Does anyone have experience using wheel adapters they would like to share? I would like to put staggered rims 18x7 1/2 front and 18x8 1/2 or 18x9 in the rear. The only staggered rims I find available are custom made to order rims which are very expensive. If I use adapters I can use much cheaper rims. Searching for wheels and all the crap that goes with it sizing, offset, clearances, and all the other has made me giveup a dozen times. So any constructive help will be greatly appreciated.
If your car is a garage queen or a show car you can get away with adapters without trouble, but if you drive it, the wheel bearings will be stressed and they will tend to fail much sooner than expected. Low speed steering also may be more difficult.
If your car is a garage queen or a show car you can get away with adapters without trouble, but if you drive it, the wheel bearings will be stressed and they will tend to fail much sooner than expected. Low speed steering also may be more difficult.
Mixed reviews on this, but after many forum threads, research, and testimonials, I would run a wheel adaptor/spacer all day long. I have never witnessed a direct failure due to adaptors. Racing does it. Street does it. Eazy-E does it.
Does anyone have experience using wheel adapters they would like to share? I would like to put staggered rims 18x7 1/2 front and 18x8 1/2 or 18x9 in the rear. The only staggered rims I find available are custom made to order rims which are very expensive. If I use adapters I can use much cheaper rims. Searching for wheels and all the crap that goes with it sizing, offset, clearances, and all the other has made me giveup a dozen times. So any constructive help will be greatly appreciated.
This looks like it would be the perfect place to give my opinion on Wheel adapters.
The saying goes that "All horses are animals but not all animals are horses."
There are big differences between wheel spacers & Wheel adapters.
All adapters are spacers but no spacer can be an adapter. (<~~ oh well I tried. LOL)
A wheel spacer is like putting flat washers between the Wheel & the hub. They can put more stress on the lug studs because they are not bolted solid to the hub. A wheel spacer is not going to be Hub-centric, so the lug studs are going to be absorbing all of the additional stress. http://www.summitracing.com...p-wsg5l250/overview/
An adapter with registers (Hub-centric) Bolts to the hub (with it's own studs & lug nuts) & then the wheel bolts to the adapter with studs & lug nuts. Making it all one solid assembly. Thus there is no additional load on the lug studs.
If you want to stay with the Fiero 5 on 100mm bolt pattern. You would order an adapter & then specify 5 - 100mm on both bolt patterns & hub-centric diameters on both sides of the adapter.
People talk about additional stress on the bearings, yes there is some additional stress. But wether you buy the high dollar wheels with custom offsets or you use a Hub-centric adapter to obtain the same offset, the load on the bearing remains the same. The wheel bolts solid to the adapter & is has registers (Hub-centric) so there is no difference between the wheels assembly & a custom built wheel with the same offset.
When I use adapters, only get them from Fred Goeske http://www.wheeladapter.com/index.php He makes your adapters the same day you order them & gets them out to you the next day.
Hope that helps
BTW, the wheel adapter you have pictured is a wheel adapter without the Hub-centric registers.
Archie
[This message has been edited by Archie (edited 04-28-2015).]
Ive been in every thread on this. My simple answer is buy wheels that fit your car and be done with it. You can get custom offsets and widths anyway you want.
My personal experiences on my own cars, and fixing cars with them when they lost a wheel for customers makes me firm in my belief they are unsafe. The exception is extra superior manufactured ones that cost more than wheels. I will drive on weather cracked tires before wheels on adapters any day. Everyone can have their own opinion. I had a set once on a car I bought that needed a brake rebuild. You could not get the wheels off because the secondary studs spun in the aluminum alloy. I had to literally take a cutting torch and chop up a perfect set of Cragar wheels to remove them piece by piece. I was putting correct wheels on it anyway.
