After a couple minutes with the ol' Sawz-All, the remaining trunk brace was removed up to the strut towers and the rear header was put on:
The following picture does a good job of showing the height of the rear primary tubes and how they relate to the strut towers. There is plenty of clearance for a new strut tower brace to be put in. The primary tubes almost look like they were built for it:
I removed the remaining trunk steel on the ends of the strut towers, leaving the body mounting tabs in place. I'll beef up these tabs later so that they have more rigidity:
After removal, it left a nice flat surface to mount the new brace to:
Next up... strut tower bracing.
Stay "tuned."
[This message has been edited by ITALGT (edited 11-21-2014).]
So after some more thought on the subject, I decided NOT to weld in the new brace behind the upper strut towers in the stock location as I had originally planned. In the end, I opted for fabricating a traditional style tubular strut tower brace; it weighs less, it's much better looking, it's simple to construct, it's easily removed if needed, and it's just as effective at bracing (if not more than) just slapping a big heavy bar in BEHIND the towers.
I got a little creative here and used factory strut assembly "spacers" or "hats" for the new brace mounting plates by mounting them directly on top of the towers. Here you can see the general idea, with a yardstick used as a reference to show approximately where the brace's main cross-tube will go:
The strut plates wouldn't go onto the towers without some tweaking of the upper strut hole "bulges" first. The strut bolts lined up with the holes in the plates just fine, but the factory domed strut holes were slightly offset compared to the strut plate's opening. Part of the inside radius of the plate's center hole hit the bottom edge of the dome. With a large blunt-ended chisel and hammer, I slowly massaged the outer/lower edges of the domes until there was just enough clearance for the plates to mount flat and flush on the towers:
With the strut tower brace mounting plates ready to go, it's time to cut up a piece of 1" tubing and weld it all up.
[This message has been edited by ITALGT (edited 03-23-2015).]
The strut tower brace is now all welded up and ready for finishing. The welds are solid, but the thickness of the steel definitely pushed my little 90 amp flux welder hard. A more powerful welder would have been very good to have here for sure. Good penetration, but it lacked the power to lay a wide/solid bead on a single pass. Nothing some grinding and smoothing won't fix. I'll have more details/pics on that next.
So with the rear header fitment pretty much a go, I'll be turning my attention to building a simple steel "box" or recessed panel for the front header.
Stay "tuned."
[This message has been edited by ITALGT (edited 10-21-2014).]
Main strut tower brace in place with welds cleaned up:
Overall I am happy with the results, although it's not my best work I've got to quickly admit. I'm sure it looks great to most people, but I tend to be picky when it comes to these things.
At some point, I may build another strut tower brace that is more of a "show quality" piece, but this one will be just fine for now. After some priming, sanding and painting, I think it will look great under the deck-lid. Powder coating would be ideal, but I think I will save that expense for when and if I build a better looking (cleaner welded) one.
I'm continuing the blacked-out "stealth" theme to the engine bay, along with aluminum and stainless accents to keep it "raw."
I'm thinking this brace will look great in satin black.
More to come.
[This message has been edited by ITALGT (edited 11-21-2014).]
With the header installation going smoothly, it's time for some overdue updates.
As mentioned earlier in this build, I was planning to retain the TPI fuel injection system and modifying it for more RPM's and power.
Well, not any more... bye-bye TPI:
Yes, that's a carburetor and intake you see. No, I'm not crazy!
What you see here is a black powder coated Edelbrock Performer RPM Air-Gap Vortec intake topped with Edelbrock's 650 CFM Thunder Series AVS (Adjustable Vacuum Secondary) carburetor. And oh boy, it's even got a manual choke!
Some people will no doubt scowl in disbelief when they learn I am ditching old-school 80's era fuel injection for a so-called "archaic" carburetor. I get it guys and gals, I really do. But this build is not about what other people think or say I should do, for me it's all about getting the ultimate driving experience and performance level I want to get out of this car when it goes back to terrorizing the streets.
