My 4.9 with a Flowmaster 80 is louder than the typical 4.9 exhaust using the Jones Turbo Tube.
The loudest muffler that I ever heard is the Lawson Incynerator Crossflow Muffler P/N 77583. The sound is earth shaking. Its basically a hollow case with two inputs and one outlet. if you buy that muffler make sure that you have the bottle of Excedrin handy.The next loudest will be the Flotech Afterburner that I run. Not quiet but the rumble is tolerable but on long trips its not the best. Third in line would be the Spintech followed by the Flowmaster and Magnaflow.
------------------ " THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Powerlog manifold, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Flotech Afterburner Exhaust, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite. "THE COLUSSUS" 87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H " ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "
It seems I may be able to get back at my neighbor with the new Harley Davidson! I'm not as concerned with how loud this Frankenmuffler is going to be as I am with the tone it puts out. I'm worried that in the worst case it will sound akin to automotive flatulence.
Don't forget about the noise bylaw that's now in effect here in Calgary, I'm sure you'll be OK but just a thought. I find my car to be a tad bit on the loud side.
Nolan
[This message has been edited by Sourmug (edited 06-13-2012).]
Don't forget about the noise bylaw that's now in effect here in Calgary, I'm sure you'll be OK but just a thought. I find my car to be a tad bit on the loud side.
Nolan
If I get a ticket for breaking some noise bylaw it simply means that the engine is running and the car is on the road for the first time since December...That would be OK by me!
I know that the 90 in the 2 1/2" is restrictive. The guy that bent it said it wouldn't be bad. He lied. What's done is done, but it should breath a bit better than the 4cyl setup. Keep in mind THIS IS ONLY TEMPORARY.
Note; Make sure all temporary repairs are of good quality as they often become permanent.
That 2.5" bend will support 200 HP easily.
For comparison, it's much less restrictive than the U-bend found in 200 and 240 HP Grand Prixs.
Here's a few shots of the custom (homemade) Y-pipe for the exhaust as it runs under the engine. The 2.5" short piece is just to tack the pieces to in order to get the shape and angles I need. It will be cut off and the Y will be welded to the muffler.
Here's a shot of the exhaust from the firewall side as it comes together. I managed to put the whole thing together using the 2.5 exhaust and 4.9 scraps. It's not pretty but it will do the job...for awhile.
I found another one of these at the picknpull. That makes 3; 1 for my car and 2 spares. These digital dashes are the height of 80's cheese...and that's what makes them so awesome!
I'm going to replace the axle seals as the passenger side is definitely leaking.
One of these tools makes the job a lot easier than with screw drivers.
There was this outer dish that come off first
I've never seen that outer dish thing before. This is what I am used to seeing when it comes to the axle seal
Just pick a hook depending on the angle you have to work with, make sure not to grab the trans...just the seal, and push/pull. Stubborn seals will need some encouragement by moving the tool to different areas of the seal. Make sure to wear long sleaves and gloves.
To replace the axle seals on the 5spd I ordered a pair of these;
Yes that actually says GERMANY on the bearing. It's an encouraging sign as it relates to my peace of mind.
See that hole in the bottom? The instructions say to line it up with the drain hole on the trans...
After removing the seal, this is all there was all the way around...I don't see any drain hole so I guess that alignment is out of the question...so the new question is: Which direction should this hole be facing? Down to drain the oil straight out of the bearing, horizontal through the center line to allow some oil to hang around the bearing? I'm not sure. If you know for sure, please let me know too!
These bearing/seal housings are made from steel and I figure will rust pretty fast. I cleaned them with brake clean, masked and shot them with 3 coats of silver to try to keep them looking good while I wait for an answer to how the hole should be positioned.....
Word of caution on those axle stabilizer bearings... more often than not they leak. The seal just does not have the same about of flexibility to conform to the tripod shaft, especially when the differential bearings are worn to the point of allowing movement. Some people have had good success with them on freshly rebuilt transmissions, others they leaked from day one, others have the bearing eat away at the tripod seal surface. They are also a major pain to remove... I removed mine after 300 miles due to leaking and threw them into the trash.
Also, the cone shaped part on the stock seal is to protect the seal as you install/remove the tripods.