Ive run the gamete. I had a wheel come off an adapter right as I pulled up to a stop light, the car dropped and I watched the wheel roll thru the intersection and stop at the curb. A friend totalled his vintage Corvette when one broke on a country road curve and sent him into a 4' deep ditch. Thats only the tip of the iceberg I have direct knowledge of.
Ive been in every thread on this. My simple answer is buy wheels that fit your car and be done with it. You can get custom offsets and widths anyway you want.
Id recommend these, http://www.motorsport-tech.com/ American made and guaranteed. Also come hub centric for the hub and wheel. I've used on much higher horsepower applications with no issues what so ever.
That would go without saying even IF you wanted them. Pay an extra few hundred for the wheels to be made to your specs, or 3 times + that for adapters that are worth anything. On my Ferrari kit, I had custom made alloy Ferrari 'look' wheels that fit the Fiero bolt pattern and had the offset and width, as well as diameter to MY specs for $1500. The wheels sat exactly where they were supposed to and needed no adapters or spacers. They were as safe as OEM wheels. Maybe thats too expensive, but I thought they were a great deal. My choice is not to buy a set of $100 PepBoys Camaro wheels and a $200 set of adapters to make them fit.
That would go without saying even IF you wanted them. Pay an extra few hundred for the wheels to be made to your specs, or 3 times + that for adapters that are worth anything. On my Ferrari kit, I had custom made alloy Ferrari 'look' wheels that fit the Fiero bolt pattern and had the offset and width, as well as diameter to MY specs for $1500. The wheels sat exactly where they were supposed to and needed no adapters or spacers. They were as safe as OEM wheels. Maybe thats too expensive, but I thought they were a great deal. My choice is not to buy a set of $100 PepBoys Camaro wheels and a $200 set of adapters to make them fit.
Absolutely. I'd go so far as to say being hubcentric is critical in regards to wheel adapter/spacer safety.
Roger and I have argued and debated about this for years. I posted the following back in 2011... it's now 2015, and I'm still using these same adapters... currently being utilized on my daily-driver '88 Formula 5-spd. Still no issues.
I run these 1" hubcentric spacers on the back of my '84. They bring my Sunfire wheels out to the edge of the fenders (instead of being tucked in too far).
I've been on an autocross track (a lot of runs) since putting them on a month ago and so far I'd say they're just fine. No added vibration at high speed at all. No loosening of lug nuts occurred after being torqued down properly.
[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 04-30-2015).]
I wasnt aware that any type of racing allowed adapters (they do spacers). I used to run a unilug type wheel on the left front of my stock car till the series banned their use. Yours havent given you a problem yet and thats good. That still has nothing to do with all the bad ones myself and my customers have had though. The only ones Ive seen that never had any issues were the wide spaced ones to use like Chevy rims on a VW or Porsche chassis. Maybe the wider spacing has something to do with that since a lot of saturday nite stock cars use whats called a 'wide 5' bolt pattern.
Back in the 60s I had a friend with a drag racing 57 Pontiac Star Chief. He had adapters on the rear wheels. He took off from the lights once and spun both rear wheels off the car at the line. Both adapters sheered off destroying both quarter panels. He didnt do that anymore.
[This message has been edited by rogergarrison (edited 04-30-2015).]
Thinks wheel spacers, which are mechanically indistinguishable from a wheel center, are dangerous. Thinks old tires, which are mechanically demonstrable to be inferior to new tires, are not. SO MUCH WIN.
I used wheel adapters years back and didn't have any problems. It might be an unfounded concern that I am not a big fan of them. You are locating the tire further outboard than before so in theory there could be more stress on the wheel studs . Used on a street/show car might not present problems but for drag racing, NHRA rules do not allow them, and my comfort level using them in this environment is poor.
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I actually don't like them either, but I tend to spend extra cash for light wheels, and undoing it all with a chunk of aluminum doesn't makes sense.
