I've been away for a long time, and recently got back into Fiero's with an 88' GT purchase. I think I've owned more Fiero's than any other vehicle make over the course of my vehicle ownership history. Something too fun about these to live without.
I started a small business and I primarily focus on domestic muscle cars, with a heavy focus on the Foxbody era of Fords. However, we also cater to all makes and models (as I am a dealer for a variety of major performance parts manufacturers as well as tires). Bringing in the Fiero, as a shop car, has sparked my interest in potentially developing new products or bringing discontinued stuff back to life.
I have reached out to Addco, and the rep I am working with told me he can get me a limited production run of the 88' Fiero sway-bars if I can get 10-buyers for each bar (front and/or rear). The specs on the Addco bars compared to stock
stock front is 28mm (88') stock rear is 22mm (88')
Addco Front 1.25" $223.65 Addco Rear 1.00" $292.57
Based on the minimum order, I can sell the pair of bars for $500, and might be able to absorb shipping in the lower 48.
So here is what would be needed, 10 legitimate buyers. Payments will not be accepted until we have valid buyers. Once we have 10 buyers, payment will be sent to my business via paypal. This is to insure the security of the buyer, as well as a record of transaction and eventual info pertaining to package tracking. I will provide my contact info as well as my representatives contact info at Addco for a completely transparent transaction. My rep told me the turn time is about 2-3 weeks.
I would need serious inquires to email me, as I do not check the forum often. I am mainly on Facebook (where we also have this same listing posted).
I have the Addco 1" rear bar on the back of my 88 Coupe/IMSA and really like it when racing. If you like to steer with your feet, the 1" rear bar is a must!
I'm in for another rear bar for the extra 88 cradle I have for sure.
I have the Addco 1" rear bar on the back of my 88 Coupe/IMSA and really like it when racing. If you like to steer with your feet, the 1" rear bar is a must!
I'm in for another rear bar for the extra 88 cradle I have for sure.
Please be sure to email me so I can keep track of who is a buyer.
What amount of anti-roll enhancement does the ADDCO rep expect from a 4mm increase in the front and a 3 mm increase in the rear?
Keep in mind, that the only vendor I know of who is currently offering a bar is WCF, at a price of $600 for the front only (no rear bar available), and his bars are 1.25" as well. The different being either a hollow tube with a variety of wall thicknesses to pick from, or solid bars.
Per WCF quotes on the stock bar,
Stock 88 1.1 in =257 lb @ 5 Degrees
Stock 84-87 .886 in = 147 lb @ 5 degrees
per WCF quotes fro a solid front 1.25" (of course material does come into play, but it give you an idea)
now, the quotes I got from my rep at Addco are slightly different values, and I am not entirely sure how they are tested
Front OE bar = 157 Lbs/inch Addco = 240 Lbs/inch, simple math tells us this is 52% stiffer than stock (similar to the .188 wall thickness tube front from WCF).
Rear OE bar = 81 lbs/inch Addco = 139 lbs /inch, simple math tells us this is 71.6% stiffer than stock
Thanks for info. Please check your info comparing WCF and ADDCO front rate comparison.
Quoted and snipped from above...
Tube 1.250 in .188 wall=420lb @ 5 degrees
Front OE bar = 157 Lbs/inch Addco = 240 Lbs/inch, simple math tells us this is 52% stiffer than stock (similar to the .188 wall thickness tube front from WCF).
End quote.
It would be good to know how ADDCO determines their values for comparison purposes.
Thanks from a Formula owner who desires higher rate anti-roll bars!
[This message has been edited by olejoedad (edited 04-16-2018).]
No, this is definitely not just for racing. In fact, my 88’ will probably never see a track. Larger (firmer) sway bars allow for less body roll, and improve cornering. This set is balanced matched, but some “real” racers occasionally prefer different firmnesses front and/or rear to get the car to behave a certain way.
Thanks for info. Please check your info comparing WCF and ADDCO front rate comparison.
Quoted and snipped from above...
Tube 1.250 in .188 wall=420lb @ 5 degrees
Front OE bar = 157 Lbs/inch Addco = 240 Lbs/inch, simple math tells us this is 52% stiffer than stock (similar to the .188 wall thickness tube front from WCF).
End quote.
It would be good to know how ADDCO determines their values for comparison purposes.
Thanks from a Formula owner who desires higher rate anti-roll bars!
I’ll work on getting some clarification from Addco for you
Did you notice the WCF is at 420, the ADDCO is at 240? The numbers are not comparable...
Yes but stock rates are also different among the two. Addco’s rate Is 50%+ better offer stock compared to the value they use for the stock bar. If using the same percentage over stock with WCF’s rate, we end up at about 390# (which is why I said “close to” the .188” wall tube).
I caught the 420/240, but didn't catch the 257/157. Oops! 😨
Info regarding both WCF and ADDCO testing parameters would be helpful.
Will price go down if you can sell 15 or 20 sets?
Glad you are putting this package together.
I "assume": WCF locks the bar down, puts a scale at one end, then rotated the other 5 degrees and records the scale reading. Addco locks the bar down, puts a scale at one end, then lowers the other end 1" and records the scale reading.
What I wanted to know is 5 degrees deflection larger than 1" deflection...
I am away from the spare sway bars now, but I can tell you that 5 degrees rotation and 1" deflection are the same if the lever arm is 11.43" long. So if the 88 front sway bar is longer than this, then WCF is loading the bars more than Addco... With the actual arm length, we can run the numbers and do an apples to apples rate difference.
I caught the 420/240, but didn't catch the 257/157. Oops! 😨
Info regarding both WCF and ADDCO testing parameters would be helpful.
Will price go down if you can sell 15 or 20 sets?
Glad you are putting this package together.
