⚠️ Because of Recent updates to Chrome PC Now Seems Doogle and likely others based on the crap now hates shorturl.com links.
Example:

quote This page isn’t working fierocave.shorturl.com redirected you too many times. Try clearing your cookies. ERR_TOO_MANY_REDIRECTS

Cleaning cookies etc won't help so don't bother do that.

I'm Not digging thru hundreds of posts to fix a Google created problem. Not sure I'll "fix" it in the near future either. (Any that have Comcast or others are Totally Dead links and won't be fixed.)

Use FF or maybe Apple Safari to view the Cave w/ shorturl.com links.
Those are the Only browsers that is not based on Chrome.

or dig thru Archive.org that's owned by Google too.
⚠️ Warning: going to Archive.org directly often causes problems too as it try to push very old pages using old menus that needed Java Programing Language installed. Do Not install Java as that will be a huge security hole. This is Why the "new" menu is HTML5 and does not need any host services other then bare basic web hosting. Most pages even works when Java Script is disabled for any reason.

Before this, Many Phones, Tablets, and others have "Lobotomize" browsers and other problems because of memory space etc and can't handle processing the Cave. I made the Cave to be Fully HTML5 and most current Arm Based Products still can't handle it. And No, I'm not going to write a app. This is a big reason Why many places have their own Apps to access their services.

------------------
Dr. Ian Malcolm: Yeah, but your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn't stop to think if they should.
(Jurassic Park)

The Ogre's Fiero Cave

People actually use Chrome?

quote Originally posted by RWDPLZ: People actually use Chrome?

Unfortunately Yes.
Some Think that Brave Edge Opera and others are different but all are Chrome based that have or will have all of same bugs and other problems as Chrome right now because they are basically Skins of Chrome. Believe only Tor Browser is Skin of FF.

Oh the Skin jobs Might Remove or Change Telemetry and other "phone home" crap but to render a Page is pure Chrome.

Right Now FF is only in Business because Google dumps huge amounts of $ to burn by FF Management to fight Anti Trust in US and other Markets but even that gets harder to swallow. IOW Google does not want Netscape's Navigator vs M$ again so is cheap for Google to keep propping up Failing FF Year after Year so look as "competition" to Google.

Safari is only very distant Second to Chrome because has so many Phones.
FF and others can't dig out of noise/crowd in most charts and no hope to reach just 10% share but again Edge Opera and most others are only Skins of Chrome not "real" browsers.
https://gs.statcounter.com/browser-market-share
https://www.similarweb.com/browsers/
https://kinsta.com/browser-market-share/

[This message has been edited by theogre (edited 02-12-2023).]

quote Originally posted by RWDPLZ: People actually use Chrome?

I thought Chrome was the bees knees after using Internet Express.

quote Originally posted by theogre: [QUOTE]Originally posted by RWDPLZ: People actually use Chrome?

Unfortunately Yes.
Some Think that Brave Edge Opera and others are different but all are Chrome based that have or will have all of same bugs and other problems as Chrome right now because they are basically Skins of Chrome. Believe only Tor Browser is Skin of FF.

Oh the Skin jobs Might Remove or Change Telemetry and other "phone home" crap but to render a Page is pure Chrome.

Right Now FF is only in Business because Google dumps huge amounts of $ to burn by FF Management to fight Anti Trust in US and other Markets but even that gets harder to swallow. IOW Google does not want Netscape's Navigator vs M$ again so is cheap for Google to keep propping up Failing FF Year after Year so look as "competition" to Google.

Safari is only very distant Second to Chrome because has so many Phones.
FF and others can't dig out of noise/crowd in most charts and no hope to reach just 10% share but again Edge Opera and most others are only Skins of Chrome not "real" browsers.
https://gs.statcounter.com/browser-market-share
https://www.similarweb.com/browsers/
https://kinsta.com/browser-market-share/

[/QUOTE]


I remember when you used to be able to easily make your OWN web browser through things like Borland's Delphi and Microsoft's Visual C++.

Literally, you would put a text-box at the top for people to type in the URL, and then have a display window underneath it, and a "SUBMIT" button next to the URL that sent the URL. The "internet window component" would simply use some of the shared DLLs and sockets that IE used, and were HTML 4 compliant. Worked perfectly... no plug-ins, no fear of getting hacked... etc.