Somewhere on the internet - maybe a VW forum - some mechanical engineer jumped in with diagrams explaining what's at risk from using really anything that extends the wheel outboard from the car and it isn't so bad. Potential additional wear on wheel bearings, potential affects on steering geometry that could affect handling or tire wear, and that's about it. A common application of these things is to widen track and that's where most of the ill effects come into play. But, if you have a car that uses a +25 offset wheel, but you buy a +50 offset wheel and a 25mm spacer, the car doesn't know the difference vs. buying a +25 offset wheel in the first place, of course given equivalent widths, diameters, etc.
Straight up spacers that pass over the studs would put different stresses on the studs and could result in a hazard, although typically to do that you'd be buying longer studs that are better suited to the purpose. The spacer the OP posted, where the spacer bolts to the hub and then the wheel to the spacer, would not have those concerns. Given it is properly engineered, there is zero reason why it would inherently pose any additional risks. Consider that the hub of an aluminum wheel is subject to the exact same loads and the exact same conditions. You don't find them disintegrating terribly frequently.
Of course, in the age we live in there is a good chance of someone ending up with a poorly designed part built for cost and not function - maybe a cast part with low-quality studs - but if you're buying from a reputable source there is just no reason to worry about them. A chunk of billet aluminum is stronger than any cast wheel. There are several racing bodies which allow wheel spacers - show up at any NASA event and you'll see fully half the cars running them. I think they're legal in various SCCA classes as well.
I think where people typically run into problems is they buy cheap parts, forget to periodically check torque on the studs under the wheels, or don't account for handling changes that result from a new geometry. A good part used to restore proper offset should be of absolutely zero concern.
Thinks wheel spacers, which are mechanically indistinguishable from a wheel center, are dangerous. Thinks old tires, which are mechanically demonstrable to be inferior to new tires, are not. SO MUCH WIN.
Adapters that are cut from a block of aluminum are fine it is the cheap cast ones that fail usually on ebay, my dually uses them also my Fiero for years without any problem.
Thinks wheel spacers, which are mechanically indistinguishable from a wheel center, are dangerous. Thinks old tires, which are mechanically demonstrable to be inferior to new tires, are not. SO MUCH WIN.
I love how people change my words to fit what they think. First, I said there is nothing wrong with using spacers if they are correct, they are little more than shims or washers. Nascar approves spacers because they are NOT dangerous. But I AM dead set against using adapters to make wheels for one car fit another one. Nothing will break on a spacer, you just need to make sure you have enough stud. On tires, I never said anything about old tires being better than new ones, thats just stupid. However throwing away perfectly good ones because of the date stamped on them is just as stupid. I have no clue what your talking about with spacers and wheel centers. Ive seen first hand many adapter failures...never seen a spacer fail. Glad you see I WIN. You car comes new with what a 36,000 mile warranty ? I suppose because of that everyone should throw away the car when its either 3 years old or has that 36,000 miles. After all, thats what the manufacturer says its good for. I already said, send me those bad tires and Ill pay the shipping and you dont have to pay to dispose of them. Make money or spend it, whatever. Ill bet you every single used car over 5 years old on any lot in the country has expired tires that you say are unsafe....well except those that got new tires to replace the bald ones on them. I still havent seen anyone here yet claim they put new tires on their cars every 5 years regardless of miles...Do it if you want along with your 3000 mile oil change...your money so no sweat to me.
just to add this after checking SCCA Rulebook:
SCCA rules allow SPACERS only up to 1/4". There was nothing in the rules I read to allow adapters, AND if they are calling spacers and adapters BOTH spacers, Ive never seen an adapter only 1/4" thick. They are usually inches thick, like 2"-4". A stud run into a 1/4" thick alloy would not be safe at all to me even on the street. You need 1/2" of stud just for a lug nut to be safe, and 1/2" alloy plug with studs is twice what is allowed.
[This message has been edited by rogergarrison (edited 05-01-2015).]
