That actually would be interesting. Sacrilegious, but interesting.
Ha ha, yeah! I am thinking of using the Vette side vents on my fiero for the deck lid side vents, however. I was laughing when I did it... No alcohol involved, I swear.
-Dave
[This message has been edited by IFLYR22 (edited 08-02-2011).]
While the front end was off, we started to repair the firewall area. There were a lot of small cracks and some general age related fiberglass issues that we felt like addressing. Much of the non-structural metal brackets that are riveted on were removed for cleaning up. They will get put back on later. Many that could not be removed got Soda Blasted, re-riveted, then primer coated. I use an air hammer with the pressure dialed down to about 40psi. I made a rivet tip for it that gives a good round head to the crush rivets. The damaged areas were fixed the same way as the top side. Fiberglass and resin as needed, or long/short strand filler as needed. The front part of the dolly was removed. It was bolted on, so that was easy. Since the front end was removed, we just didn't need it anymore. Using All-threaded rod and nuts, we propped the rest of the body up to make it easier to work on the firewall area.
We also stripped the "original" front end of parts we might need later, like the inner fender skirts.
Craigslist made the Front replacement debate easy. After looking for various options in catalogs and parts supplier web sites, we found someone selling a hand layered, one piece, front clip for a 66-67 Vette. They originally were going to use it, but it was the wrong front clip for their Vette. They bought their Vette as an unfinished project from someone who already had the front, but unused. Since it was 10% the cost of new panels, we decided to use it. After looking it over, it was too thick in some areas, and too thin in others, but that can be fixed. We also decided to add in most of the bond strips as they give the locations of other parts that need to be bonded onto the front clip.
Time to start putting this thing back together. using Vette Panel Adhesive / filler, we bonded the first part on, the bond strip for the rear tail light panel. We need more clamps...
More later
-Dave
[This message has been edited by IFLYR22 (edited 08-05-2011).]
One thing we learned with Vette Panel Adhesive / filler, it has variable flash (kick / hardening) time. It is difficult to mix it properly to have the desired time before flash. We were getting anywhere from 2 minutes to 10 minutes. This was not much of an issue when it came to smaller parts getting bonded. For the larger panels, we decided to use an SMC / FRP panel adhesive from 3M, Automix 8219. It gave us about 15-20 minutes reliably (3M claims 30 minutes, but this is a different climate). Down side is, short shelf life. Use it while you can. One tube goes a long way too. It also takes a day to cure, where as Vette Panel Adhesive can be cured in a couple hours.
We bonded on the tail light panel with it. We also temp bolted the rear lower valence back on to check the fit. It was good, so we kept it in place for the time being. Other than the pipe clamps (which were not actually doing much. They were there holding it, but they were not tight at all. You can see one being held up by another clamp.) and two clamps, the panel was holding itself on.
To finish using the tube up, we also bonded one bond strip into the front clip
Post cure and clamps removed, it looked like this before the filling and sanding began...
More later...
-Dave
[This message has been edited by IFLYR22 (edited 08-05-2011).]
I really, really like this thread...............you are doing a fantastic job. Looking forward to every post and eventually the finished product. Very nice work.
I really, really like this thread...............you are doing a fantastic job. Looking forward to every post and eventually the finished product. Very nice work.
HAGO!
Thank you! I have wondered if this project will ever finished !
I learned two things about working with different fillers, ok, three things about working with different fillers. Get many different colors of the hardener and use a different color for each application, so you can see your layers as you sand. Start with long strand, move to short strand, then use heavy to light weight filler to fill the minor little holes left from the stranded. Chopped Mat sheets can be pulled apart and added to filler to add strength.
After round 1 of filling and sanding (long strand filler):
After round 2 using short strand filler: This is when I realized I should use different colors of hardener... other than holes filled, it's hard to see where I was...
After round 3, you can see different color hardener was used. I was using blue hardener, this time I used the gray with the short strand filler. It wasn't a drastic change, but it was enough for me to see where I had been.
