I have seen many times people try to compare the United States to other countries. Laws, economic structures, policies, etc. They usually say something like, "look this policy works here why dont you do it the same way?" If you have a thought I'd like to hear it. A reason why you think its apples and oranges to try and compare another country to the U.S., or why you think it compares just fine.
There are many reasons, from geography to history, population, climate, demographics, and many beyond that. Some are more valid when talking about a given particular topic. Maybe for example how much is spent on infrastructure?
For simple geopraphic examples Germany is smaller than the state of Texas. England, Scotland and Ireland would all fit within Texas.
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..and dont forget about Alaska
Though issues go far beyond size of course.
[This message has been edited by 2.5 (edited 09-02-2015).]
Yup. Dads side of the family is from Denmark, and over the years as they have come to visit the one thing that strikes them the most is the distances here, and all the woodland/farmland. Actually, the island dad was born on would fit inside of the Toronto. A 2-hour drive for us can be just a daily commute to work, and for them it is from one end of the country to the other.
LOL, I always threatened my uncle I was going to haul him to Alberta or Saskatchewan and teach him what "wide open" REALLY meant.
Here is an opinion from eupedia.com about a few differences in “Europe” and the U.S. related to culture (not sure on truth of these maybe someone knows)
I found it odd they think we don’t even have a “left” party.
“Government system
Americans have a "Congress", while Europeans all have "Parliaments". American politcs is chiefly curtailed to two parties, which would be center-right and right, but lack influential left-wing or green parties. It is rare for a European country to have less than 3 main parties. It is often 4 or 5, which makes politics less bipolar (but often also more complicated to reach agreements). The American police (FBI) is much more "aggressive" than the police in Europe (car chases, break into houses with guns shouting "police, don't move, hands on your head !" or such scenes almost non-existent in Europe). Suspects in the US are detained more easily and interrogated more harshly. Americans also go to court much more promptly than in Europe.
Military politics
It is prohibited in most of Europe for the military people, or anyone with a professional military history to become a politician. This means that they become politically ineligible. In the USA, the reverse is almost true. It is almost required to have a military history to become president, and quite a few Congress people have also served in the army. Maybe this is because the president's image is still strongly associated with that of the "commander in chief", and because defense (or offence) is so important in US politics.
Political correctness
Due to their great ethnic and religious diversity, Americans have developed a more acute sense of political correctness, in an attempt to attenuate frictions between the various groups. Europeans still associate very much with their place of birth with their ethnicity, language and culture. In fact, until recently, adjectives for language, ethnic group and nationality would often match (with notable exceptions, like Belgium and Switzerland). In the US (almost) everybody has the same nationality and language, and it is ethnicities and religions that differentiate people first, hence the greater importance for respect toward other ethnicities and religions in the USA. In Europe the emphasis of respect is put on cultures and languages. Making aggressive jokes about a particular linguistic or cultural group (e.g. calling the French "cheese-eating monkies) because of the importance of cheese in French culture), for instance, is the equivalent of attacking a particular ethnic or religious group in the US. It's a big no-no. However, making fun of religions is usually quite acceptable in Europe. Written by Maciamo (last updated in May 2015)"
[This message has been edited by 2.5 (edited 09-02-2015).]
There isn't a problem comparing the US to other countries. There is a problem comparing the US to different countries and saying the US way is the right way. There are only a few places where I woudl say they do it the wrong way where personal freedoms and education are cut off from the population....like North Korea.
Heck our states ever differ on how they are governed so to that regard there is no "right way"
Although the Europeans did, at one time, have exclusive bragging rights to some extraordinary brews; the Americans now produce many beers on par with the best in the world.
There is a problem comparing the US to different countries and saying the US way is the right way.
Define "right way". I was taught that many things were right and wrong as I was growing up only to discover that now, later on in life, some in the public are saying there is no right and wrong, only shades of grey and what's right or wrong to someone may be held in the eye of the beholder based on personal preference and point of view and changing political climate.
IMHO, comparing the ways of different countries to another county is futile effort.
