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No ses light by Iboughtafiero
Started on: 04-18-2025 02:37 PM
Replies: 14 (154 views)
Last post by: Iboughtafiero on 04-21-2025 12:32 PM
Iboughtafiero
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Report this Post04-18-2025 02:37 PM Click Here to See the Profile for IboughtafieroSend a Private Message to IboughtafieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
So for all you fear all mechanics out there here is a very weird thing with my 86 GT. I have no service engine light yet when I put a light tester on ground and I poke the cable A5 pen off the ECU the cable light lights up in the mill turns on This is key on engine on I remove the cable tester. The light turns off isn’t the cable tester just checking for 12 V because a five should be 12 V with Keon engine on. Basically my car does not run past the cold start ignition and I’m trying to troubleshoot. I don’t know if it’s my ECU or if it is something else now I replaced the distributor the cap, the rotor, the ICM and the big coil pack any thoughts?
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Report this Post04-18-2025 04:09 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Vintage-NutSend a Private Message to Vintage-NutEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
I have no service engine light yet when I put a light tester on ground


Switch the ECM to Diagnostic Mode by Jumper terminal "A" to "B"

With terminal A jumpered to B, turn ignition to "ON" but do not start the engine.

Whenever the ECM is switched to Diagnostic mode, it will flash code 12 three times after which it will flash all stored trouble codes.

https://www.fiero.nl/cgi-bin/main.cgi?ECMCodes

------------------
Original Owner of a Silver '88 GT
Under 'Production Refurbishment' @ 136k Miles

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Iboughtafiero
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Report this Post04-18-2025 04:26 PM Click Here to See the Profile for IboughtafieroSend a Private Message to IboughtafieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
That’s the thing I get no codes no ses. If I poke the ses wire (brn/wht) off the ecm. It lights up the Ses. I’m pretty sure the ecm is toast. Also that cable should be 12v with KOEO. It’s 6v. Battery is showing12v.
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Vintage-Nut
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Report this Post04-18-2025 06:01 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Vintage-NutSend a Private Message to Vintage-NutEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
That’s the thing I get no codes no ses. If I poke the ses wire (brn/wht) off the ecm. It lights up the Ses.


I'm Confused: "no codes / no ses" BUT you say the brn/wht wire off the ecm lights up the Ses....

 
quote
Basically my car does not run past the cold start ignition and I’m trying to troubleshoot.


This is a step-by-step testing procedure for the ignition system and module:

How To Test The GM Distributor Mounted Ignition Module
https://easyautodiagnostics...or-mounted-icm-tests

[This message has been edited by Vintage-Nut (edited 04-18-2025).]

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olejoedad
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Report this Post04-18-2025 07:41 PM Click Here to See the Profile for olejoedadSend a Private Message to olejoedadEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post





The gage fuse provides power to the SES light at all times.

The ECU provides a ground path that causes the light to turn on.

Use the above chart to diagnose your problem.

[This message has been edited by olejoedad (edited 04-18-2025).]

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Mike in Sydney
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Report this Post04-19-2025 05:27 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Mike in SydneySend a Private Message to Mike in SydneyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Post omitted.

[This message has been edited by Mike in Sydney (edited 04-19-2025).]

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Iboughtafiero
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Report this Post04-19-2025 07:01 AM Click Here to See the Profile for IboughtafieroSend a Private Message to IboughtafieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by olejoedad:






The gage fuse provides power to the SES light at all times.

The ECU provides a ground path that causes the light to turn on.

Use the above chart to diagnose your problem.



I appreciate this. Though it is for 2.5 tbi. Where would I get the docs for 2.8 v6, or is the same steps?
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olejoedad
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Report this Post04-19-2025 08:23 AM Click Here to See the Profile for olejoedadSend a Private Message to olejoedadEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Same steps.
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olejoedad
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Report this Post04-19-2025 08:25 AM Click Here to See the Profile for olejoedadSend a Private Message to olejoedadEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

olejoedad

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Have you checked to be sure the ECM has constant battery power?
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Iboughtafiero
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Report this Post04-19-2025 05:52 PM Click Here to See the Profile for IboughtafieroSend a Private Message to IboughtafieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Yes it does. I’m getting a ecm Monday. Thanks all