In the end, I want the same connection to my car as a motorcycle rider has with his bike. I WANT a manual choke cable. I WANT to manually crank my windows. I WANT the air conditioning and most comfort features eliminated. I WANT the car to be a little temperamental... and WANT it to have it's own special character. It keeps it that much more interesting, rewarding and FUN to play with. I WANT this car to be no-frills, basic, raw, and nothing but visceral when it's completed. And more than anything, I WANT it to scare little children and old people! Well not literally, but hopefully you get the point.
For clarity... let's just say that this car is NOT being built for a daily driver, so my concerns about eliminating the EFI are very few, if any.
Let me rephrase that... I have NONE!
I actually WANT a carburetor, and here's why.
First and foremost... bang for the almighty buck $$$. Upgrading the TPI's intake runners alone costs about the same as the carburetor and intake combined, yet they produce way less power and only slightly improve upper RPM capabilities. TPI engines with aftermarket runners still produce the monster low-end transmission-breaking torque, and can't rev past 5,000 RPM's without the engine falling flat on it's face without serious and in-depth modifications. That's not such a big deal in a big, heavy car that needs lot's of bottom end torque, but in a light-weight V8 Fiero, it just plain ruins the overall driving experience.
On the aftermarket intake side of things, such as using the Stealth Ram to replace the entire TPI intake, the final cost gets WAY out of hand really quick (the cost of the intake itself, fuel rails, throttle body, small-body distributor, injectors, hardware/gaskets, etc). With the Fiero's ultra-low gears, I firmly believe that even a highly modified stock TPI system just is not a great intake to use on a lightweight Fiero. Still kinda' fun and no doubt quick, but FAR from ideal. That said, if one has the money for a Stealth Ram or similar aftermarket replacement intake... definitely go for it. These aftermarket intakes replace the entire OEM TPI assembly and are designed to flow/make power well past 6,000 RPMs... and they do it well, especially with a little porting.
As far as tuning, I actually prefer to do that with a screw driver... not a laptop. I want to have a more intimate connection with the car and be involved with how the engine runs and performs without burning a stupid chip. With that said, Edelbrock's AVS carburetor bolts on the engine ready to go out of the box... no changing jets or tuning required. Just set the idle screws and go. Adjustable vacuum secondaries allow for mechanical secondary-like performance, which is perfect for a lightweight/low-geared Fiero.
Then there's the performance. No more monster low-end torque with no useable power above 4,500 RPMs. I will now have a very broad horsepower and torque curve producing excellent USEABLE power throughout the extended RPM range to match the transmission's low-a$$ gear ratios. Drive-ability and reliability? Check. Wicked neck-snapping throttle response? Check. As a bonus, I will still get very decent gas mileage, as there's not much weight at all for the engine to move; the car already weighs over 200lbs less than stock. Not that I'm really worried about gas mileage!
Less dead weight too. By the time you consider how many TPI components there are, you quickly realize how heavy the system is compared to just a simple aluminum intake and carb.
Then there's the gear drive thing. I have an Edelbrock Accu-Drive on it's way. Don't get me started on the "gear drives are bad" debate, because the bottom line is they work just fine below 6,500 RPM's and you either love them or you hate them. I just happen to LOVE them. I'm after the gear-whine sound, not because I am the poser-type who wants people to think he's running a blower, but because it will add to the overall visceral driving experience I am after. Anyone familiar with the Honda VFR 750 motorcycle with gear-driven cams knows exactly what I'm talking about.
The real key to dual-idler gear drives? Just don't put one in an engine and expect to be revving past 6,500 RPMs... you're just asking for trouble. Even though I've heard guys run them with TPI with no problems, I'm just not going to take the gamble of messing with the knock sensor issue.