Word of caution on those axle stabilizer bearings... more often than not they leak. The seal just does not have the same about of flexibility to conform to the tripod shaft, especially when the differential bearings are worn to the point of allowing movement. Some people have had good success with them on freshly rebuilt transmissions, others they leaked from day one, others have the bearing eat away at the tripod seal surface. They are also a major pain to remove... I removed mine after 300 miles due to leaking and threw them into the trash.
Good information...just not what I wanted to hear. I have the typical slight movement at the output shaft and figured that this would help prevent the movement to provide a better seal. Once again, best of intentions. Lets consider this a case study. I'll waste my money and time so everyone else can learn something too! I'm going to install them any how and keep you guys posted.....Still waiting on confirmation regarding that drain hole positioning. Anyone?
quote
Originally posted by fieroguru: Also, the cone shaped part on the stock seal is to protect the seal as you install/remove the tripods.
Well, I managed to find a thread here that mentioned the bearing stabilizer "drain hole" positioned down...Kinda makes sense, after all, nothing really drains "up". I just wasn't sure if it needed to be positioned at maybe 7 or 8 oclock to keep some oil in the bottom of the bearing for a wet start up. I guess I'm just over thinking things again. Here's a pic of the area the drain hole is supposed to drain into.
Here's the locktite 515 be it a bit blurry. Why 515? Well, I checked up on the stuff and it's a "flange sealant". Basically a liquid gasket. It certainly is not required to prevent these darn stabilizers from falling out! Probably could have saved $8 and used some leftover RTV silicone gasket maker.
Here's the stabilizer installed on the drivers side. I left the masking in place over the seal as to keep out dirt till I am ready to install the axles.
I sure hope these things work better than perfect and I never have to remove them. I literally beat a coulple of 2x4 sections in half trying to get them in! I am seriously thinking that it wasn't machined properly and it needed a couple thou removed. I wouldn't have been surprised if the transmission had split in half just trying to get these things in. And yes, I was making sure to check periodically that they were going in straight.
I finished the exhaust on the engine side. I still have to connect the muffler and tips section to the engine section where it meets at the back under the cradle. This I need to do with the engine in place. so here it goes!
Here you can see my son's skateboard under the cradle. There is a 2x4 section on it to brace from one set of wheels to the other and a towel to protect the powder coated cradle.
everyone seems to have their own way of lifting a fiero...I planned ahead when I finished off my garage the winter before and built it a hoisting point.
I covered the engine to protect it from stratches etc. but it wasn't necessary. Not a single problem or hickup! I knew sooner or later things would work in my favor!
I used a heavy coating of antiseize to hopefully also help prevent rust from, well, seizing the cradle bolts in place.
Here's a few pics to show how much clearance b/w the engine and cradle bottom there is with dropping the drivetrain 1/2".
The only interference I had was the pcv valve pointing towards the firewall a bit and making contact with the decklid bracket. Give r' a twist towards the back and problem solved...and of course modify the tube to throttle body.
You can see there is no clearance problems keeping the undented valve cover on the firewall side with the 1/2" drivetrain drop when the bottom of the decklid hinge bracket is trimmed up to the bottom bolt.
Wow! Where'd it go? I'm gonna have to eventually paint the valve covers something other than black eventually if I want this engine to stand out a bit more.
This project is looking great...I was getting a little concerned since I hadn't seen an update for about the last week that something had gone awry with the project and the thread would end. It reads better than a good novel...not that I would know anything about reading a novel. Keep up the great work and posting of progress.
This project is looking great...I was getting a little concerned since I hadn't seen an update for about the last week that something had gone awry with the project and the thread would end. It reads better than a good novel...not that I would know anything about reading a novel. Keep up the great work and posting of progress.
No worries. I have been busy with work, the family, and the fiero. Sunday was my first day off work in around a month! I WILL get this car running this summer. I am much further along than the thread would lead you to believe...but it's catching up!
I've shown the engine installed but skipped some of the custom plumbing. Here's a pic of the 2.5's PCV rounting tube (I think). I cut it up and added a bracket to use it for the brake vacuum booster.
Chopped and sandblasted. You can see that the factory actually brazed the bracket on to the metal tube.
After welding on another bracket, the oil residue inside the tube started smoking. I'll make sure to clean it thoroughly before installing it.