One must also acknowledge the differences in culture, attitude, work ethic, problems, economics and so on. To say one country's system of (______________) is better than another's is comparing apples to oranges unless all factors are considered. While there are some countries with many similarities, there are always differences. Doesn't really matter what the topic is, the other factors always come into play.
I've often said that if you're not a citizen of the US, I really couldn't care less what you think. That still holds true. That doesn't mean I wouldn't listen to suggestions but, I'm quite sure that the attitude and other factors of several will differ from mine dramatically and that has proven to be true time and time again just on this forum. Regardless of National Origin, if you're not willing to join us then keep your ass and ways home.
No country has a perfect system of anything, just cause you like yours better doesn't mean it'll work in another country/situation. I don't wish to push my ideas, values or ways on any other country so, don't push your's on me. Heck, there are huge differences right here in the US among the states, but, that wasn't the focus of this thread. Picking on some states is too easy anyway.
------------------ Ron
Isn't it strange that after a bombing, everyone blames the bomber, his upbringing, his environment, his culture, his mental state but … after a shooting, the problem is the gun?
My Uncle Frank was a staunch Conservative and voted straight Republican until the day he died in Chicago. Since then he has voted Democrat. Shrug
[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 09-02-2015).]
I'm not surprised that you were the first responder to my post. Kind of expected it actually. To answer your question, yeah, my statement pretty much sums it up. To say everything is too all inclusive but, as I said, I'm open to listening but, you see situations through a different filter than I do.
Isn't it strange that after a bombing, everyone blames the bomber, his upbringing, his environment, his culture, his mental state but … after a shooting, the problem is the gun?
My Uncle Frank was a staunch Conservative and voted straight Republican until the day he died in Chicago. Since then he has voted Democrat. Shrug
I've often said that if you're not a citizen of the US, I really couldn't care less what you think. That still holds true. That doesn't mean I wouldn't listen to suggestions but, I'm quite sure that the attitude and other factors of several will differ from mine dramatically and that has proven to be true time and time again just on this forum. Regardless of National Origin, if you're not willing to join us then keep your ass and ways home.
Are you sure you really mean "us" and not just "me and maybe my buddies"? Based on what I've seen you write here and on what I've heard other US citizens I know say over the years I've been living here, there are plenty of US citizens that don't share your points of view. What about those people?
quote
Originally posted by blackrams:No country has a perfect system of anything, just cause you like yours better doesn't mean it'll work in another country/situation.
100% agreed. However, it does make sense to study what has been done elsewhere and consider it IMO.
More than anything it surprises me that anyone would admit to having their head stuck so deep in the sand. And no, that's not being said as an insult. There's a whole wide world out there full of people with different ideas and experiences and perspectives... and to "care less" what they might think seems to me to be, if nothing else... a waste of resources, a waste of opportunity, a waste of knowledge.
quote
Originally posted by blackrams:
I've often said that if you're not a citizen of the US, I really couldn't care less what you think.
More than anything it surprises me that anyone would admit to having their head stuck so deep in the sand. And no, that's not being said as an insult. There's a whole wide world out there full of people with different ideas and experiences and perspectives... and to "care less" what they might think seems to me to be, if nothing else... a waste of resources, a waste of opportunity, a waste of knowledge.
[QUOTE]Originally posted by blackrams:
I've often said that if you're not a citizen of the US, I really couldn't care less what you think.
Patrick, I don't advise the Canadians what they should or shouldn't be doing, why is it so important to you that we listen to someone who is not one of us. The US is constantly being criticized for what we do or don't do, what we think or don't think. As I said, I'm open to listening or reading about other country's processes, policies and ways of doing things but, for some reason, the US ways are not sufficient. I really don't care what or how Canadians run their country unless it effects the US. I do realize that what the US does can effect a lot of other counties but, what we do internally is our business.
If Canucks don't like guns, so be it, I'm sure as hell not going to force any Canuck to buy one. It's your country, run it as you see fit. I don't agree with a lot of the ways of Middle Eastern countries but, as long as they don't try to force their ways upon us, it's their country.
