But I do recommend putting a towel or blanket under the nose in case you do jack it up a little too high. You won't end up scraping the paint that way.
[This message has been edited by Toddster (edited 02-01-2012).]
Just wanted to add some notes from my own recent experience.
First, my electric impact gun is my best friend for jobs like these. I was worried about having trouble with the cradle bolts as I live in Canada and even though the car doesn't have much rust, it doesn't take much for bolts to sieze up. I started a week earlier soaking the cradle bolts in 'deep creep', my favorite penetrating oil. I used my impact gun to break all of the bolts loose, and although one of the rear bolts started spinning, the impact gun was able to get it free enough that I just used a 9/16 wrench above the head of the bolt and a rachet to finish working it loose. Obviously I will need to get that welded up again but it didn't prolong the job of removing the engine. Without the impact gun, I doubt I would have gotten anywhere without cutting the frame open. The gun I have I bought for <$100 and it has the ability to adjust the torque from 70-350 ft-lbs. This is one tool that I recommend buying if you do not have access to an air compressor. In Canada they go on sale once in a while for that price at Canadian Tire. They're normally priced at about $250 though IIRC.
Second, because I'm cheap and didn't want to build a cart for dropping the cradle onto, I opted instead to drop the cradle right onto the legs of the lift. It worked beautifully and as soon as the car was high enough, I rested the car on two jack stands that were on some wood I stacked up. As a back-up, in case the jack stands tilted, I also placed the two rear wheels under the car as added protection. For me, this made the job much more simple and I was able to accomplish the job in 3 1/2 hours by myself, first try.
Some pics of how I did it:
Hope this helps someone else with their future engine removal!
I've done this on a couple West coast cars, which have had no rust... and we were able to get the cradle bolts out with just 1/2" drive ratchets and some muscle. I pity those who aren't so lucky.
Also, I'll add in yet another vote for the GM FSM version of lifting the car - do so with the jacks and a big section of wood, it's a lot easier to get things aligned later. Alternatively, a friend and I once took a slightly longer route, and took the rear bumper fascia off, and lifted the car by the rear bumper attachment points using some heavy lifting straps and an engine hoist. Longer, but makes lifting and lowering the car easier. I still advocate the floor jack and wood method.
Well no, using the trunk latch isn't the right way to do it. I was just talking with someone who did have the whole latch section tear out and the car fell! (Yes they were doing it carefully and on a perfectly rust free trunk). FFS, don't do it unless you really don't care about your car and possible injuries. Now that I've said that, go ahead and do it anyway.
I'll proceed to do it skitime's way (a.k.a. the factory manual way, i.e. the right way). Great post though. I've had this bookmarked since the beginning and I'm finally breaking my cradle bolts loose today. I hope to have the engine out this weekend!
Yeah i would not recommend using the trunk latch my ripped out and almost took my friends head with it. Atleast i know he can move fast enough to dodge a bullet. Latch flew across my garage and stuck in the wall. So once again do not do this.
First, my electric impact gun is my best friend for jobs like these...... Second, because I'm cheap and didn't want to build a cart for dropping the cradle onto, I opted instead to drop the cradle right onto the legs of the lift.
BOTH are great tips...But I doubt you are as cheap as you think, I'll bet the impact gun set you back a few bucks.
Originally posted by chanoric: Yeah i would not recommend using the trunk latch my ripped out and almost took my friends head with it. Atleast i know he can move fast enough to dodge a bullet. Latch flew across my garage and stuck in the wall. So once again do not do this.
Thanks for posting it. Like I said in the beginning each car is different and although I have lifted cars with the engine in them by the latch with no incident, rust belt people are more likely to be leary of this technique. But you are the first person I have heard who actually had a failure so I will mention it in an edit.
I sent you an email request for a copy of the current Word /PDF document.
Here's a tip I heard from a local Fiero owner/mechanic (I haven't tried it yet, but it sure makes sense): To get a bit more ground clearance and added safety when working under a Fiero, jack-up the front end and put a set of old rims (with tires left on and outside face of rims facing down on the floor) underneath the front two wheels. This helps to raise the car a couple of inches and act like wheel chocks to prevent the car from rolling in any direction. Smaller size old rims (13"?) with tires may help to raise the car a bit higher and are available from wreckers fairly cheap.
I sent you an email request for a copy of the current Word /PDF document.
Here's a tip I heard from a local Fiero owner/mechanic (I haven't tried it yet, but it sure makes sense): To get a bit more ground clearance and added safety when working under a Fiero, jack-up the front end and put a set of old rims (with tires left on and outside face of rims facing down on the floor) underneath the front two wheels. This helps to raise the car a couple of inches and act like wheel chocks to prevent the car from rolling in any direction. Smaller size old rims (13"?) with tires may help to raise the car a bit higher and are available from wreckers fairly cheap.