Anyone else having flashbacks to college?
The finished product...
installed.
With the engine in, the stock brake booster firewall to engine rubber hose was too long. (picture taken from under car looking up.)
Chopped short and clamped down.
From there, it went up and behind the distributor with another custom tube made from leftover 2.5 plumbing.
Here it goes over the fuel rail to the throttle body vac tube which I twisted in it's place to point upward.
[This message has been edited by Reallybig (edited 07-15-2012).]
Really? No one else remembers conducting exothermic reactions under the fume hood during chemistry labs? Please tell me you all didn't major in political science and liberal arts!
I'm going to make a bracket to mount the heater core coolant line. Here's the rough template on a scrap sheet of steel.
Cut and bent. It's going to be mounted under a stock bracket that's bolted to the transmission. This will help hide the plumbing a bit for a cleaner look.
And there we go!
A better picture of the location.
Time to make the coolant hard line. I used a length of aluminum line from an earlier fiero at a wrecking yard. I will use the factory flared end in the area of the engine bay that will be visible and will have to flair the other end myself. Being an important part of the coolant system, it is important to me that the hose not be able to come off...so here is the process I used to flair the end starting with a freshly cut end.
The aluminum tube is quite soft and easy to manipulate. Using a 1/4" drive deep socket, I expanded the end like a trumpet by twirling it around the inner diameter.
Using a pair of needle nose pliers, I bent the outer edge inward around the trumpet lip. I know it looks like crap but just bear with me on this.
This is my less than expensive custom flairing tool held together with a masking tape fit.
The smaller socket fits inside the tube preventing it from being crushed while guiding the larger socket evenly around the edge of the tube. Proceed to beat violently.
The end result. Finished up with some sandpaper to debur the edge and I think I am quite satisfied that there is no chance the hose will come off the tube once clamped tight.
Here is the outlet that will connect with a heater hose to the thermostat housing. You can see the clamps that hold the tube to the bracket I made.
A profile shot. If I could do it over (which I might the next time the engine is out) I'd make the tube shorter on the firewall side. I just think it's too long once installed.
Here you can see what I mean by it's too long in this pic. Not that it's going to be a problem but I'd like a longer length of heater tube to adjust for engine vibration and movement.
I didn't mention how it will reach the 88's heater core. On the 88 4cyl (perhaps 6cyl too) both the eater core tubes are located on the passenger side beside the gas tank. One line connects with a fuel line like quick coupler and runs along the pass side frame rail. You can see it in this pic held on by two clips with orange rubber isolators.
Here it is painted and covered with insulating foam. I bent one end around and ran it along the bottom of the firewall side and anchored it to the cat heat shield brackets. I don't plan on putting the heat shield back so the brackets came in handy.
The upper end will connect to my modified and polished thermostat housing I completed a looooong time ago. I made a 90 out of aluminum, cut off the straight line that usually points over the valve cover and had it welded in place. I then proceeded to file, sand and then polish the whole thing. I got to clear coat it before it goes on the car to prevent oxidation.
As this is the highest point in the coolant system, I used an air bleeder from a 3800 engine, drilled and tapped the housing, screwed it in there tight. You can see that when the machine shop welded the two pieces together, there were some imperfections that became obvious while filing and sanding. I filled them and will just have to live with it.
It's not that noticeable once its installed.
You can see here how the modified (and nicely hidden) tube will connect to the modified thermostat housing....once it's clear coated and bolted down for good.
The 88 4cyl pass side coolant hose fits nicely to the stock 4.9 pump housing...once it has a bit of a trim first.
I've already covered this earlier, but just to add it to this engine hose section, the block off from the unneeded heater core inlet.
I was going to do the 2.5 thing with the top coolant hose but I don't really like the messy look when it's done. I'll go for something cleaner when I figure it out later. This stuff is not needed anymore.
I finished up the temporary exhaust system for now. I used the same VHT header paint I used on the cast iron exhaust manifolds earlier...unfortunately, this won't fit in my BBQ. Notice how the muffler and tip section is all wonky. The bends coming from the tips are different lengths and the original installer compensated by making everything else crooked. Makes me not feel so bad for what I've done to this poor thing. Yes the welds suck...I was having trouble with them. TEMPORARY exhaust. I just want to drive this thing this summer before it snows. I think it kinda looks like a scorpion. It's late. Going to bed now.