------------------ Ron
Isn't it strange that after a bombing, everyone blames the bomber, his upbringing, his environment, his culture, his mental state but … after a shooting, the problem is the gun?
My Uncle Frank was a staunch Conservative and voted straight Republican until the day he died in Chicago. Since then he has voted Democrat. Shrug
[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 09-02-2015).]
I don't advise the Canadians what they should or shouldn't be doing, why is it so important to you that we listen to someone who is not one of us. The US is constantly being criticized for what we do or don't do, what we think or don't think. As I said, I'm open to listening or reading about other country's processes, policies and ways of doing things but, for some reason, the US ways are not sufficient. I really don't care what or how Canadians run their country unless it effects the US. I do realize that what the US does can effect a lot of other counties but, what we do internally is our business.
If Canucks don't like guns, so be it, I'm sure as hell not going to force any Canuck to buy one. It's your country, run it as you see fit. I don't agree with a lot of the ways of Middle Eastern countries but, as long as they don't try to force their ways upon is, it's their country.
Ron, did you actually read what I posted HERE (short as it was)... or have you just jumped to conclusions and focused entirely on whatever it is you've just ranted on?
Ron, did you actually read what I posted HERE (short as it was)... or have you just jumped to conclusions and focused entirely on whatever it is you've just ranted on?
Patrick, I have read each and every word you have posted in this thread. I believe I have responded accordingly.
------------------ Ron
Isn't it strange that after a bombing, everyone blames the bomber, his upbringing, his environment, his culture, his mental state but … after a shooting, the problem is the gun?
My Uncle Frank was a staunch Conservative and voted straight Republican until the day he died in Chicago. Since then he has voted Democrat. Shrug
It must be a language thing then. To me the word "anything" entails a helluva lot more than simply internal American affairs.
Your interpretation is correct and yes, "anything" does encompass much more than internal issues but, I followed up by focusing on internal. I'm relatively confident there will be other things.
------------------ Ron
Isn't it strange that after a bombing, everyone blames the bomber, his upbringing, his environment, his culture, his mental state but … after a shooting, the problem is the gun?
My Uncle Frank was a staunch Conservative and voted straight Republican until the day he died in Chicago. Since then he has voted Democrat. Shrug
Does it make sense to repeatedly reconsider policies that have routinely failed elsewhere?
An intelligent person would probably consider the ones that work. But are you saying that there are no successful policies on anything anywhere outside the US?
[This message has been edited by yellowstone (edited 09-03-2015).]
Heck, there are huge differences right here in the US among the states, but, that wasn't the focus of this thread. Picking on some states is too easy anyway.
Well it does fit, and kind of is. We have alot of variety here and that makes a difference when comparing to a smaller country where there may be alot less difference of culture or opinion.
An intelligent person would probably consider the ones that work. But are you saying that there are no successful policies on anything anywhere outside the US?
Thats another aspect, people arent the same. It may work for someone but not for me. It may be tolerable for me, but cramped, unhappy, smothered, limited. But that same environment may be thoroughly enjoyed by someone else. I'm speaking figuratively, not just about land area.
[This message has been edited by 2.5 (edited 09-03-2015).]
I dont see it like that. Maybe some do. Like pokey said this country was set up with all the failures of past civilizations in mind. I think of today as citizens living life with their eyes open and aware of there freedoms and aware of other countries. When a citizen of another country says "hey we have a better system over here you guys should be doing this", it doesnt take long for me to recall all the drawbacks to that system, and also to see in my head and draw conclusions about how that system wont work the same here ans it does there. To claim its just people here with their head stuck in the sand is too shallow of a way of looking at it.
Also consider these folks posting may have a history on PFF with the individuals they are responding to. Notice how gun control came up real quick, and how both of you said you were not surprised who popped up, or "baited", etc? My guess is a stranger may get a more appealing answer, since the person responding wouldnt be assuming so much.
[This message has been edited by 2.5 (edited 09-03-2015).]