One last bonus... by going with a traditional carburetor setup now, I will be paving the way for installing stand-alone fuel injection system at some point down the road (if I ever wanted to go that route). I love the flexibility, tune-ability, and simplicity of these systems... not to mention, wicked power and tuning potential. If I'm still running a gear drive at that point, I'll deal with it accordingly if there's still a problem with the knock sensor issue.
The only real down side I can see by not using the TPI is the looks... I think it looks particularly bad-a$$ when combined with the 180 headers I'm using.
With that bit of news out of the way, here's the daily driver Fiero GT I picked up a couple weeks ago... she needs some TLC, but overall a very decent car. I will be using the staggered 18" Rohana RL05 wheels for this project, and I will replace them with the 17" Enkei's I am currently using:
Just reading your thread now; you will be happy with your combo! I did a conventional sbc with 'only' a 600 vac secondary (yes, manual choke), the Edelbrock Performer RPM intake, 'double bump' CI heads very extensively (home) ported and polished, but with the smaller 1.94/1.5 valves, 'only' the CC 268H high energy cam, 1-5/8" headers and a high pressure oil pump ($2.98 Z28 relief spring). Not much else; stock pistons with an .030 bore, new stock rings, stock bearings; Rhoads lifters that I think helped; roller 1.5:1 rockers; a 3 way double row timing set (that I didn't really need to be adjustable; I didn't change it) and that's about it! All that went into a (heavvvvvyyyyy) 78 firebird with a 4 spd and highway gearing. It was a BLAST! My brother had a 455 trans am at the time and he couldn't touch me.. which I exploited at every chance LOL! The trick is, as the cam manufacturers say so often, the COMBINATION. And that combo worked perfectly. You'll be happy. Great thread; thx for sharing! GP
Just reading your thread now; you will be happy with your combo! I did a conventional sbc with 'only' a 600 vac secondary (yes, manual choke), the Edelbrock Performer RPM intake, 'double bump' CI heads very extensively (home) ported and polished, but with the smaller 1.94/1.5 valves, 'only' the CC 268H high energy cam, 1-5/8" headers and a high pressure oil pump ($2.98 Z28 relief spring). Not much else; stock pistons with an .030 bore, new stock rings, stock bearings; Rhoads lifters that I think helped; roller 1.5:1 rockers; a 3 way double row timing set (that I didn't really need to be adjustable; I didn't change it) and that's about it! All that went into a (heavvvvvyyyyy) 78 firebird with a 4 spd and highway gearing. It was a BLAST! My brother had a 455 trans am at the time and he couldn't touch me.. which I exploited at every chance LOL! The trick is, as the cam manufacturers say so often, the COMBINATION. And that combo worked perfectly. You'll be happy. Great thread; thx for sharing! GP
Thanks for the heads-up!
In all honesty, I want to build a high-winding naturally aspirated SBC variant with all the goodies and keepin' it old school; in other words, build the engine specifically for the car. For now, I think this set up will be more than sufficient. And by reading your post, it looks like I'm right on track for a killer, very fast, very streetable SBC Fiero.
More to come.
[This message has been edited by ITALGT (edited 03-13-2015).]
I love the fact your putting a old school ( well for the most part) engine in your car. Cant wait to hear the sound of this motor. Great job
Thanks!
That's really what this project has become all about; keepin' it "old school" and simple with the proper combination of modifications that, as a whole, redefine just what a SBC V8 swapped Fiero can and should be. The final product is going to speak for itself... LOUDLY and PROUDLY.
SBC V8 Fiero haters be warned.
2015 is setting up to be a productive year for this project, and quite possibly the year she's back on the road. I've spent the last few months gathering the parts I need to get it back together, and I'm happy to say that I just about have everything I will need to do the job right.
Stay "tuned" as always, AND HAVE A MERRY CHRISTMAS EVERYONE!!!
My new daily driver Fiero has been keeping me busy and away from the project. As soon as I get the 2.8's high idle condition sorted out and the brakes replaced, I'll be getting back to business around here with the build.
