Bump

EDIT: Hey, first time I own a page I haven't started... :-)

[This message has been edited by yellowstone (edited 01-10-2005).]

I saw your post about a year ago and lost your picture of the ground install...

Who ever reposted this information manny THANKS Big E........................!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!........................

Just saw this. Guess I'll have to give it a try, off to Sound Track I go to get some 0 Guage wiring! This sounds like fun. Can you tell I'm bored? I'll post with results.

quote Originally posted by jscott1: Were you serious about the $19.99 kit? I would like to add a ground strap without searching all over for 2 gauge wire or whatever it should be.

You shouldn't have to search all over. I got my 2 guage wire from autozone (just a battery cable replacement kit. Was like 5 bucks.) along with the ends I just crimpped on. Perfect size on the engine block end and just a tad too big on the frame end. Just threw a washer on and was set.

Not really any point in getting expensive audio ground wire or anything special. The 2 guage from Autozone is more than heavy enough, and it was the perfect length.

-Randy

[This message has been edited by debug (edited 01-15-2005).]

hmm i just got my v6 88 forumla and it too idles a little bit crazy between 800 and 1500 rpm, so the ground stap acually works huh? so where again does it go exactly?

Alright....you were right an it worked for me as well. My guages used to jump around alot and the idle was pretty rough. Turns out the previous owner installed grounding straps to the exhaust manifold but ran them to a heavily painted bracket for the motor vents...UGH!. Luckily I have a battery w/ both side mounts and top posts. Used the extra top post to run a couple of grounds...extra to the body and two to the motor. Seems to have made quite a difference in performance and the guages.

Thanks for the post.

Frank

so several ground straps are needed?, i put a pinky finger thickness ground from the egr bracket bolt to the spot on the hood hinge that there was already a ground hooked up at, is that ok or should it be elsewhere?.

I did the 4 gauge ground and now it doesnt seem to work as well. I guess I'll have to add a couple more grounds.
I have 1 to the EGR bolt.

i would think that one from the neg- directly on the battery to the EGR Bolt (clenaed, and crus free should be more than enough, i dont see any reason to cludder your engine bay with 15 ground straps that just dosent make sence,

on mine as i had previously stated i started out with just the original strap gooing from EGR to frame, but then i added another loop over to the - on the battery and all is good, a great improvment over stock!!
good luck, an thanks for all the +'s they have been returned

This is what ended up doing. Added an audio cable (fat red cable in pix)...

Neg. battery:

To ground, just below battery:

To EGR bolt (hard to photograph):

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www.yellowfiero.com/fiero.html
17" DEZENT T wheels with 215/40 tires front and 235/45 rear, KONI shocks, EIBACH lowering springs, PU dog bone, bushings and engine mounts, K&N air and oil filters, OZELOT exhaust, Mercedes SLK yellow, Mr. Mikes seats, door skins, shift and e-brake boots. MP3 player and custom subwoofer behind passenger seat, F355 style front. Fiero Store rear swaybar, strut tower brace, black carpet. Rodney Dickman's competition short shifter. Billet aluminum dash kit from Kitcarman.

Bump this to the top.
My car had all of these symptoms when it had the motor in it. When it goes back in I will definately have to add a ground strap and see if there is a difference. + to ya $Rich$.

Where do i send the $19.95...?

huh? $19.95

I started working on my V6 the other day since its out of the car. It was the 1st time I really looked at the motor since it was out. Looked at the negative battery cable and it had NO ground strap! It looked like it was attached to the intake plenum at one time but had been cut. So when it goes back in I'm expecting it to make quite a difference.

I will be completing this mod tomorrow. Do any of you know if you get a shock from a car because it is not grounded properly?

Galen

bump for the Noobies

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Rich AIM: ONE FAST 2M8:

quote Originally posted by Boondawg: "I hate it when people blow Crackfumes in my face when I'm trying to smoke Heroin!" ;)

Did it last week! I had my battery out so I could repaint the tray and figured this would be a good time to do it. I mimicked the way Yellowstone did his.

I can't honestly brag of any huge differences but I figured it wouldn't hurt and she always runs weird for the first 250 miles after disconnecting the battery so maybe I'll notice the difference when she smooths out

Ok, just ran outside to check the Formula's grounds.