Rough work is done.
We also started to test fit the various parts of the front clip.
The spare tire carrier is fiberglass and is bolted on the chassis below the gas tank. It has a metal "A" frame riveted in for the drop down door. It had cracks and some general damage, but was mostly intact.
After the "A" frame support was removed. Many of the cracks were cut open with a rotary tool. Then they were V'ed and filled.
After primer and paint, it looked like this.
Then I re-riveted the "A" frame back on. The rivets go from the fiberglass side with the crush head in the metal side. Every crush rivet on the car is done that way. I should have ground down the factory rivet gun impacts to the "A" frame metal, but, I doubt anyone will be close enough to this part to notice !
The upper part had some cracks as well. They were in some corners.
You can't really see this part from the outside or from under the car, so I admit I didn't spend much time getting it perfect. I just wanted it solid and intact. It was primed and ready for paint:
This is my crush rivet "gun"
I put a metal block on the head of the rivet, and use the "gun" to mushroom out the pin end. It's just a broken end of a tool that I cupped with a rotary tool and polished the cup. It made working with crush rivets easy. Also, all the crush rivets on the body are aluminum.
-Dave
[This message has been edited by IFLYR22 (edited 08-05-2011).]
Your rear valance has three taillight holes per side, which I think is cool, doesn't the stock Vette have only 2 per side?
(Not "nit-picking" ) I think its a good question for us like me who are Vette neophytes. lol
Nice job on pics and such by the way, I have it marked to see as it goes.
Thank you! I am glad you are following this!
Like Fiero STS posted, about half way down page 3 has how and why I did it.
Adding to it:
The original tail lights are pathetic. I have noticed that newer cars have much brighter tail lights than older cars. There are various reasons for this. Old vs new wires, LED vs incandescent bulbs, better / newer reflective light bezels, etc...
As I have chosen to keep the incandescent bulbs (because the brake lights I already have are in great shape), the only way to get more light out the back was to add another bulb. I had to add another spot in for that. The wiring is in great shape as well, but I may pull the brake light wires from the rear harness and run new ones, as the load has increased. I have done nothing to the harnesses yet. The project is not that far along yet.
-Dave
[This message has been edited by IFLYR22 (edited 08-04-2011).]
Around this time, there was a lot of general body work done to correct various stress cracks and to "clean" up the areas where the bumpers would be. Body lines needed to be better defined.
The bolt holes for the bumpers would be re-drilled later.
There was a few bond strips and areas that needed to re-bonded as well.
The doors were getting stripped down as well.
The front clip was getting sanded and having most of the bond strips put in. Bonded in:
Cleaned down:
There was a lot of test fitting. Every little piece needed to be test fit and corrected. Once the bond strips were in, we took the head light buckets out and test fit them as well as the headlight brackets that the headlight rotating joints bolt to. The headlight buckets were chemically stripped to the original paint. After that, they were Soda Blasted to clean off the remaining paint. One had 9 color layers on it. They're made out of aluminum.
They fit pretty good, but they still needed some work.
We also test fit the inner fenders in the body. we were satisfied with the fit, so they got installed...
The upper part (lower in the picture, at the hood opening) where the inner fenders bond to the front clip were not bonded on. If the hood needed to be adjusted afterwards, having that part bonded on would make it difficult to do any hood adjustment. You can raise the hood from the body, but it is not designed to easily lower the hood into the body. The hood hinges bolt to a bracket that is riveted to the inner fenders (currently removed).
It's hard to tell in the last picture, but the inside of the front clip was sanded down with a DA using 80 grit then 120 grit to smooth it out. It was going to get painted too, so it should be smooth enough for that. I want it smooth so dirt doesn't want to stick to it. Easier to keep clean that way.
More later...
-Dave
[This message has been edited by IFLYR22 (edited 08-05-2011).]
