Has anyone ever deleted their pop-up headlights by creating new covers from existing headlights.
I know that if you just cover the openings with flat clear plastic the bulbs are stuck back in a hole and do not project the light properly. I am pretty sure I could fab some sort of bucket to hold the bulbs, but I don't have a clue how to form or mold the curved lenses needed to let the bulbs stick out far enough to function properly.
I have seen huge headlight lenses on trucks and RVs that appear big enough and have enough curvature to "carve" the lenses I need from them.
Has anyone ever deleted their pop-up headlights by creating new covers from existing headlights.
I know that if you just cover the openings with flat clear plastic the bulbs are stuck back in a hole and do not project the light properly. I am pretty sure I could fab some sort of bucket to hold the bulbs, but I don't have a clue how to form or mold the curved lenses needed to let the bulbs stick out far enough to function properly.
I have seen huge headlight lenses on trucks and RVs that appear big enough and have enough curvature to "carve" the lenses I need from them.
Anyone ever seen this done before?
A company named PISA used to produce headlight covers that had small bumps, almost like gator eyes that protruded an inch or so above the closed position in the middle (like a lump). I've also seen some where it recesses the headlight location for which you can then install low profile headlights, and then you simply have a clear plastic cover for the headlight.
Personally though, with the 1980s being all the rage today in 2023, the headlights are a big part of the appeal of these older cars. Because of lobbying from the insurance industry to pass NHTSA SN# 108, and successful tort litigation from victims of pedestrian/vehicular accidents, pop-up headlights are essentially banned in the United States. Not banned per-se that you're not allowed to make them, but that it's essentially completely impossible to design a headlight that would be able to pass scrutiny.
Don't get me started... the reason why cars all look the same today, is because of tort law and the insurance industry. Still, tort is the single greatest protection an individual has against an entity, corporation, or organization for redress... so while I don't like at all what's happened... I wouldn't change law. But it does mean that as time goes on, older cars will become more valuable in light of less appealing newer cars for enthusiasts.
National Highway Traffic Safety Administration's Standard No. 108.
From personal experience with flush mount and covered headlights, they look good during the daytime, but they do not light up the road at night. There have been several designs for the Fiero, and they all suck big-time.
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]: A company named PISA used to produce headlight covers that had small bumps, almost like gator eyes that protruded an inch or so above the closed position in the middle (like a lump).
These sound like the ones I saw from EmbraceRacing.
I had actually seen them before I ever owned a Fiero. When I got mine last month the first thing I did was go to order a pair, but they were out of stock. Based on the low demand I doubt he will ever make any more.
Appearance is a matter of taste. I know some people like the pop-up headlight, but I have never cared for them.
These sound like the ones I saw from EmbraceRacing.
I had actually seen them before I ever owned a Fiero. When I got mine last month the first thing I did was go to order a pair, but they were out of stock. Based on the low demand I doubt he will ever make any more.
Appearance is a matter of taste. I know some people like the pop-up headlight, but I have never cared for them.
The more I read about melting/forming acrylic, the more I think I might try it. It is not that expensive either. I can get a 24" X 48' sheet of 3/8" for about $100. That would give me eight 12" x 12" pieces to get 2 good ones out of.
Appearance is a matter of taste. I know some people like the pop-up headlight, but I have never cared for them.
I like the factory pop-up headlights just fine when they're down. When the headlights are up, well, at least they're doing their job... and they do it well. However, I find the aftermarket headlight blobs that stick out of the hood 24/7 to be ugly as sin, and they do a crap job of lighting up the road to boot. Two thumbs down for aftermarket blob headlights!
Originally posted by fredtoast: Has anyone ever deleted their pop-up headlights by creating new covers from existing headlights. <snip> Anyone ever seen this done before?
Many have "upgraded" and all Suck and/or are Illegal for many reasons.
#1 is any Cover over HL are Illegal in many places even if some Cops and Inspectors may ignore that. If you drive in to another states or region in a state etc the Covers can be easy reason to Stop you.
Is why part of why many w/ "Munson" HL "upgrade" has problems beside light output is crap while using "DOT Legal" Bulbs. Use Search including archives.
Don't confuse w/ any type of Factory Installed "Areo" HL assemblies that Meet FMVSS and other Government Rules and "DOT" Marked showing as "approved" assembly.
Before you ask, "low" Popups have problems too and often Illegal because use Fog/Driving lamps as HL and other crap. Then often don't even install them right so Lift assembly often causes problems w/ the door.
So that's some "background..."
Repurpose OEM HL from other vehicles can have same headaches. Like light output moved to Fiero is crap as said above.