Also... the 18" staggered wheels that are on my daily driver GT are not the stock wheel bolt pattern; they are a 5x114.3. Turns out what I thought were spacers were actually adapters. So no go with using them on this project. I will more than likely end up posting them for sale on craigslist.
Stay "tuned."
[This message has been edited by ITALGT (edited 01-20-2015).]
Really interested in removing the trunk in my 85GT I will be following along. Thank you for the detailed photos... The strut tower brace looks great and I cant wait to hear you fire it up... Are you going to ceramic coat the header tubes?
Really interested in removing the trunk in my 85GT I will be following along. Thank you for the detailed photos... The strut tower brace looks great and I cant wait to hear you fire it up... Are you going to ceramic coat the header tubes?
You are most welcome. There's a lot of steel that can be removed that isn't structural back there... take your time with the right tools and it should be fairly simple for you.
The strut tower brace I made may actually evolve a little further at some point. I'm thinking about using more tubing for some basic cross-bracing to the frame to stiffen things up a bit more.
And yes... the headers are going to be ceramic coated black.
Originally posted by ITALGT: Main strut tower brace in place with welds cleaned up. ...I'm sure it looks great to most people, but I tend to be picky when it comes to these things.
I must be "most-people" then. It sure looks good to me!
Love those header pipes!! Though its sad to see the aesthetic of the intakes pipes taken away from the overall look, nothin wrong with a carb. And they arent unreliable as a daily driver
Love those header pipes!! Though its sad to see the aesthetic of the intakes pipes taken away from the overall look, nothin wrong with a carb. And they arent unreliable as a daily driver
I. Hear. That.
The TPI is still on the engine, and the engine is still in the engine bay. The TPI combined with the headers looks bad-ass to me, and could really look cool with the right amount of color contrast. It just sits there teasing me. I haven't been able to justify spending a ton of money to keep it just because it looks like a cool combination. Going to a carburetor is an easy step forward because of the endless supply of air intake components and air cleaner assemblies available for them.
This episode of 'The Smoking Tire' does a good job of demonstrating the spirit of my build; garage built with too many hours to count. Passion meets purpose:
[This message has been edited by ITALGT (edited 05-19-2015).]
Not much SINISTERGT project news to report as of late... right now I am working towards selling my daily-driver '86 GT, as I am in great need of a pickup. I'm in the process of doing some more upgrades to my house (among other things).
Fixing a few things on the 2.8 GT this weekend... I'll be installing new Walker exhaust with cat delete (replaced with a 17" glass-pack from Summit) along with a new brake master cylinder, rubber hydraulic lines, brake rotors and new pads. I will also be putting on the stock 15" GT lace wheels with new tires.
Very little progress has been made with this V8 project lately though. That has to change!
Stay tuned for more project updates...
Until then... here's my ever-growing 180 degree header YouTube playlist... enjoy!
Progress is still relatively slow, but I've been pecking away at things here and there when I have the time. The TPI intake is now off the engine and the Edelbrock is sitting in its place. Looks very nice, and is also very compact compared to the TPI. Air flow through the upper engine bay should be much better as a result (I will be needing all I can get!). It's also time to get some matching valve covers (black powder coat with exposed fins).
I am also seriously considering ditching the AVS carb and investing in a stand alone fuel injection system like the one from FiTech. Prices have come down on these systems, although this particular unit is still about $1,000:
The headers are off now so I can trim the ends of the primary tubes going into the collectors for final fitment. At this point I have a good idea as to how I will be routing the exhaust. For simplicity, functionality, sound, aesthetic and weight considerations, I am thinking a 2-into-1 system from the collectors back with a single resonator followed by Dr. Gas's FreqMod Heavy Duty muffler, which is basically a Spintech muffler with frequency modification that's designed for high-flow single exhaust systems.
Still debating on where and how the system will exit, although routing directly under the license plate is looking like the best option. I will be sharing further details in my next update, along with some pictures.