While I sit here reviewing your thread and drooling over this project, I began to think about the stress cracks that you've repaired. I'm not a fiberglass or structural expert by any means but, I have helped OPM2000 build a few Pantero bodies. In reference to those stress cracks, do you have any concerns that those stress cracks will re-appear? Did you do anything to relieved the stress or re-enforced the areas or do you think they were simply age related or incident/accident related? The rest of the body is still an old vette fiberglass structure, any concerns there? Just curious. Again, this is a great thread, sitting here drooling over a project that I wish I could do. Thanks for the effort to show us the restoration.
While I sit here reviewing your thread and drooling over this project, I began to think about the stress cracks that you've repaired. I'm not a fiberglass or structural expert by any means but, I have helped OPM2000 build a few Pantero bodies. In reference to those stress cracks, do you have any concerns that those stress cracks will re-appear? Did you do anything to relieved the stress or re-enforced the areas or do you think they were simply age related or incident/accident related? The rest of the body is still an old vette fiberglass structure, any concerns there? Just curious. Again, this is a great thread, sitting here drooling over a project that I wish I could do. Thanks for the effort to show us the restoration.
I would not call myself an expert either. A lot of this has been OJT (and I have asked many who I consider experts before I even undertook this part). This is the most extensive fiberglass project I have ever done.
Many of the stress cracks are age related. I don't think there is anything that can be done to stop those. For every one of those I fix, more are inevitable as it continues to age. luckily, those are mostly hair line surface cracks where the fibers are scarce in ratio to the resin. Many of these type were not immediately apparent til the paint or trim was removed. Almost all of these were near corners of openings in the body, like around the rear window. We only found about 20% of these before the trim and paint came off.
The impact derived ones are re-enforceable by repairing the damaged area as a whole. This body has gone through a road war, and lost . There were quite a few factory bonds that were no longer doing their job due to impacts, and were not fixed when the original "repairs" were done. Those created many of the larger cracks that were found after the paint was gone. For example; the passenger side rear fender was deformed from the prior "repair". They did not fix the panel correctly. This created many cracks later as it was driven (near the rear bumper mounting). After removing their "fix", the body was allowed to go back to it's correct contour. I hope this allows the cracks to not reappear. We have gone through many of the bond areas and injected adhesive to re-bond them as needed. The 3M SMC / FRP adhesive is amazingly easy to inject into a gap with it's auto-mixing tip. The more we worked on it, the more we found that needed to be fixed.
I have only used Kevlar long and short strand fillers or fiberglass to fix these, so I feel they should last for a long time. In theory, fiberglass, if encased in gelcoat or paint, should outlast metal. I can't stop the age related issues, but I am confident with the others.
-Dave
Adding:
This picture is a good example. This is the fuel door hole. You can see how small the age cracks are in the paint. When the trim was on, 3 cracks were visible. With the trim removed, you can see about 6 cracks. When the paint was removed, there were actually 15 cracks.
[This message has been edited by IFLYR22 (edited 08-05-2011).]
You have an awful lot of patience on the recontruction this Corvette. Just a remarkable job on the detailed repairs you are going through. I can see a $100,000 dollar car once you are done. At least $100K worth of effort.
You have an awful lot of patience on the reconstruction this Corvette. Just a remarkable job on the detailed repairs you are going through. I can see a $100,000 dollar car once you are done. At least $100K worth of effort.
I am with Old Lar on this one, your dedication to restoring this Vette is amazing! Thanks for preserving a classic, and letting us in on the process!!
You have an awful lot of patience on the recontruction this Corvette. Just a remarkable job on the detailed repairs you are going through. I can see a $100,000 dollar car once you are done. At least $100K worth of effort.
I never though of it as patience. It really was just one of those things that just exploded beyond what the original intent was. One part that needed work was connected to another part that needed work... until wrenches weren't enough. Then the grinders and drills came out !
I have all receipts for everything that was purchased to do this (tools and all but one part, the front clip). They will never be added up. I don't want to know.