[This message has been edited by Reallybig (edited 07-23-2012).]
nice build but you need to find the small bracket that fits on the starter and attaches to the block 4.9 starters are know for braking off the nose cone when this bracket is missing
nice build but you need to find the small bracket that fits on the starter and attaches to the block 4.9 starters are know for braking off the nose cone when this bracket is missing
I don't remember there being a bracket there. Any pics of what It looks like? It sure sounds like something I am not going to want to leave off!
are you referring to the small right angle bracket that goes on the tiny bolt at rear of the starter housing to the block?
and also, Nice work!
Thanks!
I know that the heat shield bolts to the bottom starter bold (that goes through the motor and holds the aluminum gear case on) and attaches to the exhaust manifold bolt just above the starter...not sure if this is considered the "bracket". It's pretty flimsy and has very little structural properties. I'll dig up a pic and post it later.
I wish I had a better pic right now... but if you look closely at the rear side of the starter, there is a small steel angle. you can only see half of it in the pic. It was attached to the rear of starter via the small lug for the case nut. it attaches to the block via the threaded hole just behind the starter in your pic. It must be the one that was mentioned, since you dont have it and I do. I'm suprised that the tiny thing is so necessary.
Looks like I get to check out the wreckers again! I honestly don't remember seeing one on the car when I pulled this motor. It could have been left off during some service work, or maybe by 94 the factory didn't feel it necessary any more, or more likely; years of paint, solvent and welding fumes have affected my memory and it was on my engine!
[This message has been edited by Reallybig (edited 07-27-2012).]
Nice attention to detail. Homemade flare tool.. that gave mea good laugh. I like the color of the manifolds too.
Hey, what ever works...and costs the least. The manifolds are that VHT ceramic spray paint cast iron color. They browned nicely in the BBQ...I was happy with the color too. Time will tell if the stuff holds up though.
I plan on using it with the 4.9. Of course there are "ultimate" dogbones out there but I don't see anything wrong with this one...other than it's ugliness. I'm not one to judge though and think all it needs is the same love and attention Charlie Brown's Christmas tree was given. One of the kids wanted to watch a movie on TV with me the other day so I figured I could get some work done at the same time and this is what I ended up with.
Stayed up and watched another movie.
Watched a movie on tv with the wife today.
I missed a good pic of the muffler being stiched back together...frankenstein style!
Getting ready to install the battery relocation box up font for the last time. As it sits on the steering rack, I wanted to protect the powdercoat finish...by covering it up. I couldn't find a good strip of self adhesive rubber tape so I made some from a black rubber garden hose and heavy duty two sided tape.
Some more key contact locations
I had some trouble fitting the spare tire in the tub over the battery during test fitting. In an effort to make things easier I trimmed as much of the lip at the bottom as possible. Pic before the trimming;
Pic after;
I'm using these clip to hold the box in the tub. I got them form an auto parts store hardware display along with the bolts.
It's taken a while for me to put the front together because I wanted to add protection to the positive power cable. I finally settled on a length of black 1/2" inner Diam. rubber garden hose after looking almost everywhere.
I used it like wiring loom by slitting it down the length then used tywraps to hold it on and in place. I'm not completely happy with the end result and will change it if I come up with something better. You can see it in this pic before the box goes in for the final time. Yes, I did the ground cable too while I was at it.
And in for good...until I have to remove it. And I will be able to because I used those quick nut things! I used the stock fiero screws with the giant washers on them and clip nuts along the top...just added 3 more I got from the wreckers though.
I ran the positive line to this junction box that came on the battery cable I got from that Riviera.
With it in this location, It should be easier to jump start the car or access battery power when needed rather than taking out the spare tire that will sit over the battery up front. It snaps closed with it's own hinged cover. Neat.
I used the starter wire from the same cable setup. Proper end ready to go!
Run down the side of the engine to the junction box.
This cable was a little too long and needed to be shortened a bit. I pulled the end off the cable with the help of a small torch.
Shortened, crimped, and full of solder (with the help of some flux paste)
To protect the end that sticks out of the junction box, I wanted to use proper heat shrink tubing. Brilliant me forgot to put the stuff on the cable first but found this 1" double walled heat shrink with an inner lining of hot melt glue that just fit over the end...Nothing like over doing it!