I did sell the daily driver GT I had, so no more project distractions. I also have some miscellaneous Fiero parts that I won't be needing, and will soon have them advertised in the mall for sale.
More to come...
[This message has been edited by ITALGT (edited 01-22-2016).]
Originally posted by qwikgta: Any thought to putting an additional "leg" from the top of the bracket to the firewall on both sides, kind of a "triangle" brace like mustangs use?
You read my mind actually. I think that type of bracing would be ideal for this Fiero... if I can find a good way to work around the firewall header and deck lid hinge mounts, I would like to add support tubes from the strut tower brace I made... much like the Fox body Mustang brace.
[This message has been edited by ITALGT (edited 01-22-2016).]
There isn't really much structure in the middle of the firewall. It might help to build an X-brace to connect the strut towers and hinge boxes, but what would help the most would be an X connecting each strut tower to the joint between the firewall and upper frame rail on the opposite side.
And of course a lateral member to connect the strut towers since the stock one is gone.
The cross-bracing will be a challenge because of the height. You are right about the firewall strength, there isn't much for structure for sufficient brace support. I also agree that the top frame rails meeting the firewall would be the ideal place to brace. Not sure yet the best way to go yet, I may have to get a little creative.
[This message has been edited by ITALGT (edited 01-24-2016).]
The TPI intake system is now sold and is on its way to what appears to be a perfect new home. For those Fiero owners who haven't seen the GMC Indy Hauler build thread, you really need to check it out:
I'm now looking to purchase a stand-alone fuel injection system to top off the new Performer RPM intake. I'm pretty excited about the move to this kind of EFI, should be well worth the investment. Looks like FiTech has some competition now... Holley just came out with their own EFI system called the Sniper, and it looks very promising (better looking too):
That said, FiTech just raised the bar at SEMA with their "Go Port EFI" system. If I was to go this route, it would be more money and I'd have to lose my new Edelbrock RPM intake... but the bottom line is that this type of direct-port injection would be the ideal setup to use with the 180 headers. It is (for now) just something I am considering:
I'm sure I'd be extremely pleased going with either route, so we'll se what the budget allows for. Also still contemplating what type of air filter setup to use...
On a side note, wow that TPI intake system was heavy. Total shipping weight (minus HEI distributor) was right at 50lbs! Definitely shedding some more weight by switching intake configurations.
I ran into a small delay with the headers, specifically with the top two primary tubes on the firewall side. They are too close together in one spot and hit as soon as they are compressed. As-is, the collector can barely be slid onto the tubes because of the interference. It appears the top tube wasn't quite bent right.
I called Schoenfeld to ask them about it, and in a nutshell I was told, "We have been making that header in the same jig for over 20 years and never heard of a problem."
So that was that. Looks like I will just have to make a trip to the muffler shop to get things tweaked before I go any further. A little frustrating, but not that big of a deal. I hope to have the problem fixed by next weekend so I can continue fitting the collectors and moving on to other things.
As always, stay "tuned."
[This message has been edited by ITALGT (edited 05-26-2016).]
The TPI intake system is now sold and is on its way to what appears to be a perfect new home. For those Fiero owners who haven't seen the GMC Indy Hauler build thread, you really need to check it out:
Brett, thanks for props on the "Hauler", I do think the TPI will be a perfect addition, since the truck has a 4L60e trans the plans are to set it up obd2 using the 0411 pcm , for details see here. http://www.thirdgen.org/for...oughts-opinions.html
Looking forward to seeing how your project comes along.
Brett, thanks for props on the "Hauler", I do think the TPI will be a perfect addition, since the truck has a 4L60e trans the plans are to set it up obd2 using the 0411 pcm , for details see here. http://www.thirdgen.org/for...oughts-opinions.html
Looking forward to seeing how your project comes along.
Joe
No problem, I really like your build and will visit it often... its such a unique idea! Kudos to you.