I am with Old Lar on this one, your dedication to restoring this Vette is amazing! Thanks for preserving a classic, and letting us in on the process!!
Many Thanks!!
I'm glad you are following this. In the past many months (9+), I have been wondered why I am doing this rebuild. Looking through these pictures to post them has given me the reason. I simply enjoy it.
After the doors got stripped down, we got a good look at them. The driver side door had a rear view mirror. The factory only put one on it. There was a dealer option for one on the passenger side door. This car had one on the driver side, and the passenger side showed signs of having one...that was filled in. The picture below shows the filled in holes on the passenger door. The driver side door has the holes still in it.
Well, since there are holes there, might as well add another mirror ... But, I still had to fill the area in to get a smooth surface. The holes will be re-drilled later.
The inside of the doors show how little metal there is in there. The left side of the picture is the outer skin.
The hinges bolt to it, and the fiberglass door skins are bonded / riveted to it. Every rivet was loose. I had to get my hand and rivet gun inside the door, not easy. There surprisingly little rust. The little that was there, was taken care of when the door metal and jams got Soda Blasted.
This pretty much how the doors will be until they end up on the body. The bare metal was coated with metal prep to keep it from rusting.
More to come...
-Dave
[This message has been edited by IFLYR22 (edited 08-05-2011).]
I would not call myself an expert either. A lot of this has been OJT (and I have asked many who I consider experts before I even undertook this part). This is the most extensive fiberglass project I have ever done.
-Dave
Just my personal unqualified opinion here but, I'd say you've learned your lessons well. Love the thread, thanks for the response.
Realizing there was too much stuff to do to the under side of the body, we decided to flip it over. It took three people to do this. Two to lift and flip it, one to set the supports up. I don't have an automotive restoration rotisserie, so we improvised. Good thing this part is very light weight, maybe 300 lbs max. The foam on the roof was in case we needed to set it down while it was up side down. We didn't have to due to the third person working fast.
There really was no way to fix some of the stuff wrong with out the body up side down. The door sills have the metal in direct contact with them, this metal is tied into the metal cage that is the passenger compartment, so it should be strong enough, and it was.
Rust like this, while not much more than surface rust, needs to be addressed, and the dolly was in the way. Also, while it was like this, we used a mild, fiberglass safe, degreaser and a power washer to clean most of the grease and general debris off.
Also, there is this black tar like compound that the factory put in the wheel wells and back near the tank area (near the back lower part of the rear window underside).
We also Soda Blasted the metal and then primer coated it.
You can see some loose fibers sticking out here. That is where the rear universal joint is on the drive shaft. That will get new fiberglass and resin to seal it in and smooth it out.
It's a unique perspective to work on a car upside down like this.
-Dave
[This message has been edited by IFLYR22 (edited 08-06-2011).]
Nice thread! Thanks for posting all your hard work.
Nolan
Thank you! I admit, I have skipped over some minor details that I didn't feel necessary. There was more work done that I am showing, but I didn't feel it was needed as the final pictures showed the work.
I did initially bring it up there, much like when I initially brought it up here when asking about the transmission issue. The interest was more negative than here, at the time. Maybe things have changed. I haven't surfed there in quite a while.
I have gotten Orders. I am to report for full time duty with my unit for a few months... updates may become more sparse. I will still update when I can, but it may not be as often.
Thanks to everyone for your support on this project.
I have gotten Orders. I am to report for full time duty with my unit for a few months... updates may become more sparse. I will still update when I can, but it may not be as often.
Thanks to everyone for your support on this project.
I have gotten Orders. I am to report for full time duty with my unit for a few months... updates may become more sparse. I will still update when I can, but it may not be as often.
Thanks to everyone for your support on this project.
-Dave
Did you explain to them that we need you here for our entertainment? Good luck to you!
. 
Thank you for your service, and we will be waiting patiently for updates. Keep your head down, and your eyes up. 