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Romsk
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Report this Post04-20-2025 05:16 PM Click Here to See the Profile for RomskClick Here to visit Romsk's HomePageSend a Private Message to RomskEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
On my 1987 Fiero GT, the connector to the back of the cluster was not making good contact. I opened up the cluster, cleaned all the pins and contacts, and made sure all connectors snapped in firmly. Fixed the SES problem.
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Report this Post04-20-2025 05:28 PM Click Here to See the Profile for RomskClick Here to visit Romsk's HomePageSend a Private Message to RomskEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Romsk

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Also, The Fiero Store sells ALDL Tools. One is very comprehensive. The GUI is free to use from download but you need to buy the $84 adapter to monitor/record data. The guy who developed it name escapes me at the moment [smile]. I now make what I am calling the GM ALDL "Paperclip" Adapter. It's a lot better than jamming a paperclip in the ALDL connector. It can put the Fiero in NORM, DMFACT, or DMDIAG Mode... all at the flip of a switch. It has a Instruction/Error Code placard and a Trox screwdriver teathered to it.
I am selling it for cost plus shipping. It's a nice thing to keep in your glove box.

GM ALDL "Paperclip" Adapter

I am also available for free consultations via email or phone... but nothing beats this forum.


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Romsk
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Report this Post04-20-2025 05:45 PM Click Here to See the Profile for RomskClick Here to visit Romsk's HomePageSend a Private Message to RomskEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Romsk

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Is this your first Fiero? If so, welcome to the family. The folks here have a lot of great advice. I chip in when I can. My expertise is talking to the ECM via the ALDL. I am designing a bench top ECM tester. It will simulate the entire Fiero around the ECM. It's a background project but coming along.

Buying an ECM is ok, even if your current one turns out to be ok, having a spare is not a bad thing as long as you don't pay too much for one.

Make sure you get the ECM model for your exact Fiero model. Different years and engines use specific ECM models, and then the PROM must also match your Fiero model year, engine sise, tire sizes, federal or California emissions, and which manual or automatic transmission model is installed. If you get the right ECM with the wrong PROM, it may work, but not properly.

My free GUI that you can download has a chart in the Help the gives you a bit more detail on this.

[This message has been edited by Romsk (edited 04-20-2025).]

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Romsk
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Report this Post04-20-2025 06:42 PM Click Here to See the Profile for RomskClick Here to visit Romsk's HomePageSend a Private Message to RomskEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Romsk

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One final thought. You might not want to just swap out your ECM if there is something wrong in the wiring/system. You may damage your new one the instant you install it.

I have studied the 2.8L ECM schematics. I am an electrical engineer so I can say the SES signal driver circuit in the ECM is fairly robust. The best thing to do is to totally isolate the SES wire from the rest of the car at the ECM. There are pin removal tools to do that, but finding the right one is difficult. If you are good at soldering: One trick is to cut the SES wire about 6 inches from the ECM and use an incandescent Test Lamp with 12V on the clip and the tip on the wire from the SES. The diagrams for the other ECMs have similar circuits and may even use the same wire colors. We can tell you which wire to cut if you want to try that.

Now, if the SES circuit is isolated from the car:
Short pins A and B on the ALDL Connector (we can show you how)
Ignition Off: Test Lamp Off
Ignition On Engine Not Running: The Test Lamp should blink Error Codes (EC). EC 12 (which means no error in DMDIAG Mode) is blinked first 3 times, followed by each EC stored 3 times, then back to EC 12. If you get more than 3 EC 12's in a row, then no Error Codes are stored.

If the Test Lamp does not blink or if it does anything different, then the ECM "may" be malfunctioning. If the ECM does work properly in this test, leave the ECM isolated and hunt down the problem from there to the SES lamp. Remember, 12V is on the other side of the SES lamp, so you will read 12V through the Lamp with a DMM at the cut wire end that is not connected to the ECM.

Once you resolved the problem, wear safety goggles and have a safety observer present. Slip heat shrink tubing over the cut SES wire, solder the wires together, and shrink the tubing with a Bic lighter to cover the splice. Keep a fire extinguisher on hand. Or add a small connector there at the cut wires instead - for future troubleshooting.

[This message has been edited by Romsk (edited 04-20-2025).]

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Iboughtafiero
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Report this Post04-21-2025 12:32 PM Click Here to See the Profile for IboughtafieroSend a Private Message to IboughtafieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Thanks for all the help. New ECU fixed the issue
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