It took three years........THREE YEARS.......to get this POS out the door!
Back story:
This guy has been kicked out of every press room area in the plant. He's cussed out management, employees, and shuts his machine down an hour early every day to walk around till time to go home. He then also sexually harassed a female by grabbing her butt. What'd management do? Nothing
Within the last three years he's been in jail for minor things, but also beating his girlfriend twice. He found a quack doctor and claimed a "disorder" for beating the crap out of her. He gets fifteen days a year vacation, but the quack doc gave him meds and two days off per month to take when needed and would be covered under FMLA. He bragged about how much he gets away with and claimed to be untouchable.
He bragged so much other employees started ragging him. His reaction......go to the doc and got five days off per month just to spite everyone and spit in their faces. That is sixty days extra paid vacation a year!!!! Employees started going to management to complain and demanding them to do something. Their response....."he's covered under FMLA and we can't do anything". Really? This guy played the system so good for the three years, but finally it caught up to him and he slipped. He married the girl he beat up a couple months back and recently he beat her again and was incarcerated once more. Funny thing is he was off on FMLA when this happened. He couldn't call work on Monday. They got him on "no call, no show".
When management was confronted on doing something the reply was "our hands are tied". WTH? How is your hands tied? They had plenty of proof of shutting his machines down early along with other complaints/issues yet nothing was done. One simple no call, no show did the trick? I know they wanted to get rid of him, but were so afraid of a lawsuit........WHY?
Cost of litigation for unjust firing due to discrimination. At one time my wife had a Director (female) that enjoyed the same immunity. Long lunches, off every Monday, verbally abusive, plagiarism, claiming credit for other person's work and ideas, just about anything you can imagine. She would not give a good yearly review to anyone other than her own race. The international corporation couldn't do anything because of minority and religious activist groups interjecting. It was all a part of the Diversity program. Finally, the solution was to make the woman a department of only 1 person and it was placed in her HR records that she would never have anyone working under her. They eventually offered her an buyout for early retirement.
I just don't get why companies go out of their way to avoid a situation. I understand the whole "lawsuit " thing, but come on. Employers shouldn't have to fear firing a worthless employee.
As someone asked in a different thread: "Shouldn't a company have the right to hire and fire who they want and choose the kind of employee they want?" Yes, they "should" but in this age of entitlement, mambybambyism, and social activism by Govt-they no longer have those options. Look back over the months and years, just at the threads here in OT that list puzzy complaints by people about their employers.....this kind of thing has been coming for years.
[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 11-08-2015).]
As someone asked in a different thread: Shouldn't a company have the right to hire and fire who they want and choose the kind of employee they want?" Yes, they "should" but in this age of entitlement, mambybambyism, and social activism by Govt-they no longer have those options.
Sure, I can agree to that, but I'm sure they didn't really want to keep him. They only kept him outa fear.
Fear of the govt, and fear of those who would call in the alphabet agencies, and there are some of those same people right here--they've bragged they did it in the past. Most don't have a pot to pizz in or a window to throw it out of that doesn't belong to someone else, much less be able to start their own business or even run one. Most are lucky to be able to stay employed for 12 consecutive months in the same company, then cry like little girls that it is all someone else' fault.
Worthless employees come from all racial backgrounds.
Just look at 'Wally' in the 'Dilbert' cartoons for lessons on how this type operates.
They become untouchable for a number of reasons. They are 'whistle blowers', have some sort of job related stress or some other reason for being worthless. They exist and thrive in large organizations.
A guy like that is pretty easy to get rid of ( at least here). Document him not being at the machine inclund time- stamped pics, go thru the 3 escalating warnings and show him the door. Then again he wouldn't BE at work up here, he would be on a "stress leave" and on vacation somewhere. I do realize labour laws are very different from here to there so if the company didn't go that route then it probably wouldn't fly there. I never had to go that far, The 2 I had to get rid of over the years I just start nit- picking their work, point out every flaw for a couple weeks ( documented) then give them a " day off" on a Friday to " prctice Thierry skills and bring them up to standards". They don't come back on Monday.
