I assumed this project died on the vine. But maybe not.

quote Originally posted by Wichita: I assumed this project died on the vine. But maybe not.

Not sure after some comments Dukesterpro posted in other threads & added ask a lawyer to this one so not "Hijack" other non-related other pages.

Just Multiple "prototypes" send out can be lawsuits if they failed for any reason & cause problems to car or people. May sue him & "school" since tied to a "school" paper. Is why all "school" & industry studies for various topics have sections in the "contract" to wave rights if things go wrong. Many people in studies don't read them & get hurt or dead & victim or family can't sue.

They know Way too Many jump on the lawsuit train as soon as anything goes sideways. Is also why my Dash Cam is On any time I drive because last "crash" the person claim "whiplash" until Cops & all I-co had seen the video for hitting me. That 1 < 30 sec video clip saved me enough headaches to "pay for itself" many times over.

I don't think anyone, lawyer or not is safe from lawsuits. Im doing my due diligence on the legal side. Ogre, it's going to be okay man, relax. Yes, most yuppies will dive for a lawsuit, but in this specific market for this specific car, I think it's going to be okay.

Also, your whole statement on relays is just bizarre. I understand chineseum components are going to be inferior to US and Japanese competition. I definitely wouldn't trust their alleged 480VAC 50A peak rating. But cycling 20peak amps at 12V is something they proved they could indeed do. I chambered these relays for 50k cycles (30/min) switching the direction of a 20amp motor and didn't experience one failure. I am fairly confident in what will work here.

Regardless,

The reason this project has been taking so long is that I am trying to do away with the relay altogether and make the whole shebang transistor a controlled and solid state.

I have to admit, I was unaware that the corvette headlight controllers were available to operate gen 2 headlights, so the project has fallen on the priority list.

ANY DIY module needs two things to eliminate Gen1 relay setup or emulate Gen2 module:
Kill power @ any time the motor stalls. Many Methods for "Arduino" to monitor Amp Draw by X part. Cheap are Hall Effect units that isolate motor etc power from 5 or 3.3 V the "Arduino" uses.
Timer Kill for any other case like Gears break teeth so motor won't run forever.

To install in Gen1 need to "short" 1 limit switch so only use two wires & remove/bypass relays & maybe adjust some program values vs Gen2 motors.
Even still the Gen1 motors are slower then Gen2.

"Arduino" is Quoted here because nearly any MCU w/ enough I/O pins can work. You don't need Arduino IDE or Python "Operating System" but is much easier for most users.

Whatever relays you tested is Different then the Relays in that other thread ( https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/144920.html )
Go read the Data Sheets there then sheet you tested above too.
Again, Relay in OE Gen2 module only set Direction. MOSFETs turn power on/off or that Relay would die quick too. Because that Relay, Omron MY series, contacts only rated 2 A at 24 VDC inductive load but will carry full 5a if not use to switch power, AKA the rated carry current. https://www.mouser.com/Prod...w%2FGItuu9gNxw%3D%3D

As to "solid state" module is as simple using 2 H Bridges to run the motors. Can Make H-bridges or buy them but most of them uses PWM & don't need for this job so read data sheet & other doc's before buying.

GM likely could had use H-bridges too but found another way to make the module that's likely cheaper for Thousands of cars that need them + space needed for parts @ that time... Example: The 2 TO220 Case MOSFETS have the rivet & patch of copper on the bottom of the board as Heat Sink to handle the 5 sec max On time. Most times there On for < 1 sec.

"Arduino" & other chips sleeping is more important then you think Because the Starting Battery is "Dead" @ 12-11.9 volts. Oh might get away w/ starting a car w/ battery @ 11 - 10v & weather is good but the Battery will Hate you every time & shorten the life. The Alternator Hates this too because the "dead" Battery can "overload" it pulling way more amps to charge. That Why GM made CS alt's to Not Turn On w/ a "dead" battery when it manage to start the car. GM saw Thousands of SI alts dead under Warranty for that problem so added self protect feature in designing the CS & later series.

