If there's video evidence plus the autopsy showing drugs in his system, that would seem to justify the shooting. I don't think it will matter to the rioters and protesters. Once the genie is out of the bottle, you can't put it back. The outrage will run it's course, much like the Trayvon Martin shooting.
Or the Rodney King verdict out in LA and surrounding Southern Cali cities.
Do you know whats going to happen to this city(our every other city) If they find this shooting was justified. Sharpton is still hangen around here shooten his big mouth off about this officer is a first degree murder and will except nothing else.He keeps instigating a hang the man attitude and stirring the rioters up every FN day hes been here. There is a lot of info yet to be released and that dumb ass could care less. THIS JUST IN 933 pm police are now shooting tear gas at rioters,more to come later.
If there's video evidence plus the autopsy showing drugs in his system, that would seem to justify the shooting. I don't think it will matter to the rioters and protesters. Once the genie is out of the bottle, you can't put it back. The outrage will run it's course, much like the Trayvon Martin shooting.
The protesters and rioters can't be put into the same group. There are people who are upset, and then there are troublemakers. The troublemakers seem to be largely criminals.
This may be, but legislation is done by the government, enforced by the government, and tried by the government.
The Government is elected by the people to do the will of the people. If you see things not going your way, you can only blame the people who put them in office. The Government is not conspiring in and of itself, it is people that we elected. It can all change either direction at a wim of an election.
Things are not bad where I am. Haven't had an intruder here in years.
This makes many of my points. Some people who are not local have no idea what is going on here. Anyone for whom things are not bad, yet who carries a gun out their back steps is in no way qualified to judge anything to do with this situation. Unless they have a current threat from an external area in their neighborhood, they don't understand the situation here. There seems to be some confusion about the word ”bad”. Obviously, this is a complex situation, and I don't expect it to be understood by, well, people who don't understand ”bad”. For the rest of us who are curious, we are under martial law. Limited ingress/egress, armed citizens protecting private property, curfew, trouble 24/7.
Some people never grow up. As a parent, if I tell me child that they will be punished with a timeout if they exhibit a particular behavior, I must be able to correctly identify the problem, deem this punishment a suitable corrective action, and be willing/able to administer the punishment in a just manner. It isn't that I want my child to exhibit the behavior, that I want to punish the child, or want the child in timeout. If, however, the child violates the rule, they will receive the punishment. If this punishment is ineffective, the punishment will increase in severity after a suitable warning. The same premise holds for any authority figure. The punishment must meet the offense. In this case, crime. Threatening a murderer with a 5-minute timeout is a waste of time. These rioters are criminals. They know no limits. Their animal behavior is attrocious and unacceptable. Therefore, any restraint must be in a form they will understand. This works for wolves, coyotes, and even cows & buffalo. Pigs are very smart, and don't need such methods.
We can decide to be part of the problem or part of the solution. Hate is part of the problem. Again, this isn't the Native Americans who are involved.
There is the government (puppeteers), the rioters (puppets), and the good citizens. The good citizens are trying to resolve this, the puppets are the blind following the carot and doing the dirty work, and the puppeteers are reaping the benefits.
Think about this. If these rioters were beating animals, like dogs & cats, throwing torches and bottles at the animals, would you still feel that they are in the right? Probably not. The media would completely change your view about the plight of the poor animals. Why should innocent citizens--who just happen to be people--get worse treatment?
I'm not sure you know this, and it's hard to tell because Don looks like a hick, and smells like cow manure....And is older than dirt, and did I mention he smells? Anyway, I'd bet my hat that Don knows more about how things work in areas of this country than you any day. And I'd be willing to bet he can understand better than the majority why people are acting like they are. He hasn't been completely aimless his entire life you know.
Just a word of advise. Remember that you don't know what everyone here has experienced in life.
Brad
[This message has been edited by Fats (edited 08-18-2014).]