Check out this stuffs ability to shrink! It was advertised as 3to1. Just a bit if time behind a torch and...
It was so neat to watch, I had to put a second layer on just to see it again. Much cooler than that little tubing I'm used to using.
[This message has been edited by Reallybig (edited 07-29-2012).]
Well, I'm kinda jumping around right now with progress postings. A lot of the details are starting to overlap and causing me some confusion. It doesn't help that it's past 1:30 am. For now though, I'm itching to get the car on the ground so I can easily move it around as I can't access the drivers side for certain wiring details. Of course while I'm at it I may as well lower the car a bit, clean up the calipers, put new rotors on, service the caliper sliders (I'll rebuild the calipers next year), re-pack the cv joints, clean up the axles, etc.....Well here we go!
I'll start by putting the urethane bushings in the rear links. I think that some of the reason they squeek for some people is due to design. I notice with rubber bushings, the center metal tube is locked in place by the bolt that passes though it and tightened to the frame. As the suspension moves up and down, the rubber seems to do all the flexing...it actually twists...the center stays locked on the metal tube while the outer diameter is locked in place to the suspension. At least that is what seems to be happening with mine. The urethane doesn't have the same twist, it's much more ridged. I believe the outer diameter will stay locked in the suspension while the inner diameter will pivot around the metal tube (spacer). And the spacer stays locked in position as it is bolted down. It's this metal tube on urethane that acts like a tennis shoe on a gym floor. Also the sides of the urethane will pivot against the sides of the mounting points. The sides of the bushings are machined and somewhat rough and should hold onto the grease quite well to help keep things quiet, but the inner diameter of the bushing is quite shinny.
Even though you grease up the surface, I think that much of it gets squeezed off like a wiper blade on a windshield. For this reason, I'm going to roughen up the urethane mating surfaces with 80grit sand paper. Not enough to remove needed material but just to provide a mechanical passage for the grease to cling to and not be squeegeed off.
Suspension pieces too.
Greased up with the tube that was provided with the bushings.
The small squeeze tube is all that was provided...just one. Not a chance that this is enough for the whole rear suspension...maybe this is the reason some bushings squeek? For another $12, buy the nice tub behind it. No worries when there's some extra laying around. When I get around to doing the front, I'll be looking at it, not for it.
I noticed with my bushings, there were two different sizes of metal spacer that were close. Here I am comparing them to the urethane. I wonder if some people (using this bushing kit) put the shorter spacer in the wider bushing. I would imagine once tightened, it could cause some suspension problems; freedom of movement, squeeking, binding etc. I hope I'm doing this right.
I'm going to use Fieroguru's post here https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/110944.html as a guide to lowering my 88 fiero. I'm going to use a pair of 85 4cyl springs I got from a wrecking yard for the front with 1.5 coils removed and the front 4cyl 88 springs from my car in the rear with 1 coil removed. I'll post a side shot when done so others will have a reference as to what it looks like. In the mean time, here's a shot of the stock rear setup, 88 front, 85 front (left to right)
The process of removing the front spring is quite simple. The only kinda challenge is separating the spindle from the lower ball joint. I used this;
Worked like a charm.
Remove the sway bar link, the steering end by tapping the spindle with a hammer to loosen it up, push down the lower arm and pull out the spring. Here's the lower arm spring seat.
The upper spring seating area. There was a rubber bushing on the upper side of the spring. I'm sure it keeps things quiet.
The rubber seat was a little worse for wear but I'll reuse it anyhow.
[This message has been edited by Reallybig (edited 08-06-2012).]
I'm going to start with cutting 1.5 coils from the 85 spring and trying that up font. I have a feeling I'll be doing this again once the car is running. That link I posted earlier said " cut1.5 to 2.5 coils from the pre-88 spring". Marked and ready for the angle grinder.
Once cut, the pre-88 spring is the same length as the uncut 88 spring. Maybe removing 1.5 coils from a pre-88 will leave the car at stock ride height. We'll find out soon enough!