WOW, good tip!
That made me think of another one. I noticed that the donut spare has a hole in the middle. Put the donut spare on when you need to remove the hub nut on the half shafts. Then you don't have to dick around trying to keep the transmission from spinning when you undo the 200ft/lbs of torque to get it off (and put it back on).
Just throwing this out there again. You don't need to do anything with the nose of the car if you just use a floor jack to lift the car. I've recently dropped the cradle again using my same set up and it worked flawlessly. There should be some pictures I posted a page or so back in this thread. Use a 4x4 that fits across the bottom of the car about where the jacking points are then lift it in the center with the floor jack. It seems a lot safer then lifting by the trunk latch.
Todd, Thank you for emailing me the Fiero V6 Manual Word document so quickly! It will definitely be used for future reference and placed in my Fiero Library. I also left you well deserved positive feedback. Cheers, John
------------------ Now new owner of a Black TTop 88 Fiero GT and owner of a Silver 88 Fiero GT. Also a second time owner of an 85 Fiero GT. Bought my first fully loaded Red Fiero GT new in 1985. Fiero's are Fabulous, Fix'em and have Fun! Note, Avatar picture is Mr. Bean (not me, ha ha).
Thanks so much for spending the time to build this thread! Everything has gone great until step number 28 (removing the A/C compressor) on a charged system. I removed the lower bolt with my air ratchet, but I can't even get a standard 3/8" ratchet on those upper pivot bracket bolts. I've moved the compressor tight against the firewall and can't even see the bolts. I can get my box-end on the one closest to the engine, by feel, but no room to loosen it. You did it, so please share the secret, because I've tried everything and can't get to them!
If you just need to take out the engine and transmission, remove the decklid, unbolt everything, then use a 5 foot long pry-bar to pop out the rear axles and then lift the engine and transmission right out the top.
For stubborn bolts, we used my dad's impact wrench. That thing can snap the lugs right off a semi truck!
An Overhead crane system with multiple chains-falls works great for putting everything back together. The only hard part is getting my dad to let us use it!
would lifting this way but using lengths of chain with grade 8 bolts through it for master links work well or will it be too much stress for bolts to take? hell i may not even have enough bolts around for that. i was going to go with the latch method but am leery of it now ya can never be too safe, can i get that word doc also?
that's a neat idea, but i've never seen those holes on any car. and they look like they were made with a holesaw. i'm going to guess they were added. but it's still a really cool lifting point.
My 88 has those exact holes and I've looked at a bunch of fieros at pick'npull and they seem to have them too.
1st, thanks again for creating the step by step, I doubt I would have attempted it without it. There are a couple minor differences I have noticed, but nothing to hold you up if you use your 'noggin.
the parking brake on an 88 is different, but when you crawl under there, you'll see what to do
also there are two wires to the AC unit that are not mentioned in the step by step, these are located on the opposite end of the two wire connector
[This message has been edited by ZaraSpOOk (edited 11-21-2012).]
Thanks so much for creating this guide - absolutely amazing work! I was interested in printing it out for reference, and so I created a new PDF version - available here: Removing a V6 Engine by the Numbers - by Toddster.pdf
[This message has been edited by omninate (edited 09-26-2014).]
Great job guys. Toddster incredible write up. I am a new first time Fiero owner and began doing a head gasket job. Now finding out the proper way to get it done the right way. I have the top half of the motor out but I am still going to try and do this so I can check and clean up anything that needs attention. Besides my muffler is shot so this will make it easier. Nate great job on putting it all together in a great format. Just printed it off at work and in color it looks great!
[This message has been edited by medic880 (edited 10-09-2014).]
Sorry to necropost, but I just dropped my engine with this guide, and it made life much simpler! Even though I have a 4cyl, thing were close enough that anyone with any business taking out an engine can figure it out quickly. Thanks!
Thanks for the pdf link! I have been away for a while dealing with life. Just wanted to drop in and say hi to everyone. I have a new email address that is now linked to my profile so feel free to email if you have any questions.
I always fear that photo's will be lost with broken links and such. I just submitted this thread to the WayBack Machine. It saved the thread, and it will be available, pictures and all forever, should something ever happen to this thread Link to the saved thread
Thanks for posting this. Using this method this week to swap my motor out. Taking my time as I only have a couple of hours a day that I can work on the car. Thank you again.
--- AND A + to you