The Government is elected by the people to do the will of the people. If you see things not going your way, you can only blame the people who put them in office. The Government is not conspiring in and of itself, it is people that we elected. It can all change either direction at a wim of an election.
I'm glad you believe that....
All Governments have agendas, both long term and short term. Ever hear the term "... to sway public opinion." ?
If after 9-11, the Government had told the public "this was an isolated event and the odds of something of this scale ever happening again are very unlikely." Would the public have supported invading the Middle East? Would the military have received as much funding? Would average Americans be as tolerant to the invasion of their privacy for the good of "national security" ?
I'm not saying the Government is evil. What I am saying is through manipulating the media and allowing events to escalate; or in other situations, not allowing them to escalate and sweeping it under the carpet, the Government can manipulate public opinion.
An approximate transcription of the background conversation, as related by the “Conservative Treehouse” blog, who originally discovered the conversation:
@6:28/6:29 of video
#1 How’d he get from there to there?
#2 Because he ran, the police was still in the truck – cause he was like over the truck
{crosstalk}
#2 But him and the police was both in the truck, then he ran – the police got out and ran after him
{crosstalk}
#2 Then the next thing I know he doubled back toward him cus - the police had his gun drawn already on him –
[there is dispute here whether he says "doubled back" or "coming back."]
#1. Oh, the police got his gun
#2 The police kept dumpin on him, and I’m thinking the police kept missing – he like – be like – but he kept coming toward him
{crosstalk}
#2 Police fired shots – the next thing I know – the police was missing
#1 The Police?
#2 The Police shot him
#1 Police?
#2 The next thing I know … I’m thinking … the dude started running … (garbled something about “he took it from him”) This is terribly important because if Mike Brown had been shot, and he advanced towards the cop instead of surrendering, it would substantiate the narrative that the policeman shot in self-defense due to the fact that he was being threatened with severe bodily harm. This corroborates an account of the event given by a friend of Officer Darren Wilson:
But then never let the truth get in the way of a good reverend al Sharpton race war project.
Well guess were im working today.Ground zero.Going to install security doors on my friends house.Last night when they were chasing the rioters out the thugs were running thru the neighbor hoods smashing windows out of cars and houses.His front door got a big chunk of concrete blasted thru the window.He and his wife have lived there for 28yrs and are contemplating on moving.I guess my gun could ride with my tools.
I'm glad you believe that.... 7 All Governments have agendas, both long term and short term. Ever hear the term "... to sway public opinion." ?
If after 9-11, the Government had told the public "this was an isolated event and the odds of something of this scale ever happening again are very unlikely." Would the public have supported invading the Middle East? Would the military have received as much funding? Would average Americans be as tolerant to the invasion of their privacy for the good of "national security" ?
I'm not saying the Government is evil. What I am saying is through manipulating the media and allowing events to escalate; or in other situations, not allowing them to escalate and sweeping it under the carpet, the Government can manipulate public opinion.
So what is happening in Ferguson?
Well, it went from this:
to this:
to this:
This is a very complex subject: First, the general public does not like to hear all that much news about politics and dont get enough information to make an educated vote before elections. The results of years of this kind of ignorant ballots has evolved to the Government we have now. People basically vote along party lines (for what ever reasons ) and or vote based on extremely biased opinions from polarized "media" that tell them who to vote for.
People in office have always attempted to manipulate truth to benefit them selfs for the selfish purpose of maintaining power. That is not a government thing, that is a people thing that happens everywhere at just about every type of job, club, association........... It is human nature, not the nature of Government.
This Police action was largely a result of racism and hate for authority= gang thug mentality.
[This message has been edited by Rickady88GT (edited 08-18-2014).]
He has tapped into the wells of ignorant people to get what he wanted. Goes to show just how important it is to stay educated. Not all Germans fell for his propaganda.
[This message has been edited by Rickady88GT (edited 08-18-2014).]