I've been having trouble with the tachometer as long as I can remember (sits at or near zero, then at about 3k RPM it seems to work - I've replaced the tach filter, but no improvement). I also replaced the temp gauge sensor recently, and it's reading about 10F higher than it should be (see previous thread). My volt gauge flutters as do headlights. I'm suspecting the alternator's voltage regulator is shot, but naturally I'll try the cheap fixes first.

I just checked with my el cheapo ohmmeter for resistance between the negative battery terminal and frame, from battery to block (bolt that holds dogbone to block), and from frame to block. No measurable resistance. I can add the cable, as it's pretty braindead to do, but I'm not expecting anything given my meter's readings.

For those who have benefitted, did you check for resistance prior to doing the mod?

i never did, but the differance was obviously noticeable for sure
like night and day

Bump

I cleaned the mounting points and eyelets for the lead from battery to chassis, from engine to hinge (braided wire), from firewall to hinge (on the driver's side), and one in the front under the passenger's side headlight.

The result? The tachometer is working better (not 100% correct, but it registers 600 or so at idle, and once above 1200 RPMs or so it seems pretty correct. This in contrast to not doing anything at all until at least 3000 RPM. The engine, while still misfiring a bit at idle, is buttery smooth when driving. Very nice indeed!

Voltmeter still flutters, temp gauge is still wrong, and the tach isn't 100%. I'm not sure why the temp gauge keeps reading so high (idiot light doesn't come on, yet the needle gets into the red zone before the fan kicks on), but whatever.

So it made a difference, that's for sure. And for what it cost, definitely worth it.

I've been having some trouble with my '87 GT and all of the parts in question seem good. I haven't had anytime to finish up the diagnostics for the last two months, but saw this post come alive and I think that may be my problem after looking at the grounds on my Fiero. I would like to put in GREEN heavy wire though since I have seen a lot of grounds on other electrical things in green. I do like the looks of the Red monster cable as well as the blue cabling in some of the pics above. When I locate a huge green cable and install it (hopefully this week) I will post a pic. Seems like ensuring a good ground is very important on these older babies and taken too much for granted.

my fron't left blinker is still messed up, they won't flash but will come on in the day, but still not very bright, and when my lights are on they won't even come on. Could my ground have anything to do with this?

quote Originally posted by $Rich$:

I wan't everyone to look at what else $Rich$ has done for his engine: Not only are the paths to ground twenty years old and corroded, but the vacuum lines have seen their day as well. Two decades does nothing for the flixibility and resiliance of rubber. Not to mention the legendary Fiero's hot engine compartment. Most of our engines are filled with tiny vacuum leaks around the crusty old hoses. (I bumped the cruise control vacuum solenoid last week, and one of the hoses exploded into dust.)

But $Rich$ has placed zip ties at the connection points! Get another ten years out of those hoses! I'm amazed at the variety of "rough idle" and "stumbling" and poor gas milage problems a vacuum leak will cause. Well, that, and it used to sound like 8 guys whistling in my engine bay. lol

ya, the old hoses dont fit tight anymore, so i zip tie'd them, it cured my code 32 from the EGR solinoid

another cheep fix if your too cheep to buy new vac. line... rubber washer fluid line is like 1/3 of the price of vac. line and it does the same job

I added a couple extra grounds (1 to engine block, 1 to rear decklid mount) and lightly dremmelled all the contact surfaces tonight. Night and day difference. No kidding, the windows and lights actually do seem to move faster, idle doesn't stumble when I turn the air on anymore, voltmeter reads more rock steady 14v and it does feel like it's running smoother....
good stuff

pulled the IAC and cleaned too. Wasn't too grimy, but I do think it helped.

I think I'm gonna try driving it to work tomorrow (100 miles r/t on I94). It's tough to trust it, but wtf ? wish me luch....

'86 GT - 62k miles

[This message has been edited by D B Cooper (edited 07-20-2005).]

its prooven to work, and nearly a free mod, everyone should do it, even if your fiero is low mileage!!

it works... plain and simple!!