4 ref: Just OE Gen2 Module, ECM & "Radio" can drain a Battery to "dead" @ 12v in about 2 weeks in weather not too hot or cold. That w/ a New Battery & not cheapest ones either. Older or weaker battery is often "dead" @ 12v after ~ 1 week in good weather. Is Why I & Others have Battery Tender etc & use them when can't drive more then a week between trips.
(Weaker = New bat but less CA CCA & shorter Reserve Capacity for a "cheap" battery.)

[This message has been edited by theogre (edited 09-26-2023).]

So my module does detect any time the motor is stalled. If you put your hand over the headlight cover it will stop as soon as it finds extra resistance.

I tried a bunch of different methods for detecting current but I found that those cheapo hall effect sensors, while not as precise, were the most reliable in detecting stall conditions with the most accuracy. These just use 5v, Gnd, and a passthrough for your power. In fact, they are so consistent that using a scanner card to monitor line amperage across each channel (channel being one headlight) peak amperage NEVER exceeded 9.2amps. Which is a far cry from the eye-watering near 20amp peak of the OEM module.

I think the whole discussion on Gen 1 vs. Gen 2 motors is over. Since the only thing you need to do to install Gen 2 motors on Gen 1 bucks is shorten 1 bolt (The lowest of the 3) by 3/4 of an inch and since Gen 2 motors are readily available, there is zero purpose in continuing to use Gen 1 motors. Gen 2 is the answer.

Yes, the battery voltage will dip below 12v from a fully charged battery in less than 16 days of no running. Similar to the OEM module. However, it becomes a moot point since this has no effect on daily driven cars like mine. Plus if you are planning on parking for a while you can simply throw the master switch on my module to disconnect the 12 to 5v power supply for the MC. Leaving you with no parasitic draw. Or if you hook it up to a battery tender, it also becomes a moot point. I would like to find a better option for reducing the draw. But it does seem to do the trick for now.

[This message has been edited by Dukesterpro (edited 09-26-2023).]

I'm still highly interested in this.

quote Originally posted by Wichita: I'm still highly interested in this.

As soon as I can ditch the relays for integrated solid state motor controllers I will feel comfortable enough to start sending out samples

If you are sensitive to any possible litigation; have those testing the prototypes have sign a release statement that acknowledges that the units sent for testing are a new untested design that they are being used as such =and that the supplier will be held harmless for any possible bad result.

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quote Originally posted by Dukesterpro: there is zero purpose in continuing to use Gen 1 motors. Gen 2 is the answer.

Would someone smarter than me, please post the popcorn eating picture...

quote Originally posted by buddycraigg: Would someone smarter than me, please post the popcorn eating picture...

Bring it on lol

were you going to post the popcorn eating moving picture thingie?

quote Originally posted by Dukesterpro: Yes, the battery voltage will dip below 12v from a fully charged battery in less than 16 days of no running. Similar to the OEM module. However, it becomes a moot point since this has no effect on daily driven cars like mine. Plus if you are planning on parking for a while you can simply throw the master switch on my module to disconnect the 12 to 5v power supply for the MC. Leaving you with no parasitic draw. Or if you hook it up to a battery tender, it also becomes a moot point. I would like to find a better option for reducing the draw. But it does seem to do the trick for now.

Leech problem drain in 14-16 days in Good Weather may not care...
In Winter & see < 32 or 0°F or Summer > 95°F, Battery @ 12V isn't only problem.

Winter w/ battery even Half Charge can allow Battery to Freeze. Even if doesn't freeze, engine & more are cold w/ make it harder to start + battery makes Less Power when cold & why CA @ 32°F vs CCA @ 0°F spec's matters.
Summer makes it harder to start just because of Higher Starter Circuit Resistance. Fractions of Ω adding to the circuit can matter when battery is dumping 120-150 amps to the starter Motors & Solenoid that pulls the Bendix in. (Solenoid alone draws ~ 30 amps & have a lot more wiring to get thru.)

Because US is Huge vs Most, battery companies often sells Starter Batteries for "southern" & "northern" states because make charges for average temps year round. May look Identical to most but minor Grid design & other "mods" make battery last longer in the Regions to sell. So Southern battery can take heat better while Northern battery take Cold better.

So Even on "Daily drive cars" W/ new batteries & full charge will often Won't Start in Winter parked over night or a weekend & weather drops below 0°.
I had a small charger or battery heater to keep the battery warm @ full change when Weather Report calls for minus 10° or more.