So I'm guessing you don't want to reupholster the dash. I can't say I blame you.
Just out of curiosity, what is the dashboard made of? And how thick is the dashboard material (the structure, not the upholstery) near the edge? I might have an idea...
Heck no, I don't want to re-upholster the dash! There is nothing wrong with it's finish so I would like to keep it "as is". The Stealth dash is essentially a plastic body with molded foam over top. I will get some close-up shots and measurements.
Timo:
We will see how they turn out first.
Nolan
[This message has been edited by Sourmug (edited 05-28-2007).]
I figured it would be plastic. The plastic is nice & thick too. That's good. Here's the idea...
Using your homemade molds, attached to the dash, you make fiberglass pieces that overlap the bottom surface of the dash (by maybe an inch or so). That overlap will serve as a mounting flange, so you can attach the corner pieces to the dash using short screws (from underneath). If you use machine screws with just the right length, you won't have to worry about sharp tips poking through the upholstery.
I'm not sure what to do (cosmetically) about the seam, though.
[This message has been edited by Blacktree (edited 07-29-2006).]
I was thinking about doing something like the Defroster Duct in the stock Fiero Dash. Then use a metal grill material. If the same grill material was used as the middle defroster duct I think it would look like they belong and not an add on. They could also be made functional. Nolan are both sides the same size and shape or at least close to it?
[This message has been edited by Fiero1Fan (edited 07-29-2006).]
I figured it would be plastic. The plastic is nice & thick too. That's good. Here's the idea...
Using your homemade molds, attached to the dash, you make fiberglass pieces that overlap the bottom surface of the dash (by maybe an inch or so). That overlap will serve as a mounting flange, so you can attach the corner pieces to the dash using short screws (from underneath). If you use machine screws with just the right length, you won't have to worry about sharp tips poking through the upholstery.
I'm not sure what to do (cosmetically) about the seam, though.
Blacktree:
That may work, I'll need to think about it.
quote
Originally posted by Fiero1Fan:
I was thinking about doing something like the Defroster Duct in the stock Fiero Dash. Then use a metal grill material. If the same grill material was used as the middle defroster duct I think it would look like they belong and not an add on. They could also be made functional. Nolan are both sides the same size and shape or at least close to it?
Timo:
The pieces are similar but not exactly the same. I think my dash is at a teeny bit of an angle so that the driverside is a bit bigger.
I have aftermarket vents to put into the top of the dash. I will take some pictures tomorrow.
Thanks Gents!
Nolan
[This message has been edited by Sourmug (edited 05-28-2007).]
Here are the pictures of the after-market grilles for the defroster vents:
I was thinking about incorporating some of the perforated metal into the infill pieces.
I have also been thinking that however the filler pieces are attached they will need to go in place after the main dash is already installed. Otherwise I think it might be too tight of a fit to pre-assemble and then move into place.
Nolan
[This message has been edited by Sourmug (edited 05-28-2007).]
They still need more work and are a little wavy. The right side needs the corner built up a bit and the left one needs the round edge built up too. I was thinking about maybe seeing if there is some sort of vinyl that has a similar texture to the dash.
Nolan
[This message has been edited by Sourmug (edited 05-28-2007).]
Looks good Nolan. As mentioned above, you can glass a tab to the bottom that overlaps the bottom edge of the dash. A little epoxy and/or some 1/8" rivets will hold it together forever.
Looks good Nolan. As mentioned above, you can glass a tab to the bottom that overlaps the bottom edge of the dash. A little epoxy and/or some 1/8" rivets will hold it together forever.
Bob
Thanks Bob, I'll have a look to see how I can do this.
After some more work on the fillers I thought I had better have a test fit with the dash in the car. Here are the pictures, first the driver's side: then the passenger: The fit isn't perfect yet. The strip along the windshield on the passenger side piece for some reason doesn't sit down onto the dash, it has the wrong curve and will need to be reshaped oh well, nobody said it would be easy. Mostly it is a relatively easy matter of fill a bit here and remove a bit there.
I am still thinking that covering these with vinyl is the way to go but that remains to be seen as finding a match for the pattern on the dash will be a challenge. If I end up painting them I think it will be the same color as the dash, otherwise they will be too obvious.
Thoughts, suggestions, comments anyone??