Cleaned and painted, ready to go in. Honestly, a lot of wasted paint. If you've never sprayed one of these before...don't. I'm going to put the tapered coil end up. The upper seat pic showed that the surface was even all the way around so it seems like the right way to go. Installed the old rubber isolator on top, but there was none on the bottom....hmm.
And it's in. I'm not going to show the process I used to get it in as it wouldn't fit without compressing it a bit. I did use a spring compressor...just not how you're supposed to use one...and some rope. I know the shock looks like it's ready to retire but it was still working properly...or so it seemed. But like I said, I'll be in here again shortly. I didn't cut the bump stop yet...lets wait and see how things work out with just the 1.5 coils cut first.
After everything was back together I was left with a bit of a mess so I got into the nitty gritty.
Off with the rotor and caliper for a good brake inspection.
I don't think this brake pad can be saved...of to NAPA.
I ordered two sets...can you guess which ones just came in?
They're all the same PN
The one on the far right is form 3yrs ago
This set came with the anti-squeek plate...they're going up font.
This set didn't and seem to be of lesser quality...I'll toss them out back.
The rotor was a PITA to get off as it was welded in place with rust. I actually had to chisel rust scale off the hub and file everything smooth. I don't want new rotors going onto a wonky hub. A very thin coat of copper anti-seize will hopefully prevent the rust and help things come apart easier the next time.
These cast iron caliper bridges look terrible.
First thing to do is file down that mould casting line.
Some time with the sandblaster. I love that thing, but it's just so messy if you don't have a blasting cabinet. I'm using some PPE and a large cardboard box on the driveway. It's irritating having to clean up after each session.
Two coats of aluminum engine enamel and three coats of clear...That's better! I hope the paint holds. It's not brake fluid friendly but I figure if I'm getting fluid all over this part of the brake system...I shouldn't be doing the brakes. Hopefully I don't eat those words. Why aluminum color? Just want to keep things looking somewhat stock. I don't think the 88 brake caliper is big enough to show off with a bright color...nor is it anywhere as good looking as a Brembo or Willwood caliper. But that's just me.
A comparison of the two next to each other.
I've gone this far...why stop now? The caliper sliders were really stuck in there. I use the C clamp with a socket and a scrap channel to force them out.
Aren't these supposed to have grease in them? All I see is aluminum-oxide...not a great lubricant.
Using 120 grit sand paper by hand I am careful to remove just the stuff that shouldn't be there and avoid removing any caliper material.
Even the stainless steel sliders were messed up. Here I'm getting ready for some farmyard machining.
Don't let the picture fool you...this paper doesn't really have all that much bite. It's 320 grit if I remember right...just enough to remove some junk and polish the cylinder.
Just a comparison shot with it's brethren after a good cleansing .
Two of the slider boots were torn...arrrrggg! Jokes on them. They're going back into service for now till I can order some more. I gave them a quick bath in some varsol (paint thinner) and ragged them clean.
Just a few minutes was enough to cause them to swell up. Here's one that's been just cleaned and one that's just going to be. They'd probably melt if they were put in lacquer thinner. I'll let them air out overnight so they come back down to size.
I haven't seen anyone mention this little "problem" I have found on the 88 brake pads so I thought I'd mention it so anyone changing their pads will be aware of it.
The problem is that there are some nipples on the back of the brake pads that fit into these recessed locations on the inside of the caliper bridge that don't always fit.
On the brake pads I bought with the antisqueek shim, these nipples are flattened to hold the shim in place.
On the pads with out the shim the nipples are even more pronounced.
When the pad is placed against it's caliper mating surface the recesses in the caliper bridge are not deep enough to allow the pad to sit flat. This means that with out filing down these nipples, all the pressure on that pad is directed through the nipples and not evenly along the back of the pad!
On the pad with the shim the nipples are flattened and flared out to hold the shim in place. I'm sure the intent is that with the thickness of the shim and the flattening of the nipples, there should be enough room in the caliper recesses so the pressure can be applied correctly and not just through these nipples. Here is a pic taken showing how much of a gap there is even with these pads. I used a light behind it to help illustrate what I am seeing.
And the pad with out the shim.
This problem (as I see it) also exists on the back calipers...only it is with the two nipples in the middle of the pad that fit in the caliper piston to prevent it from rotating. These I didn't file down comletely but enough so the pad lays flat against the caliper piston surface. The rear caliper bridge has the same problem as the front caliper bridge. On the front caliper piston side, this isn't a problem as the piston surface is hollow and the two closer nipples fit inside.
