I am in the market to buy a new tire machine and wheel balancer for my shop. My shop is a strictly German repair shop, so I have been looking into getting a newer machine that can handle the tires that come on German cars. For those guys that mount tires everyday, do I need to spend the $10-$15k on a machine or is that overkill? I currently have a coats 3070e and it gets 60% of the tires done and I take the rest to STS....but that kills our productivity. Here is what I am looking at and let me know if you guys think it is adequate.
I'm leaning towards the Corghi and getting the matching balancer. Probably looking at a $22,000 purchase for those. Do I need that or is it going to just be a purchase that I could have spent $10,000 less and gotten the same result? The last time I worked mounting tires was in the mid 1990's, so I am a little out of touch with that. I probably won't be the one using it anyway.
guru, here at our shop we have three changers, 2 hunter tc3500 and a brand new coats machine, that the owner purchased for the new facility, the coats does everything but attach the air hose, techs just have to roll the tire over, push a button, and the machine lifts the wheel, puts in in place and proceeds. The techs all use the tc3500's and hate the new machine. Some can do 2 tires in the time it takes the coats to do 1.
My main concern is that a lot of the BMW rims are reverse mount rims. I turn away maybe two to three sets of tires a month and I realize that I am losing the alignment to STS. they set the front toe. We do it properly. With a better machine, I'd probably be more inclined to sell more tires and keep everything in house. There is a wholesale tire warehouse about 1 mile from my shop that I do business with. There isn't a lot of volume, but my main concern is to not scratch an expensive rim. The guys and myself do not like the current machine we have. It is almost impossible to mount a 235/45ZR17 tire unless you have two guys with three pry bars. I know this because that is the size tire on my VR6 Fiero. Maybe I don't need a crazy machine, I just want to be able to do what needs to be done and have myself and my techs happy. Dave
[This message has been edited by bmwguru (edited 02-15-2015).]
I slung tires everyday for about a year. One of my least favorite jobs I ever had.
That being said I can almost assure you the Hunter you showed is not going to be enough. I worked with something very similar, if not exactly the same. The fist machine looks like he best option, but the last one looks,like it can do the job as well.
What are you specifically having trouble with? Mounting the tire onto the rim? Getting the bead to seal after it's mounted? Removing the tire from the rim?
I dont know about changers, just that they have ones that are damage proof to wheels. On tire balancing, Ive never found any computer or bubble balancer that can outdo the old school one that spins the wheels on the car...along with someone who knows how to use it. Theres only one place in Columbus that still will do it that way. Ive had lots of issues with wheels and tires vibrating with the computerized ones. All my higher speed cars, I used the on car one and they remained perfectly balanced for the whole life of the tire, usually over 100K miles. He does charge $15-$20 per wheel. People with high end cars take him theirs to be balanced from clear across the state. This guy is a master. He jacks up the wheel and spins it as fast as he wants with a glass of water with a sticky bottom on the hood. He adjusts it till the water is perfectly still. They are silky smooth to over 150 mph.
I eliminated the Corghi machines from my want list due to servicing cost.
The Hunter machines I think may work for what I needs are the TC3300, TC3700 or TC3900.
The Coats machine that I think will work for my needs is the 70xEHL
The things I seem to like about the Hunter machine is the way it holds the tire....No feet that can scratch. I am not sure if I can reverse mount the rims though. I also like the roller and side shovel bead breaker option.
The things I like Coats machine is: The footprint seems smaller. Also, I have a history of buying Coats machines and have been very happy with them.
Both seem to have the extra arm that helps get low profile tires on. Both will be in the $10,000 range, so price isn't going to make a difference.
For those that have used the different types of machines...or any other machines....What did you like or hate about it? Angled top or flat top? Give me some feedback in general.
My needs are: Able to mount and dismount reverse mount tires without scratching the rim. Able to mount and dismount low profile tires without scratching the rim. Able to mount and dismount runflat tires without scratching the rim. Ease of use and technician friendly.
I am not set on any machine as of yet, so any other considerations are welcome. I would prefer it to be electric assist over air for the reduced noise.
[This message has been edited by bmwguru (edited 02-15-2015).]
the tc3500 has trouble with low profile tires and most tires 19" and bigger, it will not reverse mount the wheel. We got the coats one that you have pictured because the owner didn't want to send 19/20/22 and bigger rims to the Mavis down the street, on average we mount may mount a tire over 18" onece every 2 monthes. just looked at the hunter website, the 3500 looks just like the 3300 they have shown.
dan
[This message has been edited by bonaduce (edited 02-15-2015).]