The way I look at it, the TPI intake is not only period-correct for your truck... but when its done, you can also proudly say that it came directly off of a V8 Archie-swapped Fiero...
How cool is that?
[This message has been edited by ITALGT (edited 03-13-2016).]
Since I have not been able to utilize Pennock's Image Poster after a Windows 10 update, I will be using Photobucket as my image source from now on. I haven't been able to post pictures for a long while now, and to be honest, a build thread without good pictures is rather boring. So keep an eye out for some eye candy, and lots of it.
Also, I'm ready to spill the beans on the exhaust system routing. I have pretty much decided to use a 2-into-1 system using a traditional SpinTech crossflow muffler. I plan to use a center-exit below the license plate pocket, or better yet, centered where the tail light housings were originally located. Somewhat like Car-Lo's "RBS-in-Limbo" exhaust setup, but using only two resonated exhaust tips instead of four, possibly with an integrated x-pipe. Light, simple, and efficient... it should sound mean with the 180's.
More project inspiration... now this guy has the right idea!
While some of the cosmetics really aren't my cup of tea, this is still one bad-ass and raw looking Fiero... totally unique. I'm sure the guy who built this Fiero isn't finished yet, but I sure like where his head's at:
Notice the center-exit exhaust pipes going through the tail light area. This is very similar to what I am building for this project, but in the end it will have a much cleaner, finished look.
Stay "tuned."
[This message has been edited by ITALGT (edited 06-12-2016).]
Glad to see you are still alive! ...and not giving up. That looks almost "Mad Max"ish.
Likewise Johnny, much appreciated! Always good to hear from you. Much like true a soldier, giving up and quitting are words that do not exist in my vocabulary! It's taking time to complete, but I'll get there eventually.
Yes, Mad Max is one of the first thoughts I had too when I first saw that car. A lot of design elements I really appreciate. I'll be shooting for a more refined, finished look, yet stripped down to the basics without completely gutting and modifying it down to race car standards. I'll be keeping true to the basic body and interior design elements that make a Fiero a Fiero, utilizing subtle modifications that work together as a whole to enhance what is already there (hint: no widebody "kit"... but wide "bodied" Fiero with flares). In my opinion, the beautiful lines of the Fiero are already there, so I'm just going to tweak them... tastefully.
[This message has been edited by ITALGT (edited 05-08-2018).]
Nice build you got going man. Hopefully soon I'll be upgrading my engine. As for the Mike's Fiero aka Pontibishi or can be called Mad Max..lol...that thing is pushing over 700hp. Check him out on his Instagram under 86Porsche. Has a Porsche front end. Keep up the good work!
I'm diggin' your rocket bunny project... who knows, maybe I'll be your first customer when you have those flares ready.
Right now I've got deep dish 18x9.5's rear and 18x8.5's front with 1" adapters, as previously seen on the gold GT I used to have. The wheels need to be refinished, but to be honest, I'm not so sure I want to keep them. I want to run a staggered 19" rear/18" front combo. More on that later.
Stay "tuned."
[This message has been edited by ITALGT (edited 08-01-2016).]
"Rocket Bunny Chop Top Fiero." Now THAT grabs my attention. Chopping this GT is something I have considered... it already is a perfect candidate. I have the tools, I have the skills.
This rendering looks amazing:
More to come... stay tuned.
[This message has been edited by ITALGT (edited 08-03-2016).]
Well not literally, but hopefully you get the point.
With that said, Edelbrock's AVS carburetor bolts on the engine ready to go out of the box... no changing jets or tuning required. Just set the idle screws and go. Adjustable vacuum secondaries allow for mechanical secondary-like performance, which is perfect for a lightweight/low-geared Fiero.
So no go with using them on this project. I will more than likely end up posting them for sale on craigslist.
I also have some miscellaneous Fiero parts that I won't be needing, and will soon have them advertised in the mall for sale. 
Definitely shedding some more weight by switching intake configurations.