Growing up I had two parents and was taught to respect the police. I also have the common sense to know that if I attack a policeman who is carrying a gun I can expect to get shot. In this case even though the policeman didn't know Brown had just robbed a store, Brown thought he was being arrested for robbing the store. Brown attacked the policeman to try and avoid arrest and in the process he tried to get the policemans gun and also injured his eye socket and leg. The fact that Brown has four bullet wounds on his arm indicates that he had his hand on the officers gun. The officer didn't know if Brown had a weapon or not and we must remember that this all happened in a matter of seconds. This could have easily happened the other way with the policeman getting shot. The mass media bears a lot of blame for sensationalizing every story for ratings and our welfare system bears blame for rewarding black women for making a career out of having multiple children from multiple sperm donors and getting a check for each child. Very few of these children are raised by two parents and a lot of them are taken care of by Grandma, this have created a generation of black males who have not been taught respect for anything. Another big problem is that there are no jobs for all these kids when they graduate from high school, big business has shipped all of the low skilled manufacturing jobs overseas to fatten their bottom line and to compete with cheap imports that politicians allow to flood our market. One of the biggest problems we have is the lack of Respect we show to each other. I see it all the time on this forum
I'll grant you that there are many people with more knowledge and experience than I have on many subjects, including this one. By the same token, these other people don't know what I've experienced in life. Each situation is different.
Someone as experienced as this Don, if you're referring to the guy with the hateful response, should be experienced enough to know that he should consider his words. I don't mind people telling it like it is, but hate is what is causing this problem, and apparently, hate is his wagon. Where I grew up, if someone exhibited sich poor manners in person, when they got up off the floor, perhaps their manners would have improved. Usually, even city people learned after a few times.
He's referring to me--My real name is Don. Caucasian--age 64, Southern Baptist, married, father of 4 now grown children, 8 grandchildren, occupation for most of my life--blue collar trades--Current occupation = smelly trophy husband and small herd cattleman. I have only lived on this parcel of land since 2007, tho I have owned about 1/3 of it as a non-resident property owner since the early 2000s. Spent my first 7 years of school life under segregation--spent nearly 9 years in two different branches of the military including some in the biggest ever US melting pot, the Vietnam draft era.
I have lived (established legal residency sometimes including owning residential property) in: ( * denotes places I have personally witnessed protests, violence, and/or other "civil disobedience" . ) Baytown Tx (Metro Harris County Texas. Houston is located in Harris County) Pensacola Fla. Memphis Tenn 3 different times.* Lafayette La for over 10 years. San Angelo Texas. 10 years.* Currently live in rural San Jacinto County Texas, and intend to die here.
I have either visited (for more than 1 week) or temporarily lived in : ( * denotes places I have personally witnessed protests, violence, and/or other "civil disobedience" . San Diego. Riverside Calif. Jacksonville Fla. New Bern N.C. Paris Texas.
Subic City, Olongapo, and Manila, Philippines.* Yokosuka Japan.* Okinawa Prefecture * Seoul S. Korea.* Danang Vietnam.* Naha, Okinawa Prefecture, Japan* Guantanamo Bay Cuba. San Juan Puerto Rico*. Hong Kong.* Oklahoma City. Santa Domingo, Dominican Republic.* Belize City, Belize.* Taipei, Taiwan. Port-au-Prince Haiti.*
Probably a few I have forgotten. Spent all of July 2014 intentionally visiting 30 different towns and cities from the Rio Grande, out to the Pecos, and up to the Red River and back home. I observed people, cultures and attitudes everywhere I have ever gone.
In each and every civil disturbance I witnessed in person or live on TV in my lifetime, I have heard the same old old tired rationalization being used today--"it's just a few "agitators" from out of state or out of this area that's stirring peaceful folks up". After 50 years of my adult life, it's really really getting old. Lester Maddox, George Wallace, the early Strom Thurmond, Jesse Helms, Bull Connor, the young Robert Byrd, and Jim Crow are finally all dead and buried I believe----let's leave 'em there.
[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 08-18-2014).]
