that they were not invited to.
The Biden footage is from PUBLIC MEDIA at a PUBLIC event.
When Trump went to section 60 of Arlington National Cemetary the public media was not allowed. It was a private ceremony. But Trump had his own private video production unit filming and taking pictures. This was part of a set up. They were going to use the footage and criticize Biden and Harris for not being there when it was a private ceremony that they were not invited to.
You are a fool. Watch the video I posted at the top of this thread.
Stop using the sacrifice of others for your personal gratification.
You are a fool. Watch the video I posted at the top of this thread.
If YOU watch it you will see that it was all shot at the Tomb of the unknown Soldier. Public Media was allowed there. It was the video and photos from section 60 that are at issue. Nothing in the video you posted was from section 60.
If YOU watch it you will see that it was all shot at the Tomb of the unknown Soldier. Public Media was allowed there. It was the video and photos from section 60 that are at issue. Nothing in the video you posted was from section 60.
LOL
You just proved that you did not watch the video.
"Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak and to remove all doubt."
If YOU watch it you will see that it was all shot at the Tomb of the unknown Soldier. Public Media was allowed there. It was the video and photos from section 60 that are at issue. Nothing in the video you posted was from section 60.
quote
Originally posted by williegoat:
You are a fool. Watch the video I posted at the top of this thread.
Stop using the sacrifice of others for your personal gratification.
I am fed up with your insolence.
If your goal was to piss some people off, you have succeeded.
The Biden footage is from PUBLIC MEDIA at a PUBLIC event.
The arrival of military caskets back on United States soil IS NOT a "public event".
Your level of ignorance and disrespect is appalling but not surprising coming from a Leftist.
I feel sick that I served my country, in part, to protect your sick disrespect of our military dead and my fellow veterans.
There are certain people in that video that you pretend to find so "offensive" that indicate 100% clearly that the ceremony was conducted legally and properly and the sad part of it is that you have no clue who those people are or what they do, otherwise you might have remained respectfully silent on a matter that you know nothing about.....
....but then again knowing who, and what, you are.....
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 08-31-2024).]
Originally posted by Yellow-88: Let me repeat. "Any one who has been to Arlington National Cemetery and came away unchanged has no understanding of why it's considered Hallowed ground."
Why is it considered hallowed ground any more than any other cemetery ? How was it desecrated ?
quote
Originally posted by Yellow-88: For some reason, when facing a Veteran I stand just a bit taller and straighter out of respect.
Because of Arlington Cemetery ?
In every cemetery I visit I come away changed. I many times look at many head stones, the dates they were born then died, survived by who, and I wonder about the deceased. I stand taller, straighter, my head bowed and hands clasps, and often say a prayer.
quote
Originally posted by BingB: I would not have had any problem with Trump attending this ceremony if he had not just used it for political purposes. It was a stunt and it used our dead military men as props.
Ahh, poor ButtB had his butt hurted, .
We know, you have no proof Trump attended this ceremony just to use it for political purposes. Which dead military men and women's survivors are complaining their deceased heros are ButtB hurt because their were used as props ?
Which political ad did his visit generate ?
quote
Originally posted by BingB: Biden and Harris were not invited. It was a set up so that the right wing media could attack them for not being there.
Does Biden and Harris need an invite to be there ? I heard Biden wasn't done beach frying his brain.
Originally posted by BingB: The point is that it was a private ceremony set up by Trump and the families. It was not any kind of public ceremony that Biden or Harris would have even known about.
Boo hoo. They did not plan one of their own ? Do you think the surviving families would have attended ?
quote
Originally posted by BingB: That video is not news footage.
Uhh, yes it is.
As BingB says, Biden or Harris would not have even known about it. Well, neither would the media. They were not there either.
Originally posted by Yellow-88: Yes. Not only is it illegal to use it for political purposes but it is just plain wrong.
Wrong ? Wrong ?
You guys piss on every body's cereal but hate it when yours get pissed on.
CNN captured video of the Roger Stone raid filming FBI SWAT jack booted thugs bang on the Roger Stones door, guns a pointed, at 6:00 AM in the morning. CNN reported that the FBI had government gun boats in the channel behind his house.
Roger Stone. A 72 year old man who was never arrested before.
Originally posted by randye: The arrival of military caskets back on United States soil IS NOT a "public event".
It was an official government ceremony. I don't know if the public was invited but it was not a private function set up by the families of the deceased. It was filmed by private media, not the Biden promotional team.
To sum up the purpose of this thread, Arlington Notational Cemetery is not just a cemetery, it's a symbol, a National monument dedicated to remembering who we are as a Nation. The perfectly polished marble tomb of the unknown solder, the perfectly polished soldiers who guard it and the rituals and ceremonies performed there remind us that we did not become a free nation easily. Deeply feeling that is what "changed" me when I visited.
Media based camera crews require permission to record there. Privet camera crews recording for personal political gain are not allowed. If asked to leave you must do so.
Joe Biden should not have checked his watch during the ceremony discussed here. Does he understand the purpose of the place? I think that his history and proven track record indicate that he does. He made a serious ethics error in public.
Donald Trump's history and track record indicate that he does not understand any of it. The smirk smile and thumbs up in that photo are proof of that.
I have no problem with him doing this with these families.
It is when he started using the footage on Truth Social to attack Biden that it became a problem. It was the only reason he filmed it. The fact that he immediately used it proves this.
What type of "support" does he expect? What should the government give to Gold Star families that they do not already receive. This is all just Political BS.
Here is some proof that Harris has supported the military and its veterans.
The Harris Biden administration passed the PACT Act.
Funds from the Presidents American Rescue Plan helped reduce homelessness among veterans by 11% over the first two years of his presidency. The largets drop in 5 years.
The Biden administration has extended military benefits for survivors of certain LGBTQ veterans.
In 2021 the Department of Labor launched the Employment Navigator Partnership Pilot (ENPP) to provide one-on-one career assistance to transitioning service members.
In 2022 the VA expanded the Program of Comprehensive Assistance for Family Caregivers to veterans of all service eras.
In 2022 the VA also announced $16 million in funding to help veterans participate in adaptive sports.
In 2022 the Department of Interior announced the availability of a free lifetime pass for veterans and Gold Star families to more than 2,000 federal recreation sites spread out across more than 400 million acres of public lands, including national parks, wildlife refuges, and forests.  
I don't know what these people expect. What happened to their families was a terrible tragedy, but they act like they are the only families ever to lose somebody in military service. The death of these 13 brave soldiers is not a national holiday. I don't know why they think their sacrifice is so much more than all the other families that lost loved ones in military service that they deserve a special day. This is just a big political football for Trump. He is not appearing at special services for the families of the 241 soldiers killed in the Beirut bombing, or the 18 killed in Mogadishu, or any of the thousands who died in Iraq. He is just playing politics because Biden was in office during the withdrawal from Afghanistan.
Biden honored these 13 soldiers when they were killed. He appeared at a special event when their bodies were flown back to the United States. He met with the families at that time. But there is nothing special about these 13 that justify the special treatment they expect.
The President acknowledged the death of his child and praised him for their duty. Biden never DISRESPECTED them in any way. Does this guy really expect the President of the United States to personally visit every family member of every veteran who died in duty every year forever? Or does he just think that he is special and deserves special treatment?
They keep talking about what Trump has done for them, but all he did was use them for political gain.
[This message has been edited by BingB (edited 09-01-2024).]
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