I actually got my car because of a bad ground issue. When I went to buy the car the guy said there was nothing wrong with it and had a long list of parts replaced and work done to it w/ receipts to boot. I had driven all the way to Louisville, KT to get the car. Took a short test drive and paid for the car and started the drive home. Shortly after getting on the H-way the bucked. It would buck if I tryed to hold a steady speed. If I varied the trottle it would run fine. So I get the car home and replace the TPS. No help. Well I looked at or replaced all the usuall suspects for this type of problem. No help. I went to the internet to see if I could find an answer. After going over lots of posts I came across one that really fit the bill. I even said "This guy is having the exact same problem as me". He said in his post that he had stumped 3 GM mechanics and still could not fix the problem.I read on and realized I had tryed everything that people had suggested. I read on to find out that he said if couldnt get it figured out soon he was going to sell the POS. Thats when I noticed his screen name. It was the guy that sold me my Fiero. $#^%#^$*&%(*^()*^*(GJ *^R*^$^$&^$(*T% (&X(*T (I&T!!! Anyway after many days of driving around with a fluke meter hooked up to everything i could think of I figured out that every time it would try to go into open loop it would buck. Also realized that the O2 sensor would drop out at the same time. It turned out to be the 2 ground points from the main harness attached to the drivers side of the forward cyl head were loose. Tightened them up problem solved. Sorry for the long post but I had to tell somebody my story about the %^$&^$ that sold me his POS Fiero. LOL

so... who was it??
you should tell him what a simple fix it was and kind of rub it in a bit

I did call him after I fixed it. I asked him if he was SURE there was nothing wrong with the car. He said "Worked fine before I sold it to you". I said thats funny the forum post I found with your name on it says different. He started studdering around about how he had it fixed blah blah blah. I told him how I fixed it and thanked him for the awesome running car.LOL

BUMP since I saw this for the first time and hope others benefit as well. Can't wait to try it out. Thanks $Rich$!!

WOW good to see this back up again
even if you dont have any isle or problems at all, this simple mod cant hurt
and might be well worth your 10 min to put one on

Here's a "techie" explanation to why this works.

The engine sensors are grounded through the block and then to the frame then to the battery. The computer has it's own ground return. When the voltage of the sensors is measured by the computer, it is relative to the "ground" AT THE COMPUTER. Now if you have a minor 10 ohms of resistance from the computer's ground point to the sensors, and the computer and other electronics ar carying 3 amps through this resistance, the sensor's out put will apear to be the intended output plus the voltage dropped across the bad ground! this can easily double some signal values.

I have an INTENSE background in developing IR sensors measuring voltages to .000001 volts resolution. Please believe me that "ground" is a relative term! the more straps you can add is usually better IF they all return to a single point. Adding straps in a leap-frogging fashion can actually cause ground loops which cause the effect initially mentioned.

So, YES, Add grounding straps if you can! but do it smart and single point those straps!

yes, it is always a good idea to run multiple grounds to a single grounding point if possible
i would also like to add that my windows and headlights go up faster now that i have added an Optima Yellow top... what an amazing battery not cheep, but verry nice

[This message has been edited by $Rich$ (edited 09-26-2005).]

Well I grounded my sad little bomb and apparently I had a good ground already - no noticealbe change.

galen

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Make it FAST or don't make it :)

LITTLE RED BOMB..............Someday it will be mine..The Teacher
www.velocityaircraft.com

* bumb *

seems we got a few few newbs who should read this thread.

good power is VERY important for smooth idle

also, an addition: last weekend I re-did the 4 fuseable links under the C500 connector. this is main power distribution in the car. my headlights are brighter, power windows faster, and car seems just a little more happy.

good clean power is a must for a ECM controlled car. many sensor outputs will fluctuate with power fluctuations, so the ECM wont get good readings, and make correct adjustments. if your idle slowly goes up & down 200-400 rpm, this may be whats casuing it - not getting enough/good power at idle, so sensors read a little off, ECM adjust idle up, power goes up, sensors read right, ECM adjusts again, idle goes back to normal, power goes down, sensors dont read right, etc etc.

After following this thread for a while I had at it today on my 1985 4 cyl automatic. The car always ran pretty well but I had a few problems. The engine would surge violently whenever I would turn on the heat, defrost, etc. The dash bulbs were also dim. I cleaned the existing grounds then added another 4 guage ground from the neg battery terminal to the engine block. The surge is gone and the engine purs like a 4 cyl kitten. The dash bulbs are brighter also. This mod works and at less than 5 bucks and a half hour labor everyone should do it. I will do my 86 GT tommorrow. A big thanks to Saint $RICH$

Kevin

quote Originally posted by $Rich$: yes, it is always a good idea to run multiple grounds to a single grounding point if possible i would also like to add that my windows and headlights go up faster now that i have added an Optima Yellow top... what an amazing battery not cheep, but verry nice

I've been wondering about the Optima batteries. Is the yellow one best for our cars?

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Wow!!!!

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'87 Fiero GT Fastback Auto.