Even when have "DOT" marking because those "Codes" mean something and many can read them including Cops and Inspectors. Example: Many OEM "aero" HL assemblies have front park/turn and more features coded in the DOT/SAE marks. some "highlights" of code meaning covered in my cave. https://web.archive.org/web...cast.net/~fierocave/ Light bulbs Can find more data using web search. But note that some "Recent" codes are still "buried" the SAE Doc's that is hidden by SAE Paywall and likely part of why NHTSA remove the old "posters" showing many codes for Truck/Bus Industry. (Those "posters" don't have new codes for many HL setups alone.)
------------------ Dr. Ian Malcolm: Yeah, but your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn't stop to think if they should. (Jurassic Park)
Originally posted by theogre:Many have "upgraded" and all Suck and/or are Illegal for many reasons.
#1 is any Cover over HL are Illegal in many places even if some Cops and Inspectors may ignore that. If you drive in to another states or region in a state etc the Covers can be easy reason to Stop you.
Is why part of why many w/ "Munson" HL "upgrade" has problems beside light output is crap while using "DOT Legal" Bulbs. Use Search including archives.
Don't confuse w/ any type of Factory Installed "Areo" HL assemblies that Meet FMVSS and other Government Rules and "DOT" Marked showing as "approved" assembly.
Before you ask, "low" Popups have problems too and often Illegal because use Fog/Driving lamps as HL and other crap. Then often don't even install them right so Lift assembly often causes problems w/ the door.
So that's some "background..."
Repurpose OEM HL from other vehicles can have same headaches. Like light output moved to Fiero is crap as said above.
Even when have "DOT" marking because those "Codes" mean something and many can read them including Cops and Inspectors. Example: Many OEM "aero" HL assemblies have front park/turn and more features coded in the DOT/SAE marks. some "highlights" of code meaning covered in my cave. https://web.archive.org/web...cast.net/~fierocave/ Light bulbs Can find more data using web search. But note that some "Recent" codes are still "buried" the SAE Doc's that is hidden by SAE Paywall and likely part of why NHTSA remove the old "posters" showing many codes for Truck/Bus Industry. (Those "posters" don't have new codes for many HL setups alone.)
Thanks for the info Ogre. From what I have seen some of the kits available did not come close to projecting enough light to drive safely at night. I can't have that with my car.
And I also plan to keep them from blinding oncoming traffic.
If I don't have either one of those problems I can 100% guarantee that I will never get pulled over for illegal headlights. Since police can always get me for speeding they don't have to resort to those tricks.
[This message has been edited by fredtoast (edited 06-29-2023).]
I bow to you Fieroguru. This list is EXACTLY what I have been looking for!!
Unfortunately most of these involve major bodywork/fabrication. I am going to limit myself roughly to the area of the existing holes in my hood.
And I am afraid that many of these will not have great illumination due to the bulbs sitting back in a hole. That is fine for show cars, but my car is going to be driven all the time.
These appear to be the best option for what I want. I am anxious to see what I can find.
quote
Originally posted by fieroguru:
I think these are aftermarket Rx7 or 3000GT headlights:
But in the mean time I have already given up on the idea of carving lenses from existing headlights. Instead, if I can't find what I want, I will try thermoforming acrylic lenses. They would have to bulge above the hood to allow the bulbs to sit forward, but if I make the front of the lens vertical and make them match the size/shape of the square holes in the bumper directly beneath them they will look very natural.
And even if it is a complete failure I will have fun trying. This car is a toy. I am going to enjoy playing with it.
[This message has been edited by fredtoast (edited 06-29-2023).]
Originally posted by fieroguru: Sunfire, 4th Gen Camaro and Grand Prix headlights
These "upgrade" are Illegal is many places and even ignore that because installed way too low the light output sucks when aiming is correct.
In General... HL must be between Min and Max Height + Must be Above the Bumper.
Sim Reason Part of why many "Jacked" Trucks have problems because Bumpers, HL and Taillights are too High in many places.
Many drive mostly during day and/or in cities etc where have external lights to see... Others are simple fools that don't care but "upgrade" HL look "better." I've driven a lot out of Town at Night and bad HL for Any Reason are Beyond Sucking. Even iffy OEM setups w/ old "worn out" standard bulbs or iffy wiring making them "dim" makes driving very bad time.
Example: PA TP Northeast Ext, NY 17 5 20 Thruway, I81, and many others between cities at night w/ iffy Headlights can be Fatal because never see Deer and related until far too late. Was way Happy when Halogen Seal Beam bulbs was available to the Public to replace the standard units even tho ~ same amps used to meet DOT and most state laws/rules. Buying $20 (Each) Halogen SB was a lot of $ many years ago but way worth the cost.
Because you often see animals Eyes in a field and light brush moving toward the road when most OEM HL Work. I lost count many years ago that fact save me so many times. Even when I've stopped, Deer can hit me because running away from something else but Way Less damage. That happen 2 times.