The problem is cherry picking individual policies that are part of of MUCH larger ecosystem and trying to implement 1 or 2 that are really out of place without the rest of the supporting policies. The culture here is not conducive to implementing all of the underlying stuff that makes the big stuff go, but the politicians here want to implement the big stuff regardless. It's a recipe for failure. Round peg into a square hole if you will.
Originally posted by blackrams: Patrick, I don't advise the Canadians what they should or shouldn't be doing, why is it so important to you that we listen to someone who is not one of us. The US is constantly being criticized for what we do or don't do, what we think or don't think. As I said, I'm open to listening or reading about other country's processes, policies and ways of doing things but, for some reason, the US ways are not sufficient. I really don't care what or how Canadians run their country unless it effects the US. I do realize that what the US does can effect a lot of other counties but, what we do internally is our business.
If Canucks don't like guns, so be it, I'm sure as hell not going to force any Canuck to buy one. It's your country, run it as you see fit. I don't agree with a lot of the ways of Middle Eastern countries but, as long as they don't try to force their ways upon us, it's their country.
Personally I could care less about what people in the US are doing - and quite frankly we have enough of our own problems here in Canada that we should be dealing with first vs going around telling someone else what they should or should not be doing (and I wish a particular group would layoff the "dirty oil" garbage, especially when going off some lame 2nd hand info or becuase it is the "in thing" to do) - specifically all those so called celebrities that fly/drive around the planet burning fuel - I have yet to actually see just one put their money where their mouth is).
...and - hey I like guns too, it just sucks some of our "rules" are so restrictive...but we have the Liberals to blame for that...
[This message has been edited by Mickey_Moose (edited 09-03-2015).]
That's fine. You opened up the topic for discussion, and I gave my opinion.
I'm not sure if it's arrogance, or insecurity, or a mixture of both... but IMO it's obvious from some of the responses just in this thread alone that many Americans are not open to new ideas. And no, I'm not referring to some fictional scenario where an outsider insists... "Do it this way!"
For decades the US has been a powerhouse on the world's stage, not simply due to military might, but due to upholding what were perceived as noble principles. I fear the US is now beginning to crumble from within. And instead of its citizens pulling together to help stop this decline, we see nothing but finger-pointing... blaming liberals, blaming conservatives, blaming foreigners.
I don't want to see the US fall into disarray. Our two countries are inextricably entwined. If the US were to fail, it would obviously effect Canada in a drastic manner.
So yeah, I guess you could say that I have an interest in American affairs... for good reason!
[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 09-03-2015).]
That's fine. You opened up the topic for discussion, and I gave my opinion.
I'm not sure if it's arrogance, or insecurity, or a mixture of both... but IMO it's obvious from some of the responses just in this thread alone that many Americans are not open to new ideas. And no, I'm not referring to some fictional scenario where an outsider insists... "Do it this way!"
For decades the US has been a powerhouse on the world's stage, not simply due to military might, but due to upholding what were perceived as noble principles. I fear the US in now beginning to crumble from within. And instead of its citizens pulling together to help stop this decline, we see nothing but finger-pointing... blaming liberals, blaming conservatives, blaming foreigners.
I don't want to see the US fall into disarray. Our two countries are inextricably entwined. If the US were to fail, it would obviously effect Canada in a drastic manner.
So yeah, I guess you could say that I have an interest in American affairs... for good reason!
Pat, awesome post and I couldn't agree more. I've said it before that when the rubber meets the road, Canada is our greatest ally. Together we are an economic powerhouse like the world has never seen. Imagine the resources we hold. Far, far above the rest of the world. I think the US and Canada should work together more.
Canada is our greatest ally. Together we are an economic powerhouse like the world has never seen. Imagine the resources we hold. Far, far above the rest of the world. I think the US and Canada should work together more.
I don't know if all Americans are aware that it's not China, but it's Canada that is the #1 trading partner of the USA.
Obviously with 10x the population of Canada, the US holds a lot more influence, but it's a mutually beneficial association for both countries that we don't want to see jeopardized through any type of economic collapse.