I would immagine that leaving the pads the way they are without filing them down to fit it could cause the pad material to separate from the metal backing due to uneven applied pressure. Maybe they'd be fine, but I'm not going to chance it. I'f you have an 88, it might be worth a look.
Any thoughts?
[This message has been edited by Reallybig (edited 08-08-2012).]
I had the same experience on the rear brakes on my 85 SE. The little recessed areas in the piston were not deep enough to allow the pad to seat flush to the piston. The nubs do serve a purpose in preventing the piston from rotating. I, too, ground them off JUST ENOUGH to let the pad seat properly. This could be an example of what engineering calls "tolerance stacking". The nubs are at the maximum height tolerance, and the piston recess is at the minimum depth tolerance. The individual pieces are within the designed dimension tolerance, but with the min/max issue, interference occurs.
I had the same experience on the rear brakes on my 85 SE. The little recessed areas in the piston were not deep enough to allow the pad to seat flush to the piston. The nubs do serve a purpose in preventing the piston from rotating. I, too, ground them off JUST ENOUGH to let the pad seat properly. This could be an example of what engineering calls "tolerance stacking". The nubs are at the maximum height tolerance, and the piston recess is at the minimum depth tolerance. The individual pieces are within the designed dimension tolerance, but with the min/max issue, interference occurs.
I wish I had thought about the word "nubs". Perhaps a little less confusing than my choice. It was late though.
As you know, 84-87 calipers are different than the 88's, did you notice any interference with the outer side of the caliper (side opposite the piston)?
It's kinda scary thinking that allowable design tolerances could create problems in the breaking components. What other potential problems are being overlooked? I've never heard of brake failures due to this kind of imperfection...I guess all's well that ends well.
Before I put the caliper, pads and rotor on, I had to deal with the hub. The surface was covered in rust scale that bonded the rotor to it and made separation difficult. After chipping away with a small chisel and hammer, I filed the surface carefully to remove all traces of rust that will interfere with the rotor installation. A pass with a wire brush and a thin coat of brush-on anti seize and we're ready for assembly.
I plan on doing the 12" corvette rotor up grade eventually and even have a pair ready to go. I ordered 4 on line but they only had two in stock. They shipped the two and only charged me for the two. Nice. On top of that setback, the caliper adapters I made are not up to my standards and will be scrapped. Luckily a fellow Fiero club member upgraded his 88's brakes to 13" rotors and had a set of mint drilled and slotted rotors laying around...but not for very long!
My disks had a bad vibe when braking and I didn't look for a reason before pulling the car off the road for the swap. This could be part of the reason.
Poor pad contact along with the separated brake pad...I'm surprised this car even stopped! And lucky too! After replacing all for disks, this isn't even the worst one!
New (to my car) rotors, painted calipers, new pads, greased sliders, summer tires and rims on the front.
Took another picture to get the flash evenly across the wheel. Neat.
And why did I interrupt the engine swap to work on the front again? Just so I could use the 88 front springs with one coil cut off on the back struts like I read in another thread. I may be saving money for the mean time by not going directly to coilover rear struts right away but I am definitely not saving time! Everything takes much longer than I expect it to. It doesn't help that I sweat the details. I did however manage to not remove the entire front suspension and have it blasted, powder coated, and install new urethane bushings and shocks. I'm proud of my restraint...and I have a project for next winter!
[This message has been edited by Reallybig (edited 08-13-2012).]
Now that I have the 88 front spring out, I can cut 1 coil and use it in the rear strut assembly. Most of my pics have been quite two dimetional, so I thought I'd throw in an action shot;
Spring compressors on and pulling the strut assembly apart.
Here is a picture of the strut rod mounting plate (that's what I'm going to call it). In another thread it says to flip it upside down for more strut travel when lowering the rear by removing coils. I didn't quite understand what was meant so I thought I'd focus on it help others understand.
As it comes off, you can see how there is a section that protrudes into the spring towards the strut. There is a rubber bushing inside that section to help isolate some shock.