What about Edge?

quote Originally posted by Wichita: What about Edge?

Edge is chrome based too.

Internet Explorer still works to view the Cave too if still have that.

quote Originally posted by Dukesterpro: Edge is chrome based too.

Yup as already covered above.
The "Skin jobs" make work now but in the next or three upgrades/updates stops working as has updates the Chromium based on w/o a clue exactly what they are.

But Why?

First M$ "Killed" IE after v12 v11 to force Win8 etc users to use Edge that @ first was a "new" product from the ground up.
But this Failed Miserably mainly because Big Business etc have build apps that work often only on whatever version of IE. Like many push to "kill" IEv9 and Failed for same reason...

Folks, These "apps" run many things in a Business that never are publish for outside use.
The Public doesn't know there is Manufacturing and other processes that must have FDA FAA and Other Gov Approval to operate.
Even w/o that... Big Banks and related still have payment processes and more that still run w/ way old mainframes, PC w/ DOS, Win3.X and Win9x. Not just can't/won't update the software UI or other high level programs but the PC control Machines costing Millions to buy and Drivers can't be updated/upgrades to run on ANY WinNT XP and later. Forget about x64 OS at all. If those machine are Down for any reason, the Company can Loose Many Millions of $ Per Second. Many things can't run in a VM like using DosBox VMWare etc.

An Extreme Example: Most people don't know that US Nuke Power Plants have "PC" and more in the plans to make and operate them. (The Plans must = Reality to get and keep a License from Feds and State at time this happened. Back to story...)
Many Years ago a PC died at one near plant and could not operate with out finding Exact Make and Model for all parts.... Think that's easy? Maybe if the dead PC was an IBM. Nope. They designed around Dec/Digital Rainbow PC that Ran Dec version of CP/M OS. I know about this because one company I work at had a few of them and a few match numbers the nuke plant needed. How Found? likely Nuke plant called Dec then Dec called everyone ever bought a Rainbow. X co said still have some and Nuke plant IT came in a hurry.

M$ forget that most Windows Buyers are VLM buyers like Big Banks etc. and Dell HP and other OEM...
Big problems is Vast amount of Buyers from these OEM are also Big Banks etc that quickly Wiping the OEM copy to install VLM copy that have Business Programs, lock down OS using GPedit as is made for and allot more. So while M$ sees 2 OS sold, Only 1 is actually used.
Dell Optiplex Latitude and some other brands are the main product, HP has similar bands, and all made for Business Use not home or gaming even if that work for that and available to the public. And why a laugh that everyone claiming Dell/HP/Intel makes computers that spy on you via built in management hardware on Business computers. Is made so Business IT can wipe data, reload VLM copy of OS and more w/o touching the machine.

So Edge is only for "Consumer" Non Critical Use in many Enterprises and so M$ stopping spending big $ for a failed browser and easy and cheap to Skin Chrome and Send Telemetry to M$ and likely Google too while keep claiming "Edge is bestest browser ever."

[This message has been edited by theogre (edited 02-14-2023).]

I typically use FireFox... unfortunately I need to have Chrome in for a few odd issues. One is with Fedex of all places, there is some handshake issue where any FedEx tracking number I punch in there it says it has no information.

A few other sites act funny as well. So I keep Chrome installed for that reason (yes, went through normal troubleshooting, shutting off plugins, etc. Found a Firefox thread about the FedEx issue).

The downside of things getting standardized.... but not across all the layers. Way too many kitbashes that can go on behind the scenes (like Ogre called out, Java, HTML, HTML5, etc).

Note:
If have IE11 now under Win10...
M$ is sending/sent "Updates" to Kill That Today and Forcing Edge on you.
I think will set "Kill Bits" in the registry so can't run the program by other work-arounds and hacks.

Covered in many places but short version is https://nolongerset.com/death-of-ie11/

Didn't know that Edge is Chrome-based! I visit a few sites where Edge works but Chrome doesn't, and vice versa.

quote Originally posted by theogre: Note: If have IE11 now under Win10... M$ is sending/sent "Updates" to Kill That Today and Forcing Edge on you. I think will set "Kill Bits" in the registry so can't run the program by other work-arounds and hacks. Covered in many places but short version is https://nolongerset.com/death-of-ie11/

IE11, while it was a good browser. Is a tremendous security hazard, old, slow, crappy piece of software. Good Riddance.