I had been doing tire work on and off for around the last 30 years. The most used/reliable machine was the Coats 70X-3. The other ones work but are slow or clumsy. However with the Coats. Make sure you get the optional duckheads. We generally had 2 different ones. Also along with the bead depressor arm they make an attachment with a disc that will spin on the tire to help keep the bead in the valley. It bolts to the fixture for the bead depressor arm or a separate mast. A must for 45 series or less. Yes I have done 35 series on 22" rims. The only time I had problems with that machine is when a moron with a Mercedes ran the tire down till there was nothing but the bead on the rim. Had to carefully cut the bead off with a wizzer on that one. Then, make sure anyone using them knows how to use them properly or you will be buying rims and repairing machines. The trick with the revearsed rims was to break the beads and clamp them from the outside of the rim. Dismount and mount the tire, flip the rim over, clamp on the inside with the plastic clamp protectors, then inflate. Use the bead depressor arm with a shop towel in the middle of the rim while inflating to keep it from popping off the rim clamp. As far as balancers off car, I liked the Hunter. I recently left the tire business. Before I left. I had trained a newby for 6 months. He came second in last years Eastern tire rodeo competition. He got docked 20 seconds for not supporting the rim while inflating with the bead depressor. The rim he was mounting did not require it. But got docked anyway.
[This message has been edited by cmechmann (edited 02-15-2015).]
im a parts guy at a gm dealer, but the hunter rep was in last week demoing the new alighnment machine, he had a tire machin in the back of the truck i got to play with that was pretty fancy... i know not really helpfull
I have a Hunter rep and a Coats rep coming out this week to see who gets my money. I figure that I'll have my employees give their opinions as to what they like and not like and then I'll buy what suits the shop's needs. I am glad for the opinions given. I think the machines I was initially looking at would not have been what I actually need.
I met with the Coats rep and the Hunter rep. The Coats rep came out and was very easy to deal with and told me he would put me in contact with the sales rep after seeing my shop and understanding what I wanted. As for the Hunter rep, I felt like I was buying a damn car and was a bit annoyed with the fact that they kept saying that their machine would let me mount tow truck tires. The odd thing was the Hunter rep came to the shop with the sales guy I was speaking with about the Coats machine. Apparently, that guy is the salesman for both companies.
I told them that I wanted to spend around $10,000 and that I won't need financing. The Hunter rep told me to get the TCX51. The Coats rep told me to get the 70XEHL. Both agreed that the machine would meet my needs of speed to change the tire vs the low volume of tires that we do vs the fact we work on only German cars. They said as the machines get bigger and more expensive, the time to mount and dismount gets much longer. After comparing apples to apples, I felt the Hunter machine was better.
The Hunter machine has two options. Using the lever bar or the leverless head. My question is, for an additional $2000 is the leverless head worth the extra expense????
Typically, I would buy the machine with the sales rep that did not make me fell that I was being jerked around, but I put that aside and looked only at the machines. I am a bit skeptical though because the sales rep was really pushing the Hunter machine on me even though the Coats rep put me in contact with him.
For reference, this is the Coats machine that I was looking at:
The only reason I am leaning on the Hunter machine is that it operates on 220v which will help the motor torque on the tight tires. Otherwise, they are pretty much identical.
Dave
[This message has been edited by bmwguru (edited 02-21-2015).]
Both look like amazing machines, and both are light years ahead of what we have. We also have to farm out any high-end rims/tires. I don't know, but while the leverless add-on seems cool, I can't see where you really need it. Just be sure to use a poly-covered bar to prevent rim scratches. Also, do you really need the extra power of the 220v motor? Even our old machine only binds up when you don't have the sidewalls pushed down into the dropped-centre properly. It just seems like with either of these machines, that shouldn't happen if used properly. Also, I have seen apprentices bind up the machine and then try to force it, which inevitably damages the bead. Just my 2 cents.
That's ok. I asked on a tech forum I belong to and found the leverless arm is great for runflats and 30 series tires, but more annoying on anything with a bigger sidewall or non runflat. I figure that the machine I bought should be adequate and if I find it isn't, I will upgrade at a later date. Dave
[This message has been edited by bmwguru (edited 02-25-2015).]