Nolan
[This message has been edited by Sourmug (edited 05-28-2007).]
I think I have the shapes more or less complete, possibly a little bit more tweaking but we'll see. The real issue was with the right side filler. For some reason the curve along the windshield was off in a manner that tilted the fiberglass up off of the dash. You can see what I mean in this picture: You can see how it site up in the red ellipse. In order to fix it I layed up multiple layers for mat and resin on the underside and then sanded the top down. I did this a few times until it has changed the angle and now sits flat. Here are how the fillers now look: Not a huge amount of difference in the picture but much better in real life.
I have also decided that these are going to be covered in vinyl. Here is a picture of the vinyl grain on the Stealth dash: As you can see it's a fairly textured vinyl. My wife and I spent some time looking at various fabric stores for something similar but with no luck. Today Barbara found some websites with automotive vinyl and I think we found a match.
It's Corinthian Endurasoft Vinyl and can be purchased from This Site
I think it's a pretty darn close match.
Nolan
[This message has been edited by Sourmug (edited 05-28-2007).]
This may sound crazy, but have you considered making extra "sets" of the filler pieces for sale ? Seems like some other members would be willing to pay you rather than doing this themselves for the dash swap
I would venture to guess that when you are all done fabricating mounts and such that no two dashes would go in the same way. Those pieces would probably have to be custom made to fit each individual install anyway.
I agree. My concern would be that if I sold someone a set and it didn't match perfectly then there would be an upset customer. Would they be close? Quite probably but they would require some adjustments etc. depending upon how the dash is installed such as higher or lower, slightly different angles and so on. I'm not in the fiberglass fabrication business but I would want to offer a perfect product or none at all. Sorry if that dissapoints a few people but there it is. Again the purpose of this thread is to show how I have done it and encourage others to give it a shot.
The glove box needs to be slightly modified in order to clear some of the bracketry. On my first fitting I noticed that the space where the hinge mounts on the Stealth dash was actually 1/2" too narrow with the dash in the car. I first had to cut the bracket that I made for the passenger side that also holds the performance sound sub. It had to be cut 1/2" shorter and re-drilled for the fasteners.
Additionally the air plenum and the associated bracket interferes with the glove box itself. I first had to notch the back of the glove box: I then inverted and rotated the piece that was cut out and reattached it using the Corvette panel adhesive: I also had to infill the very bottom corner to complete the notch: I also attached some plastic angles for some additional gluing surface. Once it was set I did another test fit and voila!
I now need to modify the insert that actually slips into the glove box opening before the door attaches. I also need to fabricate some pieces for the latch and of course, make it all look pretty
Nolan
[This message has been edited by Sourmug (edited 05-28-2007).]
Looking good. Finally got another chance to pop in and take a peek. This swap goes pretty fast you'll be finish in no time.....
4.9 PFI FIERO:
Thanks, the mounting is actually easier than I tought. What concerns me is the electrical work.
I do have the stock Stealth instrument cluster and the aux gauges, I would like to try to get them operational. At the very least I want to maintain the warning lights, turn signal indicators etc. in the cluster. If I cannot get the stock gauges operational I will go with aftermarket units. The two that I am considering are Autometer gauges: Either the Cobalt or the Nexus
I Really like the Nexus line but they are spendy! You have to know that any gauge that has a complete animated demo c/w sexy voice is going to be expensive!
Nolan
[This message has been edited by Sourmug (edited 05-28-2007).]
All i can say is that the colbalt is a nice choice, i have C-2 in my car and they are very bright slightly annoying, i plan to put them on a dimmer switch need time i have my dash apart.
I have made some more progress on the glove box! The top liner needed to be trimmed to fit where I have installed brackets, not too much and it actually went in quite easily: I did loose the left hand stop due to the trimming that was required. The right hand one is still usable so the door doesn't just drop fully open. The stops fit into the curved slots in the sides of the l;inner. I need to make a hasp for the latch mechanism as I didn't get on with the dash. It will go on the top if the liner and holds the liner in place along the top edge:
Now that was all done and in place I now have a fictional glove box:
That is one issue that I have with the stock Fiero interior, there is no glove box and the console storage compartment isn't really accessible while you sit in the car, at least not easily.
[This message has been edited by Sourmug (edited 05-28-2007).]