I initially had a slightly less expensive option for the end buyer with Eibach. However, they needed my 88' for testing, $3K+ up-front, and a minimum order of 50. I then reached out to Addco to determine their requirements. They also have a buy-in, but they will not setup tooling unless I purchase a minimum of 10 each. This in itself is providing to be a challenge, let alone finding 15-20 buyers. The additional buyers would not result in a lower price, unfortunately. The manufacturer sets pricing that the dealer (in this case me) has to follow, otherwise I get dropped. However, offering both for $500 is my own rate to the community as a "group buy price" with me absorbing the difference. Hope this makes sense.
we currently have 5 people expressing interest a serious buyers.
Also, I have not yet heard back from Addco on their testing parameters, but I will follow up Tuesday/Wednesday if I don't hear back.
[This message has been edited by mnstrfiero (edited 04-16-2018).]
Originally posted by fieroguru: I "assume": WCF locks the bar down, puts a scale at one end, then rotated the other 5 degrees and records the scale reading. Addco locks the bar down, puts a scale at one end, then lowers the other end 1" and records the scale reading.
What I wanted to know is 5 degrees deflection larger than 1" deflection...
I am away from the spare sway bars now, but I can tell you that 5 degrees rotation and 1" deflection are the same if the lever arm is 11.43" long. So if the 88 front sway bar is longer than this, then WCF is loading the bars more than Addco... With the actual arm length, we can run the numbers and do an apples to apples rate difference.
Guru, I can measure arm length later today and post results for both front and rear bars.
If these will mount with the stock brackets and such, I'm interested... i just re did my entire suspension and don't want to have to change anything around after all that work... Just a simple remove the old, put in new.
Question:
Just to be clear, you are claiming that with the bar will change the handling that much to make the car act neutral as opposed to understeering as it does in stock form?
[This message has been edited by Shho13 (edited 04-19-2018).]
I'm still on the fence over this. The problem is it has never been tried on a Fiero before. That makes me nervous.
The Addco bars have been available before, but were discontinued. This is about trying to get another production run done. Front part # was Addco 539 Rear part # was Addco 445
Originally posted by Shho13: If these will mount with the stock brackets and such, I'm interested... i just re did my entire suspension and don't want to have to change anything around after all that work... Just a simple remove the old, put in new.
The front bar will need new brackets and will have to be relocated rearward as there isn't enough room for a 1 1/4" bar to fit in the stock location. The stock bar barely fits in the small triangle zone above the front cradle arms and below the front frame rails.
WCF uses a plate to shift the mounting bushing lower and back to improve the clearance.
[This message has been edited by fieroguru (edited 04-19-2018).]
Damn. I think I'm gonna sit this one out with that news... Sorry guys. Looks promising though, sounds like it will make a great improvement in handling with very little modification; I've got way too many projects lined up as it is right now, including a 4.9 that is waiting to go in...
------------------ "Discord" Red 1988 GT under restoration!
Damn. I think I'm gonna sit this one out with that news... Sorry guys. Looks promising though, sounds like it will make a great improvement in handling with very little modification; I've got way too many projects lined up as it is right now, including a 4.9 that is waiting to go in...
I am sure FieroGuru know's what he's talking about, but for the sake of clarification, I will reach out to my rep tomorrow at Addco to determine if the bars come with new mounts, and if relocation/modification is needed.
keep in mind, the bar that WCF as developed uses a totally different "arm" (ends). This allows the bar to be modular, so the end user car swap out for different tubes in the event they want different characteristics out of the bar.
[This message has been edited by mnstrfiero (edited 04-19-2018).]
As for mounting the rear bar, all I had to do was drill a new hole for each pillow block where the bar attaches to the cradle because the stock holes are too close together.
we are at 6 currently, and the Fiero Store is purchasing two sets to essentially help out with this process. We need two more buyers to get this ball rollin'.
i'm not sure if I answered this earlier, but I will reach out to my rep tomorrow to find out for you, thanks!
I was waiting to hear what you find out from your rep about the strut brackets. Please share everything what you've find out from your rep. It would help me to make a decision better if I had all the info. Thanks.
The Addco bars have been available before, but were discontinued. This is about trying to get another production run done. Front part # was Addco 539 Rear part # was Addco 445
If it was available in the past, can anyone come forward who have installed this product on their Fiero? It would help to know how it worked out.
Originally posted by Fiero Vice: I was waiting to hear what you find out from your rep about the strut brackets. Please share everything what you've find out from your rep. It would help me to make a decision better if I had all the info. Thanks.
Sorry my friend, working on a variety of different projects at one time. We have a Bronco, and a Fairmont we’ve made an LED kit for, with the fiero being next. I’ll reach out to him this week to get details.
Okay, here is an update of buyers. If you all are on this forum, please chime in to confirm.
I will be reaching out to my rep on Monday (I already sent him an email) regarding the following questions
1) are brackets included 2) are end links included 3) is modification needed to install 4) production turn time 5) when production will begin
List of confirmed buyers thus far. (I will absorb the difference of cost to get these in production sooner)
1) Fiero Store (2-sets) 2) James E 1-set 3) Paul S 1-set 4) Chris T 1-set 5) Daniel B 1-set 6) Sean 1-set 7) Mike W 1-set (or rear only, not confirmed) 8) Chris A (me) 1-set
Once I have answers to my questions, I will post them here. Then, I will collect funds via Paypal to my company, Fox Speed Division. I will absorb the 3% paypal fee. I will then provide my direct contact info, as well as the Addco reps to each buyer.
Buyer's need to make sure they have their most recent shipping address on paypal, as I will ship to confirmed addresses only. Please also make sure to provide your updated contact info (phone number and email) in the paypal communication (if not already there).