I hate chrome, but there are plenty of modern lightweight alternatives to IE11.

quote Originally posted by Notorio: Didn't know that Edge is Chrome-based! I visit a few sites where Edge works but Chrome doesn't, and vice versa.

Is 1 to several reasons that can happen, but 2 quick Examples:
1. like above is all "Skin Jobs" are 1 to many versions of Chromium behind Chrome. future updates to a skin may break as they update Chromium too.
2. minor or major changes on a Skin may work better or worse then other Skins or Chrome itself @ a given site.
Like?
Many sites look @ ID strings from any browser... When sees IE Edge FF Safari etc sends different page layout info. Even a Default layout for everything else.
Old Cave actually "Bans" defunct WebTV doing same and told users to use anything else via the Browser ID.

And this is exactly why someone needs to put a lid on Google and start regulating every move they make. How a basic search engine company became the rulers of the internet without any roadblocks is beyond me. They were also responsible for the closure of hundreds of gaming websites and job losses when they decided that Adobe Flash was not safe and blocked it on their browsers.

[This message has been edited by IMSA GT (edited 02-15-2023).]

quote Originally posted by IMSA GT: And this is exactly why someone needs to put a lid on Google and start regulating every move they make. How a basic search engine company became the rulers of the internet without any roadblocks is beyond me. They were also responsible for the closure of hundreds of gaming websites and job losses when they decided that Adobe Flash was not safe and blocked it on their browsers.

Apple was first to Ban Flash and Shockwave from all iCrap and Phones. Because besides huge security problems that would allow anything in Apple's Wall Garden including P--- that Jobs "hated."

Flash were and Java still is giant security problems. Acrobat too... Many browsers and other programs can read and write PDF but as a Clone of a Subset of PDF(Postscript) language and many PDF docs and forms don't work right because generated by X but user have Y to see, fill out forms etc. Many 3rd party programs barf up a lung trying to display big doc's like Fiero and other FSM.

So these "PS Clones" might be safer or far worse then using Acrobat Reader.

As to Anti-Trust... US and other Gov has been a joke for Decades to "Fight" most things allowing Google to take over when M$ Slept. First clue that warn many was Google Buying DoubleClick and other Ad Farms without comment from DOJ FTC or EU and more. If EU or others find violated anti-trust does nothing. Google can dump Billions w/o blinking same as M$ before that...
US... M$ "Loosing" Browser Wars cost nothing in the end and M$ company, BG and others still got Billions of $.
EU... M$ had WinXN to "add a choice" menu after "loosing" browser wars in EU and most users just used IE. Adding menu cost nothing to M$ and Fines were a very few Drops in a Ocean.

Update:
Tried setting some feature from shorturl.com but seem doesn't help or take time for you to see changes. shorturl changes happen now but your chrome etc may need to clear cache etc.

Full Link for cave: http://web.archive.org/web/...cast.net/~fierocave/
or
https://web.archive.org/web...cast.net/~fierocave/
But even that can cause problems for whatever browser you use.

[This message has been edited by theogre (edited 03-10-2023).]

Update:
I finally found the Chrome setting to allow fierocave.shorturl.com to work again.
In Chrome & likely other browsers based on that...
Click 3 dots on upper left right window, Settings, Privacy and security, Pop-ups and redirects, Allowed to send pop-ups and use redirects,
Add: fierocave.shorturl.com

⚠️ Warning: Do Not add *.shorturl.com as Chrome suggest or just shorturl.com
*. is a "wildcard" that allows any site on shorturl.com to work & many don't want that.

Then I change shorturl to hide some frames from archive.org again so short link pages like these Examples so they seem work too...
See my Cave, Bad Chemicals
See my Cave, Fuel & Knock

Why do you hide archive.org frames?
Before... Hiding archive.org makes the cave to display/render correctly + hides money whining from a ".org" that gets huge $ from the real company that run them. (IOW similar scam by PBS/NPR in the US or BBC & TV licensing in the UK.)
Now does all that + Chrome can connect directly to a page.

So now old post & links w/ shorturl.com work again for Chrome & other browsers based on that.

[This message has been edited by theogre (edited 12-06-2023).]