And flipped around
Installed this way, the strut can travel up into the shock tower around an extra inch. I was concerned that the rubber bushing could be pushed out of the plate eventually so I was sure to use the bowl shaped washer on top and the tophat spring centering device will prevent bushing movement in the down direction. I'll get to that later.
The complete exploded view for my reassembly reference
This appears to be a bumpstop that was inside the plastic accordion strut rod dust shield. I suppose cutting some off the bottom would also increase strut travel...that or leaving it out all together. I'm sure it has a good purpose so its going back in.
These things were pitted bad so I hit them with the sand blater
Then the spraycan rust converter The lighter colored areas on the spring perch are where the rubber spring isolator would rub and I guess protect it from rust. The other areas turned a darker color as the rust converter worked it's way into the pits.
Painted, and ready to go back together.
I'm going to build the top hat that will keep the spring centered at the top of the strut. The bumpstop will fit inside the hat,the rubber spring mount I kept from the 85 spring will fit around the hat, and the metal exhaust pipe will be the hat. I didn't have a piece big enough so I had to buy one.
Yes, they look just like Garfield's eyes...
The narrow part of the tube I bought fit perfect, the wider half needed a strip removed so it would be the same diameter.
Some more action shots. I managed to get a friend and diehard mopar guy to spend some time against his will helping me with the Pontiac. Actually, I think he just couldn't resist getting behind a welder again.
I'm going to reuse the struts that were in the car. I know they are past their life but I figure I'll get new ones when I redo the front suspension assembly over the winter. Lets see how this works out for now. I'm not going to spend any time cleaning them up to save some time.
Next of course is the spring. I'm reusing the rubber that was on the bottom of the original spring and the spring is going in cut side down. Because it doesn't sit completely flush as the bottom is no longer tapered, the rubber needed to be held in place with a couple of tywraps.
Next is that 85 spring rubber that went around the bump stop on the front 85 spring. A little film of grease around the inside edge will allow the hat to slide in easily.
The strut bumpstop goes on next. The hole in the inner metal part fits over the threaded end of the strut rod but not over the main rod. Next the hat goes on; it fits around the bumpstop and inside the spring rubber. I like this rubber piece as it firmly keeps the spring in place while keeping the spring from damaging the top hat.
Over top of the hat goes this piece of rubber and washer. The washer acts as a spacer between the hat and rubber strut rod islolator while the round rubber piece prevents metal to metal contact between the original spring perch and the top hat. I made it from a scrap floor mat, hence the design on top. Is it necessary? I figure it's insurance against squeaks and other noises later on.
The other pieces followed up with the bowl washer and locking nut.
I decided to clean up the CV axle ends and check their condition. This Tywrap is not a good sign but I can't say I saw anything out of the ordinary.
After cleaning up the grease from the tulip, I notice this heat discoloration...Any ideas? I don't think it's the result of welding the shaft onto the tulip but figure it might have more to do with heat treating the splined shaft. Not really sure though.
This shaft has definitely seen a few miles. It was working when I pulled the car off the road so I'll polish it up with some 320 grit and tidy up the tulip a bit...lets say sand blast it, two coats of color and two coats of clear.
Clean up the bearings, regrease, pack the tulip, and stick em back together.
I got this from the parts store as a replacement for the um, tywrap. It self locks when you tighten it by twisting the end around a pair of pliers but found it a bit small. I would have preferred a more original style.
It should be easier to monitor any oil leaks with the end all cleaned up...hopefully their are none. You can see that band is a bit skinnier than original.
Mounted in the drivers side shock tower ready for duty.
[This message has been edited by Reallybig (edited 08-15-2012).]
Not to bore anyone with repeat pictures, just thought I'd mention that all 4 corners are done and on the ground. When the wiring is done and the engine ready to start, I'll push it outside and snap some pictures of how it sits. I know I have pictures of how it sat before the spring swap...I'll just have to look for them on a different camera.
You are seriously making me want to pull my newly completed swap back apart and make it pretty. I guess that's what winter's for, right? Beautiful work, and nice attention to detail. If you ever make it down to the Spokane / Coeur d'Alene area, let us know!
Haha. I posted the picture of it on the previous page. 
The manifolds are that VHT ceramic spray paint cast iron color. They browned nicely in the BBQ...I was happy with the color too. Time will tell if the stuff holds up though.