The next thing that I want to start working on is the console. Looking at the car with the Stealth console in place you can see that there are a number of custom pieces that need to be made. In these next two pictures you can see that to the left of the glove box a triangular filler piece will need to be made: A similar triangular piece is also needed for the driver's side of the console: Additionally, some sort of filler will be required at each end of the dash. Here is a shot of the driver's side for example: I think that I'm going to start with the console. Here is a shot of the console: As you can see in the red ellipse, there are a number of recesses at the tail end for a lighter, switches and a small storage cubby. None of these are particularly useful and the bottoms of these are actually to low. I decided to cut the console just after the shifter recess: I will be making a custom console beyond this point so it just seems to be a logical place to cut. To attach the console a fabricated a small bracket out of two pieces of 1" flat iron: And here is how it attaches: It is screwed to the frame and the plastic end of the console with self tapping screws. The front of the console actually locks into place when held from the rear so I don't think I will need to actually fasten it in the front.
[This message has been edited by Sourmug (edited 05-28-2007).]
Next I started to work on the shifter area. I am going to make fiberglass filler in this area. the first thing I did was remove the "bridge" between the shifter and the front of the console: I then cut some sheet styrene plastic to more or less match the recess and attached it with masking tape and taped over the complete exterior of the console: I then layed up two layers of mat and resin: And here is the piece fresh out of the mold: I have since added a third layer of mat and resin just to firm it up a bit. I think I'm going to use the stock Fiero boot so I have made a template out of sheet styrene for the shifter opening. I think I might snoop around on Ebay first to see if I can find something a little more interesting before I cut into the shifter surround.
Nolan
[This message has been edited by Sourmug (edited 05-28-2007).]
Here's the initial test fit after trimming of the shifter surround: Pretty darn good fit. You've got to love fiberglass! And thie first sanding and filling:
Nolan
[This message has been edited by Sourmug (edited 05-28-2007).]
I was going to use after market gauges. I have a set of faze gauges I was gonna use because of the multi colors. Since you are good with fiberglass you should be finish in no time.
Another Tip: It is easier to cut the stock 3000gt middle vent where it bolt up to the dash and mold that section onto the fiero piece. "Measuring is important on this step." Sorry no pics on this one but look at it as it is self explainatory.
Originally posted by Sourmug: I can hear you breathing...
That is me breathing into a paper bag!! Do you also hear the drool dripping on the floor? Yes I think the short shifter would be nice but go with the 87 or 88 grey Fiero knob. It matches the rounded contours and the color of the dash. You also have alot of empty space around the shifter for the PW, PM, Fog Light, etc switches.
[This message has been edited by Fiero1Fan (edited 08-07-2006).]
LOL, I thought that was you breathing down my neck.
I am planning on placing the window and mirror switches into the fiberglass piece. The problems are that there isn't quite as much room there as the stock Fiero location and I have to figure out some way of mounting them. I would also like to use two window switches that I pulled from a '96 Monte Carlo as they are illuminated.
Here's a shot of the window switches: One issue with them is that the wiring will point to the rear of the car whereas the Fiero harness points to the front of the car.
Here is a comparison of the Stealth console vs. the stock Fiero console switch housing: There isn't much room for all that hardware. I would have to make a mounting plate that attached to the frame and then the switches would have to bole down onto the plate. The stock set-up has the switches bolting to the mounting plate from below. I don't think that I want the switches to be actually attached to the fiberglass filler piece.
Here you can see how much room the switches require:
Here are some pictures of how the stock back half of the console fits:
I guess I'm kind of thinking out loud:
The stock piece could be cut slightly shorter to match the end of the Stealth console. A custom transition of some sort would be required between the two. Ignore the color mismatch as that would be handled in some fashion. The stock console could be recovered for example.
I dunno, what do you all think about how they flow together?
Edit:
Hmm.... After sitting here looking at the pictures, I don't think they flow together at all. The stock piece is too "squarish" I think.
[This message has been edited by Sourmug (edited 05-28-2007).]
Originally posted by Sourmug: The stock piece is too "squarish" I think.
I agree with you. Do you not have the rest of the 3000GT middle console? I can get you some pix tomorrow if you want. There are also some side covers from the 3000GT console that will work great for the console triangle pieces you were talking about.