Originally posted by rogergarrison: just to add this after checking SCCA Rulebook:
SCCA rules allow SPACERS only up to 1/4". There was nothing in the rules I read to allow adapters, AND if they are calling spacers and adapters BOTH spacers, Ive never seen an adapter only 1/4" thick. They are usually inches thick, like 2"-4". A stud run into a 1/4" thick alloy would not be safe at all to me even on the street. You need 1/2" of stud just for a lug nut to be safe, and 1/2" alloy plug with studs is twice what is allowed.
I did not say they are universally legal, I said they are legal in certain classes. I'd be interested to know specifically what class is limited to 1/4" aside from Stock classes, where 1/4" is a function of offset restrictions, where offset cannot be greater than .25" from stock. In fact, since a modification is legal unless it's specifically forbidden, spacers and adapters of ANY configuration are legal in any class except Stock, and I would dare you to prove me wrong with a citation from the rulebook. Friends in both ITB and DSP (including two that places very highly) use ginormous spacers on their cars. I'd encourage you to check your facts.
On the subject of fact checking, nobody suggested replacing tires after five years. Inspections should begin at five years, nobody will sell you a new/unused tire after it's six years old, and all tires should be replaced after 10 years. I replaced the ones on my motorhome last summer, replaced the ones on my XR4Ti in January, and will replace the ones on my Suburban this summer. None wore out, all ten years old. So, here's one person that takes responsibility seriously. Just for grins, here's a reposting of my CL ad from last December advertising the takeoffs from my XR:
....from the rules. The Y represents yes, and the number of Ys refers to the number of classes theyre allowed. I copy and pasted, but it would not place all the Ys in the columns under the classes. No where did I find any reference to 'adapters', only spacers. A search in the rules found nothing. There were 6 classes listed, with 3 classes allowed 1/4" max, or 0.25 inches. The below chart shows; Spacers...Yes. with Ys in the classes theyre approved.
Wheels:
Spacers Y (to correct offset) Y Y Y OEM size Y Y Y Y Y Y Offest to +/- 0.25 inch Y Y Y Y Y Y Any diameter, width, or offset Y Y Y Wheels up to 7.5" width, any diameter or offset. Y Y Y Y Y Any wheel not exceeding Appendix A size Y Any wheel mounting stud or bolt Y (Wheel studs may be changed for bolts/nuts) Y (Wheel studs may be changed for bolts/nuts) Y Center lock wheels and hubs permitted
1. This is a guide for a few classes in Solo II only. 2. You aren't reading the rulebook. You are reading an abbreviated classification guide.
Note the first bullet point:
quote
This list is not a replacement for the rulebook. It is intended as a rough guide to answer questions of the type "My car has the following mods.... What class is it in?"
Note also the very specific text:
quote
However, Street Prepared also allows tires of any diameter, width, or offset so that item, too, is listed as "Y."
Your example of DSP being *limited* to .25" spacers is in error. DSP allows ANY offset, INCLUDING spacers up to .25", hence the Y, which the text clearly indicates.
Keep trying.
[This message has been edited by thesameguy (edited 05-02-2015).]
That would go without saying even IF you wanted them. Pay an extra few hundred for the wheels to be made to your specs, or 3 times + that for adapters that are worth anything. On my Ferrari kit, I had custom made alloy Ferrari 'look' wheels that fit the Fiero bolt pattern and had the offset and width, as well as diameter to MY specs for $1500. The wheels sat exactly where they were supposed to and needed no adapters or spacers. They were as safe as OEM wheels. Maybe thats too expensive, but I thought they were a great deal. My choice is not to buy a set of $100 PepBoys Camaro wheels and a $200 set of adapters to make them fit.
I wouldn't mind $1500 for all 4 but seem to find custom ones around $1500 to $3000 each for any style I like.
has made me giveup a dozen times. So any constructive help will be greatly appreciated. 
I posted the following back in 2011... it's now 2015, and I'm still using these same adapters... currently being utilized on my daily-driver '88 Formula 5-spd. Still no issues.
