I agree with your last statement. Use the same paint and spray it on in a few hours and be done with it..... The only real cost if you have a free booth and gun is you might use more paint. Your still getting a pretty cheap paintjob costwise. Seems to me rollering and sanding on coat after coat is a huge time pit. I could sand and spray the hood with like 3 coats and be done with it in an hour. May not even have to sand it if it flows nice.
Actually that is what I did with my decklid and wing on the last car I had. I basically sanded, wiped it down with mineral spirits, let it dry, tack clothed the pieces off, and then sprayed three decent coats on there. It actually went on really nice and smooth and the red I used was VERY BRIGHT!! It was actually a nicer color than the red on the car was. It did take several hours to dry between coats and I used some of that penetrol and reduced the paint with the odorless mineral spirits as has been suggested on Rolledon.com forums. It went on smooth and nice and I could wetsand it in a few hours of application. I basically let all the parts dry for like three or four days after I finished spraying them and then started to wetsand and buff it. The final wetsand and buffing REALLY makes it shine nice and gives it a professional look. There are several fiero's on here that have been done properly and look pretty damn good. Rolling it on certainly adds a considerable amount of work but you can do it about anywhere without a compressor, paint booth, etc.... If it were not for the fact that decent quality automotive paints are now available online from several suppliers for good prices I would certainly do this again on my next car. It is cheap, appeared to weather well out in the sun at least here in Tennessee and is easily repairable which is a big deal IMHO. Getting chips and scratches on your new paint job sucks and if you have a base clear job you are kinda screwed and major work needs to be done to fix it sometimes. This paint can be rebuffed and touched up anytime anywhere and from what I have seen the colors seem to be VERY repeatable from can to can. If you don't mind doing the work it is not a bad way to go. If you think you are gonna lazy it and not properly wetsand and buff with a professional high speed buffer not your typical orbital, then do yourself a favor and save up for a maaco job or something. Peace
How do you plan to keep the paint from sagging when you get to the vertical panels on the car? Won't gravity mess with the eveness of the coat before it has a chance to dry?
I did mine panel-on and as wierd as it may sound, the vertical pieces actually looked better. They evened out better and didn't show the roller marks like the horizontal parts did.
Jonathan
[This message has been edited by Boostdreamer (edited 02-28-2012).]
While the roll on paint job can look good. I agree the time it takes to do a complete car is way beyond the my patients and the $300 it cost to paint mine with a gun.. and a couple days sanding to finished.
Been pretty busy this week, going to try and get some more paint on the hood tonight. I am having trouble getting the paint to stick around the edges and the sides. Any ideas on how to get it to stick better? The rest of the hood is covering fine. I will try to take pictures of the problem spots before I sand tonight.
Thank you for the tip 85fierogtmaster, I will have to try that when I go to do the other panels.
I have been doing some touch up coats on the hood, the edges are not covering very well. On the last coat there were some bad air bubbles that did not pop soon enough so I am having to mess with those. Will be a little while before I get more pictures up.
y did and I painted our 92 Firebird the same way. though we just wanted to seal the metal. and it's lasted 3+ years of wisconsin weather (the car stays outside 24-7) Great work, keep the pictures coming
Thanks gtxbullet, I have been getting distracted from actually painting the car. I have been working on getting the engine ready to put back in. Should be getting the wiring harness the end of this week, as well as one of your short shifters.
I have been touching up some of the bad spots the past couple nights, I did not take pictures of that but I put a full coat on this morning.
I wasn't going to say anything.... But I will add that even if the car looks good after you've done this, it will de-value the car by about $800. Something to consider before you spend all this time & do all of this work... ~ Paul aka "Tha Driver"
I'm in the same boat as Kevin with that statement Paul. Why would it lower the value of the car? You can't just make a statement like that without explaining it a little bit.
All the pictures are there Kevin, or at least they are there for me.
This type of paint job will devalue a car because if you ever have to repaint it with real automotive paint you need to either replace the panels or completely strip off the roll on paint on the car. You might like the results but the next owner most likely will not. As a painter myself I wouldn't touch it. In this case you are using oil based paint and there is no way that you can repaint those panels with real paint.....it's oil based. The oil will soak into the fiberglass and plastic. Regular laytex may come off with stripper but even that is a nightmare to sand. It's laytex and it doesn't sand well.
So, if you ever sell a car with a roll-on paint job expect to have the potential buyers run away from it unless they don't care about the paint or they plan on replacing every panel that you touch with roll-on paint. If you don't plan on selling it then it doesn't matter.