Note that Many Fiero years or trim levels came w/ Standard HL Bulbs Not Halogens. Many old GM vehicles still have Factory Guide non Halogen HL... Guide is part of Old GM parts division before spun off to Delphi.
At Carlisle there was a guy that was not happy with the frontal light output of his headlights and he did this:
------------------ " THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Spintech/Hedman Exhaust, P-log Manifold, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, Champion Radiator, S10 Brake Booster, HP Tuners VCM Suite. "THE COLUSSUS" 87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H " ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "
[This message has been edited by Dennis LaGrua (edited 06-30-2023).]
Originally posted by Dennis LaGrua: At Carlisle there was a guy that was not happy with the frontal light output of his headlights and he did this:
Big Deal, Not... Many have "Fog" and "Driving" for Decades but Big problem is most are Garbage and blind other people.
Those are "-" because Very few Aftermarkets kits are "Dot Approved" and performance is all over the spectrum. LED units are no difference here.
Even ignore that, many states and other places have rules when you run them if even allowed to run them. 1. Low Beam HL must be On at same time. 2. Many go further and restrict only On in bad weather.
This Is why Most Factory Driving lights for 20+ years always default to Off every time the vehicle is started. Either by switch/"relay" design like many rear defog setups or control by BCM is default Off. Cave pages have "Correct" Relay setup for them for same reason but doesn't "Reset" to Off if aux light switch is On.
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Dennis LaGrua: At Carlisle there was a guy that was not happy with the frontal light output of his headlights and he did this:
Big Deal, Not... Many have "Fog" and "Driving" for Decades but Big problem is most are Garbage and blind other people.
Those are "-" because Very few Aftermarkets kits are "Dot Approved" and performance is all over the spectrum. LED units are no difference here.
Even ignore that, many states and other places have rules when you run them if even allowed to run them. 1. Low Beam HL must be On at same time. 2. Many go further and restrict only On in bad weather.
This Is why Most Factory Driving lights for 20+ years always default to Off every time the vehicle is started. Either by switch/"relay" design like many rear defog setups or control by BCM is default Off. Cave pages have "Correct" Relay setup for them for same reason but doesn't "Reset" to Off if aux light switch is On.[/QUOTE]
You worry too much about government bureaucrats on things that are seldom if ever challenged on a custom vehicle. In my state they don't ever inspect cars over 25 years old or those registered as special interest vehicles. If you ask m,e more light upfront makes a car safer not less safe.
------------------ " THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Spintech/Hedman Exhaust, P-log Manifold, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, Champion Radiator, S10 Brake Booster, HP Tuners VCM Suite. "THE COLUSSUS" 87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H " ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "
If I had a show car that I did not drive at night I would not care if the lights were functional or not. A lot of guys are in that situation. They just want the car to look unique, and that is fine.
However, I am going to be driving my car a lot. I don't really care about regulations, but I do care about my ability to see and drive safely. Blinding oncoming traffic is just as dangerous as not being able to see the road yourself.
[This message has been edited by fredtoast (edited 07-02-2023).]
Originally posted by Dennis LaGrua: You worry too much about government bureaucrats on things that are seldom if ever challenged on a custom vehicle. In my state they don't ever inspect cars over 25 years old or those registered as special interest vehicles. If you ask m,e more light upfront makes a car safer not less safe.
No. Is Not about Regulation or State Inspection. 90+% of Aftermarket "Fog" or "Driving" lights are just Labels to sell Compete Crap that blinds other drivers. This has been True for Decades and now including most LEDs kits.
Any Blinding lights, "Dead" Lights for any reason or Drive w/ OEM or Aftermarket "Fog" or "Driving" lights w/o LB HL in many states including NJ is easy Ticked for many Cops regardless of what or how old a vehicle is or registered as antique etc. Many states have laws/rules for "Rally" and other lights too.
If the cops Stops and Write Only for those cases, are often an "Equipment" Violation w/ Fines and in some States means Points too.
Just because you got away w/ those problems for months to years, next time you drive you start gambling again when Cops stop you or a blind driver hits you. In the later case, good luck dealing w/ Insurance Co. etc for car w/ crap "updates." More so now when more people have Dash Cam's sending Video to I-co and Cops capturing a crash.
My lights came from Projector Retrofit. Too bad he stopped production. They're quite nice. Have been on the car for years. With halogen lamps, and the appropriate projectors, the light has a very sharp cutoff to the upper left, so as to not blind oncoming drivers. In all the years I've been driving with them. I've only been "bright lighted" once. And that was on a twisty road, where I couldn't help shining into the other lane.
Sluppy123 is now doing a very similar, but different, setup.
[This message has been edited by Raydar (edited 07-03-2023).]
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