Politcally Correct crowd wont allow anything to discriminate against any minorities. They could avoid problems by simply NOT hiring them in the first place, but thats also discrimination. Damned if you do and damned if you dont. White is no problem, they can be fired on a whim. I dont like Joes yellow shirt, give him his pink slip.
Union shop (at least the ones I've worked for) Wouldn't do much for that guy either. Where the unions are handy is for putting " entitled" companies and bosses back in their place. They can't do much about gross negligence or incompetence.
When I say "entitled" company or employer I mean the kind of jerk that will hire you to build a garden shed, they supply material, and its to be done Mon-Fri 8am to 5pm. By day 2 they want a fence built too (for free), by day 3 they are pestering you about the job 24 hours a day (btw they are mislim so ya cant have cxxxxx food on the project, and by day 4 it turns out they only bought 1/2 the materials and want you to go buy the rest for them. That's about the point I tell them to shove their shed and go tell all my contracting buddies not to bother with this jerkwad. In a case like that the union can be a great help..... But if I just start leaving the job at 2 pm then nope they won't do squat for me
The best one I've seen in my lifetime happened back in the mid 70's thru mid 80's. I worked at Chrysler Engineering HQ located in Highland Park, MI at the time. There was a "Buffer" - young black man assigned to the experimental Chrome Plating Lab. This guy wasn't bright, but he did his job pretty good, but would slack off when he wasn't getting his way, and keep pressing his management for more money. Over a period of about 8 years they kept advancing him, because nobody liked the guy's attitude, so he was passed from Department to Department until he reached status of Specialist Engineer ( A Category they typically pigeon hole people in, to prevent further movement up the chain). Now you have to keep in mind this guy didn't have a degree, and was not self taught or learning from others around him.
Finally they had had enough and fired the guy because he couldn't perform the job of satisfying Management with his investigation/studies. So this guy gets a hold of an Attorney, who also gets a NAACP type person involved, and files suit against Chrysler. The case was settled for the employee, and was awarded 2.5 Million Dollars, which was a hell of a lot of money back in the mid 80's.
So you see, things haven't changed much. Employers are still faced with the same problems today as then, only they've become more of a problem extending to more minority groups. Employers in many case have resorted to hiring "Contract Workers" going through "Job Shops" to help minimize their exposure to law suits, as some more tricky words are added to the employment contract to shield them. In "direct hire" situations Employers are screwed when it involves a minority worker who just isn't cutting it.
This situation is extremely unfair to all workers who demonstrate progression in their job skills, because there are many of these minority issues that take away money from those non-minority who are entitled a raise or promotion.
Today, it is almost like you have to commit a criminal act at work to lose your job. There are many safe guards in place to assure the worker is treated fairly. For example, getting hurt on the job assures you will still have a job and compensated for medical and time off if needed. Do people take advantage of this? Yes, they do.
But, most people like you are good workers and do not take advantage of the system. Within an group you are going to have slackers. People like you described.
Most of the things you described were out of work, but most certainly there were incidents at work. The best you can do is document and report. Write the incidents down on paper, with a date, time, and give a copy to your employer and keep a copy for yourself. You are basically creating a diary.
Nothing scares another more, including your employer, is when you say. "I have everything documented". That way when you go to a hearing or before management you have a notebook of dates and times, and things people said. Rather then just venting emotion, you are providing factual information and about infractions.
The girl you described that was sexually harassed should have notified management, if not the police. That is a huge problem, and possible, because it happened in the workplace, grounds for litigation, mainly against the employer. If management did not react, or investigate she can claim a hostile work environment. Even if the person is a minority it does not matter. Documentation and witnesses, are important, other people present who can support your facts.
This is the bottom line, real simple, no BS-answer. If you are a minority, or special interest group... it is much more difficult for you to get fired.
This is due to a fear of lawsuits. If you are a white male, and have no prior medical conditions, you can be fired easily. There are dozens of law groups that specialize in "wrongful termination" lawsuits. It is sometimes easier to keep a person on the books, and make them do menial tasks, than it is to face a lawsuit and have to settle. Companies will usually lose because often times the companies do not do a good job of cataloging the problems, or showing that they gave adequate feedback... and usually this feedback isn't given because they're scared to criticize.