This type of paint job will devalue a car because if you ever have to repaint it with real automotive paint you need to either replace the panels or completely strip off the roll on paint on the car. You might like the results but the next owner most likely will not. As a painter myself I wouldn't touch it. In this case you are using oil based paint and there is no way that you can repaint those panels with real paint.....it's oil based. The oil will soak into the fiberglass and plastic. Regular laytex may come off with stripper but even that is a nightmare to sand. It's laytex and it doesn't sand well.
So, if you ever sell a car with a roll-on paint job expect to have the potential buyers run away from it unless they don't care about the paint or they plan on replacing every panel that you touch with roll-on paint. If you don't plan on selling it then it doesn't matter.
Exactly. It will cost at least $800 to replace all the panels or strip off all that crappy paint (I'm not sure it can't be stripped). Anyone that buys the car should be told that or they'll getting ripped off. ~ Paul aka "Tha Driver"
I appreciate the input Firefox and Tha Driver. I do not plan on selling the car, or trying to keep the fact that its rolled on paint from anybody that would want to buy it.
There are plenty out there. Not saying Rustoleum is the way to go, but as cheap as it is to do, and rolling it on while not having the spray equipment to do it right it seems to do well for some people. Why spend hundreds, even thousands on a cars paint job that is going to get driven and would only be worth a grand to begin with? New paint of any kind looks better then none in my book.
I think that if someone wants to paint their car with a roller or rattle can the more power to them. I do see the argument that if the car does wind up in the hands of someone else and they wind up wanting to or needing to repaint the car they are in for a huge headache but that’s the nature of used cars.
However, I will also say that anybody who says that if they spend enough time and be really careful that they can get as good of a paint job that a professional shop can do they are full of it (sorry). Automotive paint is specially formulated for painting cars and it’s very different than roll on and/or spray paint is. Plus, (as mentioned already) oil based paints can’t be properly wet sanded which means you will never get a good even layers, which is one of the biggest differences between automotive paint and “house hold” paints. Automotive paints will naturally lay down very evenly and “house hold” paints won’t. Those are just a few of the many differences all of which add up to “it will never look as good as a good professional paint job”!
BUT! If Steinke_andy is enjoying the challenge and likes the outcome, I think he’s way ahead of the rest of us. Great job!
For $250 at www.paintforcars.com I would have had the whole car painted, sanded, and buffed by now. With automotive paint. Just me but if I was going through all of the work to paint a car I would want it to last. Just saying. If you are satisfied with it though, then awesome good job.
[This message has been edited by Curlrup (edited 03-20-2012).]
Originally posted by Curlrup: For $250 at www.paintforcars.com I would have had the whole car painted, sanded, and buffed by now. With automotive paint. Just me but if I was going through all of the work to paint a car I would want it to last. Just saying. If you are satisfied with it though, then awesome good job.
The important point here is that it is a DIY alternative for those who may not have access to the equipment to spray it on or the safety measures, not to mention the skill level to properly setup a spray gun. For example the learning curve and expense of being a beginning welder vs. a beginning painter is night and day. It certainly takes longer to roll it on but there doesn't appear to be as much pressure on the person applying it to be a pro or experienced painter in order to get favorable results.
[This message has been edited by Joseph Upson (edited 03-20-2012).]
I was enjoying this thread til all the nay-sayers took it over. It's nice to see some one take a chance and do something a little different even if doesn't meet the "professional" standards.
I second that, 2farnorth. I bought my Fiero for a thousand bucks as a retirement present to myself because I couldn't afford a Porsche. It has a strong Iron Duke that doesn't smoke or leak, and the clearcoat on the yellow paintjob is beginning to peel. It'll get a roll-on job if it ever gets peeling too badly, and I have no intention of 'upgrading' the engine. I'd like to see the car when it's finished.
I was enjoying this thread til all the nay-sayers took it over. It's nice to see some one take a chance and do something a little different even if doesn't meet the "professional" standards.
We TOOK IT OVER? I simply informed everyone of the problems with doing this (especially with oil-based paint) & the de-valuing of the car. Folks asked, & others answered their questions. It's what a forum is for. As far as I'm concerned, if I've saved ONE Fiero from this fate it's worth the trouble. As a painter, I KNOW what a pain it is to strip cheap paint & how much more it costs for the owner if he wants it done right. ~ Paul aka "Tha Driver"
I am starting to enjoy all the feedback and different opinions that everyone has. I stopped painting the hood about a week ago. It's far from perfect but perfect for what I need it to do.
The whole point of this project was to see how hard/easy it would be to roll on paint. I have found out that its pretty easy to do but it takes a lot of time. If you want a professional looking paint job, I think that you should just pay a professional to do it. Roll-on paint jobs can look very good, I have seen many of them across the internet that came out amazingly. Mine did not, mainly because I have no prior experience in wet-sanding or painting cars.