Not a doubt in my mind, many of us are responding to what we think we know or believe versus what the facts are. Those peacefully protesting are admirable and I support their right to do so. Those that choose to riot are a different issue. I've stayed out of this thread because I don't know what happened for sure. I surely don't blame those who are questioning the actions of the police officer and, I don't blame the police for trying to maintain order. The problem I see is very poor communications from the police to quell an obviously explosive situation and looters/thieves who are just looking for an opportunity to cover their actions with civil disobedience.
I don't blame store owners for trying to protect their property nor do I blame those that live there for being afraid. If I were there, I'd protect my family and property also, one way or another. The whole situation is pretty disgusting and speaks volumes for where we are as a society from any perspective.
------------------ Ron Count Down to A Better America: http://countingdownto.com/countdown/196044 Isn't it strange that after a bombing, everyone blames the bomber, his upbringing, his environment, his culture, his mental state but … after a shooting, the problem is the gun?
My Uncle Frank was a staunch Conservative and voted straight Republican until the day he died in Chicago. Since then he has voted Democrat. Shrug
[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 08-18-2014).]
I never saw any reputable news that said he was shot in the back--all that I read said he had turned and had his hands up facing the officer when shots were fired.
so he turned out to be a thug after all. Oh...and he was not shot in the back, but the front at close range.....Big surprise .
I didn't hear anything about him being shot in the back anyway.
But like I said earlier... the conversation has evolved. This isn't Trayvon Martin. The area just needed an excuse--any excuse--to band together for reform. Michael Brown was that reason, whether the actual shooting was justified or not.
I never saw any reputable news that said he was shot in the back--all that I read said he had turned and had his hands up facing the officer when shots were fired.
Originally posted by maryjane: “Keep running, bro!,” he said Brown yelled. Then Brown yelled it a second time. Those would be the last words Johnson’s friend, “Big Mike,” would ever say to him.
Brown made it past the third car. Then, “blam!” the officer took his second shot, striking Brown in the back. At that point, Johnson says Brown stopped, turned with his hands up and said “I don’t have a gun, stop shooting!”
[This message has been edited by Fats (edited 08-18-2014).]
Things would all calm down there if they got an F5 tornado making a direct hit on downtown Ferguson, id even be happy with a 2 mile wide sinkhole about 1/2 mile deep.
Things would all calm down there if they got an F5 tornado making a direct hit on downtown Ferguson, id even be happy with a 2 mile wide sinkhole about 1/2 mile deep.
Why? What good would that do? Would it stop the riots and looting? I think it would just hurt the innocent bystanders.
What ever happened to the good old days where a cop would apprehend a criminal WITHOUT lethal force? But that is beside the point… The problem here is the media, the Government (municipal, state and maybe federal) are playing both sides and fueling the tension. Why? Not sure… But this incident is now way out of proportion and out of control.
Originally posted by Rickady88GT: People in office have always attempted to manipulate truth to benefit them selfs for the selfish purpose of maintaining power. That is not a government thing, that is a people thing that happens everywhere at just about every type of job, club, association........... It is human nature, not the nature of Government.
quote
Originally posted by Rickady88GT:
The Government is not conspiring in and of itself, it is people that we elected.
Yes, people. One has to keep an eye on people and what they scheme, wherever they may be.
As for your RESEARCH guy above, he made a veiled suggestion that I was something I'm not. Obviously another research/knowledge error. Anytime someone says ”your ideas are abhorrent” it is a personal attack.
I know nothing about you except what you have posted here. Note that I said, "Your ideas are abhorrent!" [emphasis added] I was attacking the ideas you expressed, and I'm perfectly willing to stand and be judged by my actual words, and you by yours:
quote
Originally posted by tshark:
I would leave the bodies where they fell. Perhaps the message would get through. I wouldn't call any medical people. I also would shoot to disable, probably stomach or chest. No kill shots. In humane? Perhaps. It may save lives. War tactics are used in war. Make no mistake. This is war. We are fighting for our way of life, to be free and American ...
quote
Originally posted by Marvin McInnis:
Why don't you sit down, take that hood off, and tell us what you really think? Your ideas are abhorrent!