Finally, when they DO get rid of them (those they typically cannot fire), they do so in a way that seems general or inconspicuous. This can often be in the form of a group layoff. Believe it or not... a company is sometimes willing to fire two other employees that are "not their best" just so that they can get rid of a single employee. They stage a "layoff" and come up with a reasoning... IE: we are going in a different direction, or... we are not meeting our goals in this area. The other two people will typically be white males, or at the very least, white. They do this so that if it does become challenged, they can just say that it was a layoff due to company restructuring. For the record, I have never been laid off this way, but I have seen it happen at a few companies.
I have worked for many unscrupulous folks. It is a disease, Think about how easy it is to spot. Perhaps my radar is tuned in due to the society that I have lived in, but you can see laziness if you look for it. It is EVERYWHERE. "It takes a lot of hard work and thinking to get out of hard work and thinking." This is the way.
When I look down at my hands, I see 43 years of weathering, broken bones, scars, and current scars to be. We now are a nation (notion) of tendonitis of the thumbs.
Yes, and it's not that complicated. Fear of litigation, and bad publicity.
Litigation possibly, but if they are running an honsest company and tespectibg staff and customers there should be little fear of publicity. OTOH if they are screwing over everybody in sight then they are just getting what's coming to them.
Let me get this straight. He sexually harassed another employee and she didn't file charges against him or threaten the company with a lawsuit for creating a hostile work environment?
Let me get this straight. He sexually harassed another employee and she didn't file charges against him or threaten the company with a lawsuit for creating a hostile work environment?
She did go to management and nothing was done. She too has taken months off with FMLA ( playing the system ).
[This message has been edited by kyunderdawg (edited 11-08-2015).]
Originally posted by RotrexFiero: Nothing scares another more, including your employer, is when you say. "I have everything documented". That way when you go to a hearing or before management you have a notebook of dates and times, and things people said. Rather then just venting emotion, you are providing factual information and about infractions.
My friend documents everything daily from his machines and has a huge file waiting for "the day".
Finally, when they DO get rid of them (those they typically cannot fire), they do so in a way that seems general or inconspicuous. This can often be in the form of a group layoff. Believe it or not... a company is sometimes willing to fire two other employees that are "not their best" just so that they can get rid of a single employee. They stage a "layoff" and come up with a reasoning... IE: we are going in a different direction, or... we are not meeting our goals in this area. The other two people will typically be white males, or at the very least, white. They do this so that if it does become challenged, they can just say that it was a layoff due to company restructuring. For the record, I have never been laid off this way, but I have seen it happen at a few companies.
My Plant has done this before. We lost more than a fair share of good workers due to getting rid of the trash.
We lost 4 white operators this year alone. They were rightfully fired too. Two for heavy scrap rates, one caught smoking just outside the building (in between cycles of machine), and one for attendance issues.
The POS that finally got cut was on his third "last chance" write up.
[This message has been edited by kyunderdawg (edited 11-08-2015).]
No, Steve, it is not. Other than this type of issue they've been pretty good to work for and haven't needed a union to keep management off our backs. So far, so good I guess. Anything can happen though.
I have gone up against the US DOL before. It took nine months and a stack of paper six inches high, to justify the termination of a completely worthless employee. The first letter I got from the feds essentially said, "You might as well give up now, save yourself a lot of trouble and offer him his job back with back pay." We won.
I have gone up against the US DOL before. It took nine months and a stack of paper six inches high, to justify the termination of a completely worthless employee. The first letter I got from the feds essentially said, "You might as well give up now, save yourself a lot of trouble and offer him his job back with back pay." We won.
They only kept him outa fear. 
Perhaps my radar is tuned in due to the society that I have lived in, but you can see laziness if you look for it. It is EVERYWHERE. "It takes a lot of hard work and thinking to get out of hard work and thinking." This is the way. 