I am planning on using almost all of the 3000GT middle console and then coming up with some kind of matching cover for the CPU area on the back wall. I'll get some pix so you can better see what I am talking about.
[This message has been edited by Fiero1Fan (edited 08-07-2006).]
No, I don't have any of the other interior pieces from the Stealth. I have seen the carpeted side covers for the triangles at the dash/console on e-bay, are they plastic covered with carpet or just carpet cut to fit? If you could post some pictures of the rest of the console and perhaps the backs of the triangles that would be great.
I think I'm going to look for something else to complete the console, possibly something out of another vehicle or a custom one from scratch. The Mitsubishi one will require extensive modification in any event.
I don't think the stock center is too squareish so much as it is too broad. Everything on the 3kgt dash seems to point towards it being kind of slim and noninvasive. Sleek, if you will. The reason the Fiero console looks out of place is because it is much too wide to match the theme of the 3kgt dash. I agree that it is a little on the square side, but look at the stock 3kgt center console, it is only slightly rounded. In my opinion, the worst thing you could do here is go the other direction and get something totally rounded. The one thing that has always turned me off to swaps like the firebird and grand am dashes is the center console and sometimes door panels. They are too round which causes them to clash with the lines of the exterior of the car, and in some extreme cases the general shape of the cabin. I have always liked the 3000gt dash because it seems to represent a happy medium. It's more up to date than the very square stock design yet in addition to the subtle curves that are added it stays somewhat broad in nature. Look for example just how flat the top of the center console compartment is on the 3kgt, and how much larger the dashboard is compared to stock.
This is of course, just one man's perception though. I would love to hear from anybody else who sees this differently than me.
Sourmug nice work, keep up with the pics. IF I may make a suggestion on the filler pieces, find another dash and cut/remove enough material to cover them. I'm just assuming you haven't covered them yet. I'll be checking back, often. Again keep up the good work.
I don't think the stock center is too squareish so much as it is too broad. Everything on the 3kgt dash seems to point towards it being kind of slim and noninvasive. Sleek, if you will. The reason the Fiero console looks out of place is because it is much too wide to match the theme of the 3kgt dash. I agree that it is a little on the square side, but look at the stock 3kgt center console, it is only slightly rounded. In my opinion, the worst thing you could do here is go the other direction and get something totally rounded. The one thing that has always turned me off to swaps like the firebird and grand am dashes is the center console and sometimes door panels. They are too round which causes them to clash with the lines of the exterior of the car, and in some extreme cases the general shape of the cabin. I have always liked the 3000gt dash because it seems to represent a happy medium. It's more up to date than the very square stock design yet in addition to the subtle curves that are added it stays somewhat broad in nature. Look for example just how flat the top of the center console compartment is on the 3kgt, and how much larger the dashboard is compared to stock. Toaster_Man:
Thanks for your response, you have some well thought out comments. I agree that it shouldn't be too round but it should incorporate some curves to be similar to the dash. While the 3000GT console is quite flat it simply will not work as there will be insufficient clearance for any amenities such as the storage compartment or cup holders.
I think that the Fiero console is wide for a reason. Most cars do not have the fuel tank located between the seats. The size of the"tunnel" necessitates a wider console. It may be possible to use a slimmer console but I think that a wider base will be needed. Perhaps something with a tapered design.
In any event I will make/salvage/modify a console so that it curves upwards to some extent to allow for a storage compartment etc. although a relatively thin profile might be ideal.
topher_time:
I never thought about stripping another dash for the vinyl. The only problem that I see is that our population is about 10% of the States and so we have about 10% of any given car. It may be costly to acquire another dash. But I may look around to see if a damaged one is available.
Thanks for both of your input, I appreciate the comments and suggestions.
[This message has been edited by Sourmug (edited 05-28-2007).]
Hi Nolan i was quickly looking through your thread and i didn't see any reference to longer wheel studs in place of the stock front ones, Did you replace them and if so where can i get some i need them for my vette break upgrade.
There is nothing wrong with it's finish so I would like to keep it "as is". The Stealth dash is essentially a plastic body with molded foam over top. I will get some close-up shots and measurements.
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oh well, nobody said it would be easy. Mostly it is a relatively easy matter of fill a bit here and remove a bit there.
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