On further reflection, I will resolve any ambiguity from my previous "veiled suggestion": Based solely on the ideas you have expressed in this thread, I conclude that you are a bigot, and you may be a sadist as well. Is that clear enough?
[This message has been edited by Marvin McInnis (edited 08-18-2014).]
There are quite a few people on here that have a huge problem disagreeing. They call names, or attack personally if they don't agree with your views. The "RESEARCH guy" is one of them.
I'm not at all sure where that came from. You are certainly free to think whatever you wish of me; we don't have to like everybody. I do, however, hope that you would grant me the right occasionally to be every bit as hostile and aggressive in my posts as a few others on PFF who regularly choose to do so. I wish you well.
[This message has been edited by Marvin McInnis (edited 08-18-2014).]
Originally posted by Marvin McInnis: I know nothing about you except what you have posted here. Note that I said, "Your ideas are abhorrent!" [emphasis added] I was attacking the ideas you expressed, and I'm perfectly willing to stand and be judged by my actual words, and you by yours:
On further reflection, I will resolve any ambiguity from my previous "veiled suggestion": Based solely on the ideas you have expressed in this thread, I conclude that you are a bigot, and you may be a sadist as well. Is that clear enough?
Very clear. You have moved from personal attacks, to name-calling. Very juvenile. Perhaps this will make you feel better about yourself. You make me laugh. You've now exactly fit the description of the name you're calling me. Try the dictionary for research. It should help with understanding these posts also.
No you don't know. To use your words, you ”know nothing”. That couldn't be more clear. That being the case, why are you still typing posts? You choose not to read or understand, rendering any research valueless. Also very clear. You apparently would rather start another fire than resolve this situation. In fact, apparently, you are of the sort that engender these situations. Very clear. You obviously have no comprehension of this situation, perhaps you have no comprehensive ability. Very clear. Your complete lack of comprehension of this or any other situation does not make it any less real or dangerous for those of us that ARE HERE. Again, you. ARE NOT HERE!
Conclude away. I have not seen any recent constructive posts from you. Your opinions/thoughts/posts have ceased to have any value to me.
I do not have to justify myself to every puffed-up windbag that comes along. I was nice enough to compare experience once. I will not do it again. As observed previously, the attacks on here are usually because someone disagrees. Some on here seem to post only to attack others.
[This message has been edited by tshark (edited 08-18-2014).]
Why? What good would that do? Would it stop the riots and looting? I think it would just hurt the innocent bystanders.
What ever happened to the good old days where a cop would apprehend a criminal WITHOUT lethal force?
Nothing left to loot and no looters left alive....
Criminals now are either armed better than the police, or they try to get away at all costs. Once upon a time, they gave up when they knew there was no where to run. Watch the news now....a single criminal, in a burning car with 4 flat tires, in the grass, STILL tries to outrun the police who have a helicopter and 50 cruisers after him. Hes still fighting when 20 cops bring him down to cuff him. You do something when someone your trying arrest is fighting you, is a head taller and has 100 pnds on you. Like the Trayvon thing, they try to make it like this was a good little 18 yo boy just starting college...when in reality hes a friggin giant even for a football player. When he grabs the cigars at the store, he pushes the store owner into the wall like a bag of rags with one hand and walks out the door. Hes no little boy.
[This message has been edited by rogergarrison (edited 08-18-2014).]
I dont think Marv has bad intentions. There may be assumptions being made on more than a few sides of the replies in this thread.
Perhaps not; however, I know him no more than he knows me. His attacks and name-calling were completely uncalled for. (Is he right in his head?). He is in fact, not here. Those of us in fear for our lives are entitled to our valid opinion.
As Ive said before, I dont give a crap about negatives. You cant please everyone all the time. I say what I think, not what I think people want me to say to make them feel good.