Here is final picture of the hood, I will take a few more once its on the car. If you have any questions about it or want different pictures feel free to ask.
as for the commentary about roll on or spray can paint jobs not looking as good...do some research. I have personally seen a "rolled-on" black paint job. it looked fantasic. it was just rustoleum siding paint hand sanded ad rolled on clearcoat buffed to a glass like finish.
This type of paint job will devalue a car because if you ever have to repaint it with real automotive paint you need to either replace the panels or completely strip off the roll on paint on the car. You might like the results but the next owner most likely will not. As a painter myself I wouldn't touch it. In this case you are using oil based paint and there is no way that you can repaint those panels with real paint.....it's oil based. The oil will soak into the fiberglass and plastic. Regular laytex may come off with stripper but even that is a nightmare to sand. It's laytex and it doesn't sand well.
So, if you ever sell a car with a roll-on paint job expect to have the potential buyers run away from it unless they don't care about the paint or they plan on replacing every panel that you touch with roll-on paint. If you don't plan on selling it then it doesn't matter.
Can you elaborate on why you wouldn't be able to spray over oil-based paint?
Personally, I also did the roller paint job, mostly because my car is worth maybe $2500 on a really good day and a professional spray job, even a crappy Maaco one, would have been a good $500 or so. The roller job made my car look an order of magnitude better even if it's not perfect. I feel like most potential buyers of a car like a Fiero aren't going to care if the paint job is completely flawless.
For those who say how cheap and easy a spray job is, I believe you, but not everyone has access to spray equipment and a suitable paint booth.
I am not going to buff or polish the hood. And I agree that paint jobs look totally different in person then they do in photos.
In my opinion you only need a flawless paint job when you have a nice car or show car. This car will be neither of those. I want to be able to drive down the road and not have to worry about my nice new paint job.
Also I only payed $1000 for this car and it doesn't run yet. I don't want to throw a nice paint job at it quite yet.
Can you elaborate on why you wouldn't be able to spray over oil-based paint?
Personally, I also did the roller paint job, mostly because my car is worth maybe $2500 on a really good day and a professional spray job, even a crappy Maaco one, would have been a good $500 or so. The roller job made my car look an order of magnitude better even if it's not perfect. I feel like most potential buyers of a car like a Fiero aren't going to care if the paint job is completely flawless.
For those who say how cheap and easy a spray job is, I believe you, but not everyone has access to spray equipment and a suitable paint booth.
If you try to paint over it you will get one of two things. Either paint reactions (very likely) of lack of adheasion. The only way to paint the car after someone has done this to it is to TOTALLY strip it. Nearly impossible to do.
I have personally painted more than one car in my gravel driveway. Ans yes, they came out good. A booth would have been better, but I was carefull to dampen the driveway and do it when the wind was calm. Wet sanding fixed the dust. Harbor freight sells paint guns for less than $20, and they work with little air.
And yes, I would pay a lot more for a car with a failing paint job that I ever would with a car painted with non-car paint. It is harder to undo this sort of mess than it is to undo a delaminating crappy Earl Scheib job, they are bad enough.
Can you elaborate on why you wouldn't be able to spray over oil-based paint?
Automotive paints chemically bond to the surface it's sprayed to. That surface needs to be clean and free of dirt, oil and grease or the paint will not stick. Oil based paint has ' oil ' in it. If you have any oils, including an oily fingerprint on a surface that's going to get painted, you will end up with a spot that the paint will not adhere to and you will usually end up with ' fisheyes '. Painters clean a car several times to make sure that the surface to be painted is clean of everything. Once it's clean it's not touched with bare skin so the oils in your skin won't stay on the clean surface. Oil repels automotive paint and the paint will not lay down smooth at all if it even sits on the surface. It's just like spraying water on an oily spot on your driveway.....the water is repeled and will not sit on the oil.
Just for clarification, my input is only for information and not a criticism. My input is only to let someone who's thinking about rolling their car that there may be issues down the road if the car is to be repainted. You can paint your car with nail polish if you like....not my concern. I just don't want to see anyone use roll-on paint without knowing that the ' rest of the story '.
Originally posted by Electrathon: If you try to paint over it you will get one of two things. Either paint reactions (very likely) of lack of adheasion. The only way to paint the car after someone has done this to it is to TOTALLY strip it. Nearly impossible to do.
I have personally painted more than one car in my gravel driveway. Ans yes, they came out good. A booth would have been better, but I was carefull to dampen the driveway and do it when the wind was calm. Wet sanding fixed the dust. Harbor freight sells paint guns for less than $20, and they work with little air.
And yes, I would pay a lot more for a car with a failing paint job that I ever would with a car painted with non-car paint. It is harder to undo this sort of mess than it is to undo a delaminating crappy Earl Scheib job, they are bad enough.
Thank you for the informative response, although I don't think you can generalize and say that "most" people would pay less for a car with an imperfect roller job compared to a failing, ugly paint job.
I've always lived in fairly urban settings and I don't even have a gravel driveway to shoot on paint so my only options were to leave it as-is, roll it, or pay for it to be done professionally. And considering how little Fieros are worth now, I doubt you can consider a professional job from an economical point of view.
[This message has been edited by masospaghetti (edited 03-27-2012).]
We broke our clutch slave cylinder and had to wait for our grand am brakes to come in so we had some time to put the hood on the car. We also decided at the last minute to rattle can the headlight covers black.
Andy, I see you are still working on this car. I am sorry to see that you have decided not to wetsand and buff the paint job on your Hood. This is what really makes this kind of paint come alive. It is also quite easy to do. The comments that you cannot wetsand and buff this paint are ridiculous. I am here to tell you it is totally possible and really makes it shine Nice. I will not get into the arguments for and against this kind of paint job But I will say that there are a BUNCh of folks who have done this with great results. It is a real paint job that an and will last quite awhile and is easily touched up and repaired. As I said I experimented with this on my last Fiero and it was on there for more than a year out in the sun daily without issue. A quick buff would make it shine like the day I painted it. No problem....I have since painted other things using this same basic process and it looks great. For a low budget car it is a viable alternative to a custom expensive spray job but of is a lot of work....do yourself a favor and buff that Hood and see what I mean....peace
Thank you for the informative response, although I don't think you can generalize and say that "most" people would pay less for a car with an imperfect roller job compared to a failing, ugly paint job.
I've always lived in fairly urban settings and I don't even have a gravel driveway to shoot on paint so my only options were to leave it as-is, roll it, or pay for it to be done professionally. And considering how little Fieros are worth now, I doubt you can consider a professional job from an economical point of view.
The fact is, that most folks wouldn't know the difference & will pay more for a car with a crappy paintjob than a crappy looking car. But when they realize what they have - & what it will cost to get it done right - they will be pissed. I understand that you can't afford to get a professional to do it. Hell I can't afford to buy the primer right now for any of my projects. But it would be much better to do it yourself using the right paint & primer even if you had to it panel by panel in your bedroom. AND it will take a lot less time. You could even use plastic & 2x4s to put up a small booth to work in; only needs to be big enough for the biggest panel. OR, you could do the small panels yourself & have the roofs done at a shop. All I'm saying is explore all your options & use your imagination & you can have a nice car with a quality job that will last. ~ Paul aka "Tha Driver"
If your gonna roll roll it at least tip it with a really nice soft bristle oil brush. This is what we do in the marine industry to million dollar yachts roll it on with a foam roller and brush out the bubbles and peel. You only want to brush it in one direction and try a little penetrol in your paint it is a flow additive to help it smooth out a little and oh yeah btw looks good for a roll job
------------------ If it works take it apart and find out why
LOL Mark. At a custom shop I worked at many years ago, we did custom pearl paint jobs for show cars that no one had ever seen before. We did them with pearl fingernail polish we bough in gallons for manufacturers. Fingernail polish (at least then) was just lacquer and it was thinned with scented acetone instead of smelly lacquer thinner. I def agree you cant put any automotive paint over an oil base paint except plain synthetic enamel (basicly tractor or sign paint). Wipe down a body panel with a cloth soaked in motor oil and dry it as good as you can then try to paint it. If you can even cover it, see how long it lasts.
Again on Adhesion Promoter. Dont waste your money. proper prep is the way to make paint stick, not using snake oil chemicals. I see even that Duplicolor version SAYS it makes paint stick to chrome. It does not...ive tried it. Only thing that makes paint stick to chrome is sandblasting it...that works every time. Even sanding chrome with sandpaper or scotchbrite dont work. My chrome Coronet bumpers are painted Argent silver as the original fiberglass factory race bumpers. They look fine after 5 years, not even a chip.. after a good sandblasting. Just because its a name brand company touting their products miracle products doesnt mean its not just a marketing ploy to get you to buy it.
The only real cost if you have a free booth and gun is you might use more paint. Your still getting a pretty cheap paintjob costwise. Seems to me rollering and sanding on coat after coat is a huge time pit. I could sand and spray the hood with like 3 coats and be done with it in an hour. May not even have to sand it if it flows nice.
